Starfield - Fallout fallout that isn't ES6

Dr.Retarded

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Caliane said:
I would argue thats the problem. they didn't. They removed the open world simulation. Skyrim is often called out for being dumbed down rpg/factions, etc from each previous incarnation. but its the most flushed out open world simulation. you feel like you could LIVE in skyrim more then any other. FO4 same thing. meh story, etc, but greatly flushed out world, and survival/settlement building.

they cut out the open world sim here, and replaced it with fast travel. the core appeal of Bethesda games, that open world sim, is missing. A campaign map would solve that problem. Starsector handles the "space is big and empty", with proc gen, colonies, exploration, and combat, etc perfectly. "scan and explore ruins" in starsector, could directly tie into how landing and exploring is done here on planets. its really sad to see a game with a system that could be directly cut/paste into this to solve its missing core gameplay. while this thing just fails miserably.
hell just saw a reddit post about powering down engines to go dark, and fuel use. Its almost like at some point, this really did have a starsector mode, and it was scrapped, with all of the star travel removed. leaving half a game.
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I don't remember who posted it originally, maybe Tuco Tuco but there was an article that talked about during the initial development planetary environments were much harsher, and if you didn't have the right suit for the job, you couldn't explore. Also the whole fuel consumption was a big deal and it would have promoted Outpost building to harvest the necessary resources to keep exploring further out, much more of a survival type game.

That would have been awesome, but somewhere along the way the devs said dumb it down, and whether that came from the team itself, or from the execs, who knows. I'm in full agreement that there's definitely a lot of lost potential with the IP. Had some of those different systems been in place, really would have added to the challenge and fun. Would have given a reason to having different suits and building your little Outpost on different planets, especially if story related content was gated behind your ability to travel to and survive those harsh environments.

Is there a chance with the expansion that they can turn everything around with the addition of the modding community, maybe. Is it still a fun game to some absolutely, but I can definitely see why it's not everybody's cup of tea. Me personally I'm so slowly working through my second playthrough and it's still fun despite its flaws. Would have been more amazing indeed, but I've definitely gotten my money's worth. It's definitely a game I'll come back and revisit in the future if things start really shaping up, and I can't say that for a lot of their other stuff. I don't know it's just a fun game to me.
 
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Caliane

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I don't think JUST adding in the survival mechanics/fuel would solve the problem. thats just tedium on top of a broken system, if that missing system isnt there.
 
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Cybsled

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I agree. Fallout4 eventually released a hardcore mode that had no fast travel, permadeath, needing to eat/drink, etc. But the core gameplay loop was still interesting even without that.

Starfield, even if they added a hardcore mode, still leaves you with a “what’s the point?” feeling. Especially with the current NG+ mechanics that basically delete all your progress beyond your level and talents
 
Big Phoenix

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Tide27 said:
I think they could fix one of my biggest issues by fleshing out the planets that they do have.

I spent about 10 hours on my first 2 planets investigating every PoI. Even before I hit my 3rd planet, I noticed that every PoI was an exact copy / paste of the same PoI I had been to twice before. The only thing that seemed random was the loot.

All the computers had the same writing on them, every placeable / lootable object was the exact same thing, the layout was exactly the same etx. Even the random caves were an exact copy / paste...no reason whatsoever to go in them.

This was my biggest turnoff, as I was no longer excited to see the same PoI that I had seen 4 other times...and then multiply that times another 980 planets or so.
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I lost all interest in pois when I cleared the cyrolab and there was no follow up on the people performing crazy genetic experiments on slaves.
 
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Cybsled

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Exactly. They have some cool world building at some of the POI…that leads no where.
 
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Bandwagon

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Caliane said:
see minors
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creeping too young GIF
 
mkopec

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I dont think there was any loops missing, it was just a dead world(s) that felt very sterile. Nothing like Skyrim or FO4.
 
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Big Phoenix

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Even with how forgettable this game is, you still have lots of autistics living in it;





 
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mkopec

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Hopefully they flesh out this game some over the coming years or modders flesh it out for them, because as it stands, this was at best a 5/10 for me. Where Skyrim and FO4 were at least a 7/10 if not 8 or 9 with mods.
 
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Caliane

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Big Phoenix said:
Even with how forgettable this game is, you still have lots of autistics living in it;





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I don't believe them. How can they possibly not be hitting F to open teh scanner up mid battle every 30seconds while trying to hit G to fire missiles?
 
Utnayan

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jayrebb said:
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This is the EXACT mindset of these stupid talentless fucking diversity/progressive hacks. The messaging is impacting everywhere. "Oh poor waiters/waitresses - you should be more understanding when it takes an hour for your food to come and comes in wrong... they are just overworked" ... "People complaining about my game have obviously never worked in a development environment before so you can't complain...." FUCK.... RIGHT.... OFF with your God Damn victim mentality. Maybe it's high time these fucks remember that without us you don't have a FUCKING JOB. Instead of these style of shit posts from the massive amounts of mental midgets now working in the game industry circle jerking themselves into another stop/start, feel bad for the customers for your mediocre SHIT IN A BOX - or better yet, shut the fuck up and thank them for giving you a chance by buying your game.

