Star Wars general purpose movie stuff

Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Merrith said:
I don't care about what bad stuff ended up getting made worse later, TFA actually had some potential plot points that they could have built something semi interesting out of. Whole thing went to shit once Last Jedi just left nothing redeemable in the slightest.
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its just JJ mystery boxes. he had no plan for Finn or Poe or Rey's lineage or Snoke's background or Kylo's origin or even Luke, he just put that shit there as a placeholder for the next guy to make something out of. what he did do was build up Rey as a supreme character who had no problem doing anything, then Rian picked up the football, ran with it and made her more of the same. JJ made Kylo an epic clusterfuck "beaten by a girl", he made Han a deadbeat dad, because why not. he never gave Luke and Leia a reunion with Han and Chewie. there is a lot of bad in the first movie and he opened the door for much more bad in the second movie.
 
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TheNozz

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Seananigans

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Merrith said:
Although I thought Ford was mainly on board to have the character killed off? Granted, I don't think JJ did great with TFA, but he at least set up potential interesting plot threads to go forward. Nothing he did to Luke was bad in itself. He just wasn't an active part of first movie. Rian just decided to toss any possible good threads and write a shit movie with useless side stories, a space chase that took up 2/3 of the movie for no reason, and "twists" that had zero point whatsoever. It's no secret Hamil and him clashed over his depiction of Luke.
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JJ is as much an idiot as any other. He's the reason in ep 7 Kylo immediately takes his helmet off showing Driver's derpy stupid looking face, completely neutering any menace of Kylo Ren. From then on, he can't be taken seriously, and the scene of him raging out and destroying consoles is just hilariously bad instead of frightening as it could have been if you never saw Driver's face.
 
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Gavinmad

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jayrebb said:
Unfair criticism. The writing process has changed since her time.

Nobody knows what JJ and Chris Terrio's first draft looked like.
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jayrebb said:
Which should be assigned to the head of studio/ lead producer. There was no reason to throw JJ's name out like he hand-crafted the movie.
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jayrebb said:
You don't throw JJ in, who went through several rewrites against his will, with guys like Rian Johnson who had their first draft accepted.
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After what he did to both Star Trek AND Star Wars you're basically white knighting a serial rapist. The fact that Star Wars was a gang rape doesn't make him any less of a rapist.
 
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Merrith

Merrith

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Chukzombi said:
its just JJ mystery boxes. he had no plan for Finn or Poe or Rey's lineage or Snoke's background or Kylo's origin or even Luke, he just put that shit there as a placeholder for the next guy to make something out of. what he did do was build up Rey as a supreme character who had no problem doing anything, then Rian picked up the football, ran with it and made her more of the same. JJ made Kylo an epic clusterfuck "beaten by a girl", he made Han a deadbeat dad, because why not. he never gave Luke and Leia a reunion with Han and Chewie. there is a lot of bad in the first movie and he opened the door for much more bad in the second movie.
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Again, I don't care so much whether they were JJ mystery boxes or not, Rian just did basically the worst things he could with any of them, which was basically pretty much ignoring or discarding any of them. To say he set up Rey as a supreme character is exaggerating, Rian dialed that shit up to 11 compared to JJ. Because she "beat" a still spoiled brat apprentice who had taken a Chewie bowcaster shot and already fought Finn? Peanuts compared to what came after.

I'm not a fan of how Han's character was portrayed, but it also could make perfect sense, unless you're so tied to the reformed smuggler with a heart of gold version of Han Solo you can't imagine anything else.

First movie wasn't great by any stretch, but it at least had some potential as a beginning to a trilogy. He opened the door for a lot of stuff in the second one, but Rian should get 90%+ of the blame for the extremely shitty directions he chose.
 
Merrith

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Seananigans said:
JJ is as much an idiot as any other. He's the reason in ep 7 Kylo immediately takes his helmet off showing Driver's derpy stupid looking face, completely neutering any menace of Kylo Ren. From then on, he can't be taken seriously, and the scene of him raging out and destroying consoles is just hilariously bad instead of frightening as it could have been if you never saw Driver's face.
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I can agree with most of this take. Kylo never comes off as really menacing in the slightest, more spoiled brat. Then again, the mask he wore was even worse than his face, imo.
 
Merrith

Merrith

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Gavinmad said:
After what he did to both Star Trek AND Star Wars you're basically white knighting a serial rapist. The fact that Star Wars was a gang rape doesn't make him any less of a rapist.
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Ironically have almost the same feelings for the Star Trek reboot set of movies as the sequel trilogy. First one wasn't that bad, everything after was complete shit. He just only has himself to blame for Star Trek. Rian Johnson just did a much better job of shitting up the sequel trilogy than JJ...at least through the first two, still have never seen the last one...though the consensus always seems to be utter trash, and spent too much time trying to undo stuff from 2nd movie.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Merrith said:
Again, I don't care so much whether they were JJ mystery boxes or not, Rian just did basically the worst things he could with any of them, which was basically pretty much ignoring or discarding any of them. To say he set up Rey as a supreme character is exaggerating, Rian dialed that shit up to 11 compared to JJ. Because she "beat" a still spoiled brat apprentice who had taken a Chewie bowcaster shot and already fought Finn? Peanuts compared to what came after.

I'm not a fan of how Han's character was portrayed, but it also could make perfect sense, unless you're so tied to the reformed smuggler with a heart of gold version of Han Solo you can't imagine anything else.

