Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO
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You need to do about one level a night for a good long grind. Longer than that is too long. People need a carrot that is semi predictable with some real progress even in a single day.
The faction methods that I like are the shaman epic quest line in EQ classic. You can skip it if you want to however by a grind. The grind has been nullified at this point so you would need to make that grind better. Also I think that WoW is doing a great job with their current unlock quest lines. You can do those quest lines in a few hours however.
I would like to see a multiple zone quest line for unlocks and maybe even bonus xp rates from doing that. This promotes gameplay that isn’t just a grind. You do something impressive for a faction from a quest line and from now on those turn ins come at 1.25x xp.
The faction methods that I like are the shaman epic quest line in EQ classic. You can skip it if you want to however by a grind. The grind has been nullified at this point so you would need to make that grind better. Also I think that WoW is doing a great job with their current unlock quest lines. You can do those quest lines in a few hours however.
I would like to see a multiple zone quest line for unlocks and maybe even bonus xp rates from doing that. This promotes gameplay that isn’t just a grind. You do something impressive for a faction from a quest line and from now on those turn ins come at 1.25x xp.
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zzeris
King Turd of Shit Hill
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I agree with this but what is your grind time? What do you think is a reasonable time to gain a level? I would love a few epic quests per class and then a few general ones as well. No one wants WoW quests but a few really well done ones would improve the experience beyond grinding, camping, and grouping.
I would say a “normal night” is 3-4 hours and that’s good for a level.
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Palum
what Suineg set it to
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RobXIII
Urinal Cake Consumption King
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This is exactly why EQ2 isn't getting any new players (aside maybe from the TLE servers). People see that it would take months of grinding and spending $$$ on grandmastering their spells, and it just ensures they get no fresh players.
On the other hand, I do love, when max level and just playing around, seeing some sort of exp like progression. Rift balanced it pretty well, it was basically +1 to a stat, so the power increase was suuuper low.
Dullahan
Golden Knight of the Realm
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I see no reason why we should hope to achieve a level in a single night. If the process is fun, why do we have to set a limitation on how long it lasts?
People need to train themselves out of thinking that max level is the end all be all of the mmorpg experience.
People need to train themselves out of thinking that max level is the end all be all of the mmorpg experience.
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Don't maybe that can time gate the leveling process to make sure everyone goes at a snails pace.
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3 to 4 hours a level? WAY too fast, unless the game is going to have 100 levels.
Issue with new players and no groups? Re implement "hell" levels every 5 levels or so to bottleneck players into groupable level ranges.
There is not one-single-mechanic that should be done away with from 1999 EQ, only added onto and expanded. Like any complex system, you start chipping away at the margins of "The Vision" and the whole apparatus collapses into another wow style failed Vanguard.
Everything should be looked at through the lens of "will this encourage interdependence in the server community".
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Grim1
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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While you guys debate on how long leveling should take in this game. Remember that there is no game.
Which is true of every game still in development hell. Or are you forgetting that Star Citizen, Crowfall, Camelot Unchained, etc., also have no game atm?
The sky is blue, so what.
zzeris
King Turd of Shit Hill
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That's all and good but this game isn't based on that. It's based on leveling, gear, and eventually raids, etc. It's based on previous Brad games which focus heavily on gear, leveling, and the benefits of both. If this game actually has hell levels like some retards want? It will truly have the 20k threshold you are dying to maintain.
I know that every person likes to jerk themselves off to 36 hours per level but the reality is you aren't going to play that game.
Unless the game maxes out at level 5.
Unless the game maxes out at level 5.
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Dullahan
Golden Knight of the Realm
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Yet those things didn't prevent EQ from remaining popular, even when there was over a dozen alternatives. This argument has no basis in reality, nor does that 20k player threshold. If anything it's been the opposite for a while: the struggle to gain and retain players is hardest when people don't have something to continue working towards.
All that has to happen to shift the mmorpg experience away from end game is make the early game count. The things you achieve before max level should carry more weight, and have a very direct impact on both your ability to level, as well as your character's power at max level. Being max level alone should mean very little. If you actually have to find and earn your abilities, unlock quests and important areas, build character reputation and obtain important items that are not easily replaced, rushing to max and skipping the majority content should put you at a massive disadvantage.
There are ways to make mmorpgs fun from the start and the entire process to seem important beginning to end. Unfortunately, for too long we've had only games where end game is all that matters; and up to that point everything you did and collected was inevitably discarded and had absolutely zero bearing at the end of your journey. It was merely a means to an end. This was a lazy design, and a mistake.
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Right. And slowing the leveling down dramatically incentives all kinds of desirable game play like campaign or crafting regular upgrades and trying out different leveling spots all to increase efficiency over time.
When it’s just “9 to 13 days to max” efficiency is far Less important.
If getting to level 11 takes 2 weeks , you actually go camp that bone bladed claymore at the bottom of befallen because it’s going to make the next two weeks fighting for level 17 so much easier; etc
When it’s just “9 to 13 days to max” efficiency is far Less important.
If getting to level 11 takes 2 weeks , you actually go camp that bone bladed claymore at the bottom of befallen because it’s going to make the next two weeks fighting for level 17 so much easier; etc
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zzeris
King Turd of Shit Hill
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Unfortunately, your argument is the one that's not based on reality. Where do you think WoW and other games based their design? Off this level and gear based game. The carrot for such games is the endgame with top notch gear. You mistakenly think they didn't have certain things as a design instead of just not finishing their game. If this game has an actual endgame? Endgame gear will be better. Endgame experiences will be more epic. Endgame will be where it's at. Bubble bursting time.
The only way this doesn't happen? If Brad releases his 3rd straight unfinished game. Then you, and your 20k friends will have that slow game as the hardcore move on to a game that is better made. Because people won't grind through hell levels and empty content waiting for Brad this time.