Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Erronius said:

It wasn't his fault that Brad didn't have enough capital to cover basic salary costs leading up to the KS and it essentially defaulted to working for a charity.

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you don't think he maybe should have asked questions like that before jumping in? It's a KS, it's expected you show some good faith in your work when asking for other peoples money.

Upstarts almost always require people to work either for way less or nothing at times, it's the nature of the beast. I'm not even just picking on Rochelle here, it was the whole team, minus a few people... It's just he had the unique ability to draw a lot of attention to the project because of his skill set. The lack of visuals killed them. I still remember some of those class write-ups with not a single piece of art attached to it. Brutal.

"jumping in" as in joining the project, i know you're not this dense dude...

water under the bridge now, shit happens for a reason and I think the current group has a passion that didn't fully exist with the old team.

Has anyone sent Brad a link to the new site? we will support his game 100% if he gives us all access right now so we can test it

Erronius said:

So wait, he was part of the project before ever working?

What exactly is your gripe, here? Did he do nothing more than verbally commit and then do zero work because he wanted to be paid? WTF is the issue with that? It's not like he yoinked $40k from the project or anything.

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I'm not sure where the breakdown in communication here is. It could just be you and I have different opinions and expectations from people who ask for money via a KS. It's not so much an attack on one person, it just so happens that person(the artist) had an ability to generate content during the KS that would have helped generate buzz but didn't because they wanted to be paid. It's a double edged sword in that regard b/c they needed the content to get the money but some of the people who could provide the content wanted the money first. It's a terrible approach for anyone involved in a Kickstarter. It's one of a lot of reasons why the KS failed. Lots of blame to go around. I'm not attacking Rochelle, i've spoken to the guy, he's a good guy, super talented, I just think he and others back then had a bad mindset and should have known what they were getting themselves into when you ask for public donation.

So my gripe is don't join a team knowing there is no money and the plan to get money is to launch a KS unless you're willing to work for free to secure your future pay.

The guy not willing to work without compensation needs the blame because it's impossible Brad mislead the team and made a bunch of promises that led the project into a situation where the team realized they were going to end up doing a lot of work without compensation. If they had all just trusted Brad more, then maybe Brad wouldn't have been forced to steal all the money they did raise that could have paid devs. Poor poor Brad.

popsicledeath said:

The guy not willing to work without compensation needs the blame because it's impossible Brad mislead the team and made a bunch of promises that led the project into a situation where the team realized they were going to end up doing a lot of work without compensation. If they had all just trusted Brad more, then maybe Brad wouldn't have been forced to steal all the money they did raise that could have paid devs. Poor poor Brad.

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Not what I said playa! plenty of blame to go around for that KS and it starts at the top.

Erronius said:

I just don't get criticizing the guy for it, or indirectly blaming the failure of the KS on him due to a lack of art assets. From Brad's POV it should have been either pay the guy like he wanted or tell him "no thanks, we can't afford to pay you" and move the fuck on. Trying to pillory the guy for the trainwreck that has been Pantheon is just nonsensical to me.

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yea, well.. you are ignoring that I said multiple times i'm not putting it just on him. You're just taking what you want from what I'm saying and trying to build a position around it. We are going in circles on this and it's dragging in points that aren't even relevant to the conversation. Again, we disagree about what it needs to take to successfully launch a kickstarter, especially if there is no money going in.

I understand where he was coming from. It's just a flawed mindset when you're involved in a kickstarter IMO. That's all i'm saying, and that goes for the majority of the people who were involved on that team, it was just more obvious with him b/c of his skill set, that's all.

Erronius said:

I'm not ignoring it. I just don't care how many people you blame in total or how widely you spread the blame...it doesn't make the criticism of him sound any more valid to me. You could have a grocery list of faults with BradCo and I'm not suddenly going to be like "Oh, well, yeah...I guess that guy totally screwed the project up"

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this just isn't something we are going to get on the same wave lengths with.

If someone saved the audio you can listen to the angry devs who felt they were swindled by Brad. Basically he took a 6 month "salary" up front which amounted to ~45k to pay medical bills for his wife; he thought they would be getting more money from a single source... some guy with a trust fund but the trust denied the withdrawal. Brad tried to pull a fast one but it blew up in his face.

Some of you people posting with new names need to out yourself. Too many new names in this thread.