First movie wasn't great by any stretch, but it at least had some potential as a beginning to a trilogy. He opened the door for a lot of stuff in the second one, but Rian should get 90%+ of the blame for the extremely shitty directions he chose.
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saying while it was bad, it wasnt Rian Johnson bad, doesnt mean JJ's movie still wasnt fucking bad. Rian Johnson only made things worse because he took all those mystery boxes and tossed them in the garbage. personally, that wasnt really a bad thing if he had something decent to put in it's place. but nope. Snoke origin? doesnt matter, Rey's parents? doesnt matter, Finn's possible force sensitivity and romantic relationship with Rey? doesnt matter, here's a chubby asian girl to cockblock you. Poe's storyline? doesnt matter, Leia slapped your ass down for your troubles. Kylo's training? doesnt matter. Luke's story? doesnt matter. that green titty milk isnt going to drink itself. lets just agree both were bad in their own special ways. and i still havent seen the third one either, no plans on watching it.
 
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Chris

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Seananigans said:
JJ is as much an idiot as any other. He's the reason in ep 7 Kylo immediately takes his helmet off showing Driver's derpy stupid looking face, completely neutering any menace of Kylo Ren. From then on, he can't be taken seriously, and the scene of him raging out and destroying consoles is just hilariously bad instead of frightening as it could have been if you never saw Driver's face.
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They could have had Kylo Ren and "Ben Solo" as different characters, with Ben teaching Rey a few things to build the romance angle.

Then you reveal that they are the same person when the mask finally comes off. Classic Star Wars.

Then they should have followed through and had them get together if you want the franchise female friendly, because the female power fantasy is taming the bad boy (see Buffy, Twilight etc).
 
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Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Chris said:
They could have had Kylo Ren and "Ben Solo" as different characters, with Ben teaching Rey a few things to build the romance angle.

Then you reveal that they are the same person when the mask finally comes off. Classic Star Wars.

Then they should have followed through and had them get together if you want the franchise female friendly, because the female power fantasy is taming the bad boy (see Buffy, Twilight etc).
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there could have been any number of ways of introducing him. Spaceballs Darth Helmet Jr wasnt one i expected.
iu

iu
 
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mkopec

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Whole last series was shit because it was written and made for kids not adults. Lets not fool ourselves, this shit was written and re-written by committee. As if kids give a shit about SW anyway these days. All 3 movies were terribad. Like where the bad guys make a planet destroyer 2.0 but it gets destroyed by 3-4 dudes and a few x wings. Greatest weapon in the empire and they cant keep 4 dudes from laying some explosives in the most vulnerable part of the base? In rogue one, decades before, they had a whole planet wide shield but this death star 2.0 could not spring for one?

Just shit like this is kinda meh all around. I actually enjoyed the prequels better than the last 3 they shit out.
 
joz123

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mkopec said:
Whole last series was shit because it was written and made for kids not adults. Lets not fool ourselves, this shit was written and re-written by committee. As if kids give a shit about SW anyway these days. All 3 movies were terribad. Like where the bad guys make a planet destroyer 2.0 but it gets destroyed by 3-4 dudes and a few x wings. Greatest weapon in the empire and they cant keep 4 dudes from laying some explosives in the most vulnerable part of the base? In rogue one, decades before, they had a whole planet wide shield but this death star 2.0 could not spring for one?

Just shit like this is kinda meh all around. I actually enjoyed the prequels better than the last 3 they shit out.
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Phantom Menace gets shit on a lot but Darth Maul was the best villain. He was mysterious, silent and was always in attack mode around the Jedi.
 
Fucker

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joz123 said:
Phantom Menace gets shit on a lot but Darth Maul was the best villain. He was mysterious, silent and was always in attack mode around the Jedi.
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DM also had more lines in the trailers than the actual movie.

Not a good way to do a bad guy.
 
Chris

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mkopec said:
Whole last series was shit because it was written and made for kids not adults.
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I've noticed in gaming that some companies have recognised the aging audience and aged the games up.

Baldur's Gate 3 and FF16 have nude/sex scenes. No other games in those series have those. BG2 had off screen sex but nothing graphic.

Cyberpunk has nude sex scenes. Remember when GTA got in trouble for a disabled sex minigame?

The kids of 20-30 years ago are now adults with disposable income. Star Wars could have been that, show us Rey's tits.

There is a danger of not appealing to kids though, which is the formerly kids focused Games Workshop/Magic the Gathering/Comics price gouging their now adult audience for every last cent.
 
mkopec

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Chris said:
I've noticed in gaming that some companies have recognised the aging audience and aged the games up.

Baldur's Gate 3 and FF16 have nude/sex scenes. No other games in those series have those. BG2 had off screen sex but nothing graphic.

Cyberpunk has nude sex scenes. Remember when GTA got in trouble for a disabled sex minigame?

The kids of 20-30 years ago are now adults with disposable income. Star Wars could have been that, show us Rey's tits.

There is a danger of not appealing to kids though, which is the formerly kids focused Games Workshop/Magic the Gathering/Comics price gouging their now adult audience for every last cent.
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But thats just it with Star Wars. Its an 80s action space movies that appealed to the kids AT THAT TIME, since it was fresh, and the effects were spectacular for that time. Today, kids dont give a fuck about boomer star wars. I took both my kids to see prequels back in the day when they were still kids and they could care less. Now I know I cant just cast a blanket statement because, sure there were prob kids that liked Star Wars, but not like they did in the 80s.

Todays kids are inundated with all kinds of shit at a push of a play button that directly target what they like. This was not so back in the late 70s and 80s.
 
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