Science!! Fucking magnets, how do they work?

  • Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!



    Go here and give us your nominations!
    Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
ToeMissile

ToeMissile

Pronouns: zie/zhem/zer
<Gold Donor>
3,312
2,169
I remember hearing about the sterilization via gene alteration.

Moral concerns are low for me but I get not wanting to jump to insect genocide.
Ecological reproductions are definitely the larger concern. Though I recall reading/hearing about some study where they tried to figure out what the impact would be. They weren’t able to find anything that I recall.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
ToeMissile

ToeMissile

Pronouns: zie/zhem/zer
<Gold Donor>
3,312
2,169
Deathwing said:
I think I was making the assumption that if we were to go to the (monumental?) trouble of producing a genetically altered mosquito, it would be a solution that's at least an order of magnitude more effective than current ones.

If we have to frequently reintroduce the genetic vector, isn't that somewhat similar to just spraying? I'll admit, I don't know how much horny mosquitos get around. Maybe the coverage area of a fertile mosquito is much larger than spraying.
Click to expand...
I’m fairly sure they already created modified mosquito
 
Cad

Cad

scientia potentia est
<Bronze Donator>
25,843
50,761
Deathwing said:
I think I was making the assumption that if we were to go to the (monumental?) trouble of producing a genetically altered mosquito, it would be a solution that's at least an order of magnitude more effective than current ones.

If we have to frequently reintroduce the genetic vector, isn't that somewhat similar to just spraying? I'll admit, I don't know how much horny mosquitos get around. Maybe the coverage area of a fertile mosquito is much larger than spraying.
Click to expand...
The delay in activation of the genes seems like the key. Naturally occurring diseases have (so far) either been pretty minor or very hard to spread - the ones that kill effectively are hard to spread or else they'd end their hosts. An artificially made disease (thats what this is) that waits 50 generations before it gets activated? And we can re-infect the survivors with it afterwards? It would be a bloodbath.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
47,937
82,627
Deathwing said:
I think I was making the assumption that if we were to go to the (monumental?) trouble of producing a genetically altered mosquito, it would be a solution that's at least an order of magnitude more effective than current ones.

If we have to frequently reintroduce the genetic vector, isn't that somewhat similar to just spraying? I'll admit, I don't know how much horny mosquitos get around. Maybe the coverage area of a fertile mosquito is much larger than spraying.
Click to expand...
I'm no expert but I imagine it'd be similar to the vaccine industry. A constant arms race of creating new armies of genetically modified mosquito bombs. They enter a mosquito population, wipe out some species within a certain area, die out and that space is filled by another species of something. The goal is to target species that are likely to carry certain diseases. So you theoretically end up with a safer mosquito population.

Kind of like how we spray weed killer on our lawns. We don't end up with a landscape that has no vegetation on it, we end up with a landscape with grass that won't give us malaria.


Personally I'd be happy with going a few extra steps further and using any means necessary to eradicate any worthless ass mosquito even if it meant genetic bombs being deployed in my backyard every month.
 
Aldarion

Aldarion

Egg Nazi
9,976
27,494
The mosquito eradication plans are pretty far along in terms of trying different approaches.

In this thread people have expressed curiousity how engineering a less fit mosquito would work, supposing that they'd just be outcompeted by the more fit wild relatives. Its a reasonable objection. The strategies they're trying are a bit more complex than that.

They're generally sex specific. For example, approaches include
  • Rearing and sterilizing large numbers of male mosquitos which then mate with wild mosquitos resulting in no offspring.
  • Modifying the genes so that distorted sex ratios (almost all male) are produced.
  • Modifying the bacterial symbiont Wolbachia (present in all mosquitoes like most insects) so that crosses between mosquitoes with wild-type Wolbachia and modified Wolbachia produce no offspring.

Only the first of these relies on repeated introductions, the others can lead to self sustaining declines in the populations.

Good info here if anyone wants to read more
www.sciencedirect.com

More than one rabbit out of the hat: Radiation, transgenic and symbiont-based approaches for sustainable management of mosquito and tsetse fly populations

Mosquitoes (Diptera: Culicidae) and tsetse flies (Diptera: Glossinidae) are bloodsucking vectors of human and animal pathogens. Mosquito-borne disease…
www.sciencedirect.com www.sciencedirect.com
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
47,937
82,627
Aldarion said:
The mosquito eradication plans are pretty far along in terms of trying different approaches.

In this thread people have expressed curiousity how engineering a less fit mosquito would work, supposing that they'd just be outcompeted by the more fit wild relatives. Its a reasonable objection. The strategies they're trying are a bit more complex than that.

