Reacher

Chinaman889 · Jan 11, 2024

but ridiculously huge guy running around and killing dozens of people with no remorse or consequences is amazing 90s action nostalgia

Sylas said:
yeah this season is missing the whole detective/investigation angle. Literally the only thing that had to work out so far was the numbers of how many missiles were being stolen/sold to terrorists, like it fucking matters how many.

but ridiculously huge guy running around and killing dozens of people with no remorse or consequences is amazing 90s action nostalgia

If you ignore all the shitty parts about this season, Reacher being man-giant ruthless is $$$

Harshaw · Jan 11, 2024

Downhammer said:
It has all the realism and logical consistency of a good 80s/90s Schwarzenegger or Van Damme movie. I know we've been spoiled by Wick and other recent stuff but if you enjoyed those old action flicks there's no reason you can't enjoy this as well.

John Wick is not realism. He's a superhero.

Homsar · Jan 11, 2024

Chinaman889 said:
but ridiculously huge guy running around and killing dozens of people with no remorse or consequences is amazing 90s action nostalgia

If you ignore all the shitty parts about this season, Reacher being man-giant ruthless is $$$

From the novels he fits the fits the bill, Tom Cruise nailed the character but just didn't fit the size imo. I actually enjoy his Reacher breaking down how good the sniper was

rhinohelix · Jan 11, 2024

Harshaw said:
John Wick is not realism. He's a superhero.

The first movie was fairly realistic. The next few...

DickTrickle · Jan 11, 2024

I mean, even the first one wasn't that realistic. How many armed gunmen did he kill? How many times did a dude with a gun who was 10-15 feet away decide to get in close for hand to hand combat instead of firing his gun? People orgasmed because he kept track of his his bullet count and reloaded but it's only realistic in comparison to even more unrealistic movies.

Harshaw · Jan 11, 2024

DickTrickle said:
I mean, even the first one wasn't that realistic. How many armed gunmen did he kill? How many times did a dude with a gun who was 10-15 feet away decide to get in close for hand to hand combat instead of firing his gun? People orgasmed because he kept track of his his bullet count and reloaded but it's only realistic in comparison to even more unrealistic movies.

Hell, he wore a supersuit.

Burns · Jan 12, 2024

Harshaw said:
Hell, he wore a supersuit.

While you were out partying, I was studying the gunfu...

Caliane · Jan 12, 2024

gun-fu is actually the perfect example really. its all about suspension of disbelief, and making the impossible or improbable, seem believable.
and its not magic, or an accident. there are ways to explain it.

John wicks suit. we know its absurd. but, by STATING its a bulletproof suit, we can just accept it.
Equilibruim. we are told gun form is taken to a martial arts form. positions and forms to minimize target size, and maximize counter targeting efficiency and speed. we can accept it.

this first scene. running start. they shoot the hinges at the same time he jumps. bright flash. hes wearing black clothing, in the dark. sure, of course they are all going to miss. while it gives him the chance to identify all their locations, as he listens to them. what we see here is absurd really. but, given how its presented, and the skills of the character we can just accept it.

John wick 1 went through the motions to make improbably stuff seem plausible.

like in this show, "hide behind the tire". see that seems plausible.

Breakdown · Jan 12, 2024

Yeah this season has been a let down. Still much better than most modern shit but I dont know if the writers changed or what but they lost their focus. Or maybe its a new action director who is making these silly choices. Just doesnt feel right.

BrutulTM · Jan 12, 2024

rhinohelix said:
The first movie was fairly realistic.

BrutulTM · Jan 12, 2024

Caliane said:
like in this show, "hide behind the tire". see that seems plausible.

Hide behind the tire seems pretty plausible to me. It's not just the tire, the brakes and the axles are behind it, and even passing through 4 layers of rubber is probably a stretch for most bullets and the only way you would just hit tires is if you were shooting a flat trajectory about 2" off the ground which is impossible since they're shooting over a car. I think hiding behind the tire is about as good as you're going to do. Certainly a lot safer than inside the car next to the door where she was sitting for the first 300 rounds.

McQueen · Jan 12, 2024

Breakdown said:
Yeah this season has been a let down. Still much better than most modern shit but I dont know if the writers changed or what but they lost their focus. Or maybe its a new action director who is making these silly choices. Just doesnt feel right.

It does feel like they over-corrected in the action direction department for the second season so they could avoid the kind of injuries they had filming the first season. Forget which interview it was, but Alan Ritchson did say something had to change for the second season because he really beat himself up shooting the first season and required shoulder surgery.

Homsar · Jan 12, 2024

Caliane said:
gun-fu is actually the perfect example really. its all about suspension of disbelief, and making the impossible or improbable, seem believable.
and its not magic, or an accident. there are ways to explain it.

John wicks suit. we know its absurd. but, by STATING its a bulletproof suit, we can just accept it.
Equilibruim. we are told gun form is taken to a martial arts form. positions and forms to minimize target size, and maximize counter targeting efficiency and speed. we can except it.

this first scene. running start. they shoot the hinges at the same time he jumps. bright flash. hes wearing black clothing, in the dark. sure, of course they are all going to miss. while it gives him the chance to identify all their locations, as he listens to them. what we see here is absurd really. but, given how its presented, and the skills of the character we can just accept it.

John wick 1 went through the motions to make improbably stuff seem plausible.

like in this show, "hide behind the tire". see that seems plausible.