They're generally sex specific. For example, approaches include
  • Rearing and sterilizing large numbers of male mosquitos which then mate with wild mosquitos resulting in no offspring.
  • Modifying the genes so that distorted sex ratios (almost all male) are produced.
  • Modifying the bacterial symbiont Wolbachia (present in all mosquitoes like most insects) so that crosses between mosquitoes with wild-type Wolbachia and modified Wolbachia produce no offspring.

Only the first of these relies on repeated introductions, the others can lead to self sustaining declines in the populations.

Good info here if anyone wants to read more
www.sciencedirect.com

More than one rabbit out of the hat: Radiation, transgenic and symbiont-based approaches for sustainable management of mosquito and tsetse fly populations

Mosquitoes (Diptera: Culicidae) and tsetse flies (Diptera: Glossinidae) are bloodsucking vectors of human and animal pathogens. Mosquito-borne disease…
www.sciencedirect.com www.sciencedirect.com
Click to expand...
"the others can lead to self sustaining declines in the populations" has that been accomplished in a way that lowers overall mosquito population? The article you linked is from 2016, but I don't know how much the tech has moved in the last decade. From the CDC link: Genetically Modified Mosquitoes | CDC. "When GM mosquitoes stop being released into an area, the Ae. aegypti mosquito population will slowly return to “normal levels.”".

I don't think a genetic bomb that leads to self-sustaining declines in overall mosquito population is possible. Genetically bombing a specific species that is known to carry disease to reduce the prevalence of that species seems totally feasible, but a self-sustaining reduction of all mosquitos in an area seems way beyond that.
 
Control

Control

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
3,156
8,341
1686193972660.png
 
  • 1Worf
Reactions: 1 user
Aldarion

Aldarion

Egg Nazi
9,976
27,494
TIL the Carrington Event was a nothingburger compared to its big brother the Miyake event
bigthink.com

The Carrington event of 1859 disrupted telegraph lines. A "Miyake event" would be far worse

We don't know what causes Miyake events, but these great surges of energy can help us decipher the past — while posing a threat to our future.
bigthink.com bigthink.com
Since then, more “Miyake events” — characterized by sudden, single-year leaps in the concentration of carbon-14 in trees, as well as beryllium-10 and chlorine-36 in ice sheets — have been confirmed in 7176 BC, 5410 BC, 5259 BC, 774 AD, and 993 AD.

Miyake events exhibit significantly greater intensity than the solar or stellar events that could have triggered the Carrington event in 1859. “Those two scintillating days in 1859 are barely a blip,”
Click to expand...
But remember, the Carrington event was relatively minor. Faced with a surge of high-energy particles characteristic of a Miyake event — one powerful enough to leave its mark in the rings of trees — the induced current would flood the thousands of satellites that encircle Earth, crippling them for months and possibly years. Power grids would topple immediately, leaving anything reliant on electricity, like lights, electric vehicles, and ventilators, inoperable.
Click to expand...
Some researchers doubt we will understand what causes Miyake events until we can directly observe and measure one using scientific instruments. This is a fate we would obviously like to avoid. And in the event, we would lose the data almost as soon as we received it.
Click to expand...
That last line is profound. I considered putting this in the Ancient Civ thread. Its not clear that a technological society could survive one of these events, and if it did, its survivors would almost certainly be left with no record of the event. Other than perhaps as a myth passed down orally over generations.
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users
Ukerric

Ukerric

Bearded Ape
<Silver Donator>
8,388
10,457
Aldarion said:
That last line is profound. I considered putting this in the Ancient Civ thread. Its not clear that a technological society could survive one of these events, and if it did, its survivors would almost certainly be left with no record of the event. Other than perhaps as a myth passed down orally over generations.
Click to expand...
We do have the advantage of knowing simple tricks that don't require power, yet help immensely with civilizations.

On the topic of cultural knowledge, the movable type printing press is pretty much there to stay. It's one of those inventions that, once explained, everybody facepalms and says "how could nobody have thought about this". Unless you have an event that kills 99% of the population, everywhere, any semi-developped survivor group can make wooden printing presses and keep knowledge in print. We'd lose a lot, sure, but it's almost impossible to lose all. First hand summaries of the event? They'll be there.
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users
Edaw

Edaw

Parody
<Gold Donor>
13,744
92,557
Ukerric said:
We do have the advantage of knowing simple tricks that don't require power, yet help immensely with civilizations.