Hiding behind the tire/wheel is taught. Depending on the location of the shooter is a huge factor. The wheel is better than the engine but thats why you use both together

BrutulTM · Jan 12, 2024

Caliane said:
Equilibruim

I used to post on a message board where there was a guy who would write wall of text posts on why Equilibrium was a better movie than The Matrix in every possible way.

Breakdown · Jan 12, 2024

BrutulTM said:
I used to post on a message board where there was a guy who would write wall of text posts on why Equilibrium was a better movie than The Matrix in every possible way.

Dudes i nthe barrracks swore by that in 2003

Same dudes had bacon collars on all their uniforms, never showered, and ate taco bell on base 7 days a week

rhinohelix · Jan 13, 2024

BrutulTM said:

A better term would have been "believable", as in possible. Keanu trained in 3 gun for months and could perform on the range really well.

The rest of movies gave up on believability and made him a superhero, as everyone noted.

Mahes · Jan 13, 2024

Caliane said:
gun-fu is actually the perfect example really. its all about suspension of disbelief, and making the impossible or improbable, seem believable.
and its not magic, or an accident. there are ways to explain it.

John wicks suit. we know its absurd. but, by STATING its a bulletproof suit, we can just accept it.
Equilibruim. we are told gun form is taken to a martial arts form. positions and forms to minimize target size, and maximize counter targeting efficiency and speed. we can accept it.

this first scene. running start. they shoot the hinges at the same time he jumps. bright flash. hes wearing black clothing, in the dark. sure, of course they are all going to miss. while it gives him the chance to identify all their locations, as he listens to them. what we see here is absurd really. but, given how its presented, and the skills of the character we can just accept it.

John wick 1 went through the motions to make improbably stuff seem plausible.

like in this show, "hide behind the tire". see that seems plausible.

Way back in the day when I played Paintball, we did reenactments of building incursions. We used a trailer, a cabin, and then a small warehouse. Out of dozens of times, only one time was the person who entered any doorway not shot, either at the doorway, or at the spot they stopped once they had gone through. Nothing makes for an easier target, than knowing where a person has to come through to get to a spot. Many ideas were tried. I tried to looking in and then back out. They of course started firing and then I tried going in right after they stopped. I still got hit. There was of course the bum rush. That was awful. Just got mowed down. The only trick that did work was the sacrifice. We used the first person as a temporary shield but even then the last two people got taken out.

I could see using a stun grenade as one of the only possible ways to enter as that would at least throw off their perception long enough to maybe get in. Most of the time those doing the incursion are going to take hits if the people inside are armed and waiting.

The other thing we tried was the chase scene. This is where one person with a gun is chasing somebody else with a gun. You "Have" to fake look every corner before you go around at least once when you are chasing. The runner has a major advantage as the chaser has no clue whether they are still running or waiting. I found when I was getting chased I would wait for them to come around the corner. I would just lay down next to the wall that they were coming around. When they did the Fake, most would not even see me and so they would walk around and die. Even when they did know what I was doing, my target was a lot smaller than the target they ended up presenting me.

Gravel · Jan 13, 2024

BrutulTM said:
Hide behind the tire seems pretty plausible to me. It's not just the tire, the brakes and the axles are behind it, and even passing through 4 layers of rubber is probably a stretch for most bullets and the only way you would just hit tires is if you were shooting a flat trajectory about 2" off the ground which is impossible since they're shooting over a car. I think hiding behind the tire is about as good as you're going to do. Certainly a lot safer than inside the car next to the door where she was sitting for the first 300 rounds.

Haven't watched this season (never finished 1), but yes, hiding behind the wheel is the only safe place to hide on a vehicle. That's what they teach at Gryphon Group anyway.

I didn't watch this video all the way through, but figured I'd post it for context. I've never had more fun than quarter panel striking a vehicle being used as a roadblock or doing down driver drills (although my hip is probably fucked up from that). Pretty much everyone in SF went through there in the mid-2000's.

BrutulTM · Jan 13, 2024

Mahes said:
Way back in the day when I played Paintball, we did reenactments of building incursions. We used a trailer, a cabin, and then a small warehouse. Out of dozens of times, only one time was the person who entered any doorway not shot, either at the doorway, or at the spot they stopped once they had gone through. Nothing makes for an easier target, than knowing where a person has to come through to get to a spot. Many ideas were tried. I tried to looking in and then back out. They of course started firing and then I tried going in right after they stopped. I still got hit. There was of course the bum rush. That was awful. Just got mowed down. The only trick that did work was the sacrifice. We used the first person as a temporary shield but even then the last two people got taken out.

I could see using a stun grenade as one of the only possible ways to enter as that would at least throw off their perception long enough to maybe get in. Most of the time those doing the incursion are going to take hits if the people inside are armed and waiting.

The other thing we tried was the chase scene. This is where one person with a gun is chasing somebody else with a gun. You "Have" to fake look every corner before you go around at least once when you are chasing. The runner has a major advantage as the chaser has no clue whether they are still running or waiting. I found when I was getting chased I would wait for them to come around the corner. I would just lay down next to the wall that they were coming around. When they did the Fake, most would not even see me and so they would walk around and die. Even when they did know what I was doing, my target was a lot smaller than the target they ended up presenting me.

Probably why real cops aren't as eager to go storming into a building as the ones on TV are.

Burns · Jan 13, 2024

BrutulTM said:
Probably why real cops aren't as eager to go storming into a building as the ones on TV are.

The game Police Quest: SWAT taught me to mirror doors and slice the pie. I was ready to take rooms before I even graduated High School!

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Reacher

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