On the topic of cultural knowledge, the movable type printing press is pretty much there to stay. It's one of those inventions that, once explained, everybody facepalms and says "how could nobody have thought about this". Unless you have an event that kills 99% of the population, everywhere, any semi-developped survivor group can make wooden printing presses and keep knowledge in print. We'd lose a lot, sure, but it's almost impossible to lose all. First hand summaries of the event? They'll be there.
Click to expand...
Counterpoint: Some people only communicate with tiktok and the number is growing. What if they win? What if they hate your machine they don't understand or the scribbles you draw?

www.apmresearchlab.org

Reading the numbers: 130 million American adults have low literacy skills — APM Research Lab

About 130 million adults in the U.S. have low literacy skills according to a Gallup analysis of data from the U.S. Department of Education. This means more than half of Americans between the ages of 16 and 74 (54%) read below the equivalent of a sixth-grade level.
www.apmresearchlab.org www.apmresearchlab.org

A_Canticle_for_Leibowitz_cover_1st_ed.jpg
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users
Aldarion

Aldarion

Egg Nazi
9,976
27,494
Edaw said:
Counterpoint: Some people only communicate with tiktok and the number is growing. What if they win? What if they hate your machine they don't understand or the scribbles you draw?

www.apmresearchlab.org

Reading the numbers: 130 million American adults have low literacy skills — APM Research Lab

About 130 million adults in the U.S. have low literacy skills according to a Gallup analysis of data from the U.S. Department of Education. This means more than half of Americans between the ages of 16 and 74 (54%) read below the equivalent of a sixth-grade level.
www.apmresearchlab.org www.apmresearchlab.org

View attachment 477536
Click to expand...
even here - a text based forum - we've gone from literate arguments written out in text to literally just a place for people to post tiktoks. We used to have Lithose posts. Now we have one fucking tiktok after another. (Somebody is gonna come in an object, hey we also post youtube!)

our grandchildren are not going to be literate in the sense we think of the word, unless civilization falls between now and then.
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users
Fogel

Fogel

Mr. Poopybutthole
13,456
53,552
Aldarion said:
even here - a text based forum - we've gone from literate arguments written out in text to literally just a place for people to post tiktoks. We used to have Lithose posts. Now we have one fucking tiktok after another. (Somebody is gonna come in an object, hey we also post youtube!)

our grandchildren are not going to be literate in the sense we think of the word, unless civilization falls between now and then.
Click to expand...
tldr-read.gif
 
  • 7Worf
  • 1Like
Reactions: 7 users
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
47,937
82,627
Aldarion said:
even here - a text based forum - we've gone from literate arguments written out in text to literally just a place for people to post tiktoks. We used to have Lithose posts. Now we have one fucking tiktok after another. (Somebody is gonna come in an object, hey we also post youtube!)

our grandchildren are not going to be literate in the sense we think of the word, unless civilization falls between now and then.
Click to expand...
counterpoint:

snNAbnN5KtJfUlJmbIWpPDe1KcE56W3YhwAM9pvxs-w.png
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
47,937
82,627
As an aside, I would support a forum feature that would integrate the literacy test results from the PIAAC into the forum and show a badge (or armband) in a poster's profile.

PIAAC - What PIAAC Measures

The Program for the International Assessment of Adult Competencies (PIAAC) is a cyclical, large-scale, direct household assessment designed to assess and compare the basic skills and competencies of adults around the world. The assessment focuses on cognitive and workplace skills needed for...
nces.ed.gov

I'd wager that a good chunk of the morons that post about the imminent breakdown of our society would get trapped somewhere around Level 1

Level 1
176–225 points		Most of the tasks at this level require the respondent to read relatively short continuous, noncontinuous, or mixed texts in digital or print format to locate a single piece of information that is identical to or synonymous with the information given in the question or directive. Some tasks, such as those involving noncontinuous texts, may require the respondent to enter personal information into a document. Little, if any, competing information is present. Some tasks may require simply cycling through more than one piece of information. The respondent is expected to have knowledge and skill in recognizing basic vocabulary, determining the meaning of sentences, and reading paragraphs of text.
Click to expand...
 
  • 3Like
  • 1Smuggly
Reactions: 3 users
Edaw

Edaw

Parody
<Gold Donor>
13,744
92,557
I wonder what the minimum level is to be a functional member of society and how that has changed over time as technology increased.

Everyone being able to like and subscribe is not the same as everyone reading Animal Farm in middle school.

The study I linked was for at least a 6th grade reading level. Is that what they consider the bottom? Why that level and not another? Is the chart for the same level? They seem to contradict each other.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.