As a consumer, we ARE entitled to good customer service and expectations of delivery because we PAID YOU FOR IT. If someone buys your game, they have every right to shit talk it if they want, praise it if they want, be constructive and tell you what should have been in as BASIC FUCKING FEATURE SETS to begin with, or a combination of whatever the fuck they feel like talking about because they BOUGHT IT. How about instead these fucking ball choppers and men milk mommies get off their lazy fucking asses and start bettering themselves in the industry to LEARN, or at this stage even better yet, HAVE A FUCKING PASSION FOR, creating fun and awesome experiences for CUSTOMERS to play through.

The entire game industry is suffering because of this ESG/DEI mentality where talent is lower on the totem poll than a DEI matrix HR employment rule, and then to top it off these fuckoids want to unionize not because they care about their work schedules, but because they KNOW they are milking this for everything they can and need job protection to stay.

And when the smoke clears as ESG is no longer a viable market mechanism on Wall Street losing trillions, and these companies course correct, you will realize like any normal intelligent human being on planet earth with an IQ over 70 already does, that their virtue signaling had nothing to do with sympathy or plight for the .000045% of the fuckstick population as you get shit canned for lack of production, creativity, or your just a whiny fucking bitch who thinks the bears should always be fed from the park visitors until the end of time.
 
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Valderen

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Utnayan said:
This is the EXACT mindset of these stupid talentless fucking diversity/progressive hacks. The messaging is impacting everywhere. "Oh poor waiters/waitresses - you should be more understanding when it takes an hour for your food to come and comes in wrong... they are just overworked" ... "People complaining about my game have obviously never worked in a development environment before so you can't complain...." FUCK.... RIGHT.... OFF with your God Damn victim mentality. Maybe it's high time these fucks remember that without us you don't have a FUCKING JOB. Instead of these style of shit posts from the massive amounts of mental midgets now working in the game industry circle jerking themselves into another stop/start, feel bad for the customers for your mediocre SHIT IN A BOX - or better yet, shut the fuck up and thank them for giving you a chance by buying your game.

As a consumer, we ARE entitled to good customer service and expectations of delivery because we PAID YOU FOR IT. If someone buys your game, they have every right to shit talk it if they want, praise it if they want, be constructive and tell you what should have been in as BASIC FUCKING FEATURE SETS to begin with, or a combination of whatever the fuck they feel like talking about because they BOUGHT IT. How about instead these fucking ball choppers and men milk mommies get off their lazy fucking asses and start bettering themselves in the industry to LEARN, or at this stage even better yet, HAVE A FUCKING PASSION FOR, creating fun and awesome experiences for CUSTOMERS to play through.

The entire game industry is suffering because of this ESG/DEI mentality where talent is lower on the totem poll than a DEI matrix HR employment rule, and then to top it off these fuckoids want to unionize not because they care about their work schedules, but because they KNOW they are milking this for everything they can and need job protection to stay.

And when the smoke clears as ESG is no longer a viable market mechanism on Wall Street losing trillions, and these companies course correct, you will realize like any normal intelligent human being on planet earth with an IQ over 70 already does, that their virtue signaling had nothing to do with sympathy or plight for the .000045% of the fuckstick population as you get shit canned for lack of production, creativity, or your just a whiny fucking asshole who thinks the bears should always be fed from the park visitors until the end of time.
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It's not a game industry specific problem though. It's everywhere today, this current generation was raise in such a way that they cannot in any way shape or form receive any sort of criticism...period. They can't handle it.

This sucks because it leads to stagnation if you can't take constructive criticism you can't learn from your mistake and improve.

So for a while, things will stagnated until it collapse and hopefully at some point we raise children with some balls that can take being no, or be criticize and things start improving.

So for a while we'll see game studios make the same mistake over and over again wondering why it's bad, not working or people don't buy their game.

The world just sucks right now....or maybe I'm just turned into the old man yelling at clouds. :)
 
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Cybsled

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One issue is people always use a monolithic “the devs” to describe the problem

On games this size, the blame usually rests with the people who hold the final decisions. Coders and artists and the like are doing what they are told.
 
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Utnayan

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Cybsled said:
One issue is people always use a monolithic “the devs” to describe the problem

On games this size, the blame usually rests with the people who hold the final decisions. Coders and artists and the like are doing what they are told.
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I can absolutely guarantee you, that while leadership, directors, and producers hold the cards - when your dev base cannot reach basic milestones resulting in delays because of their lack of ANYTHING skill related, we see 10 year dev cycles expanding because they simply do not know HOW to develop or think outside the box. They are too busy pulling this shit.

1702658459842.png


See the above? This is exactly why Blizzard is now a fucking laughing stock. It's why Overwatch 2, Diablo 4, and mutiple expansions for World of Warcarft were piles of absolute shit. Bethesda is the SAME way.

Kick these fuckers to the curb where they belong, and that changes. Maybe they can hire someone who knows how to at least program a text adventure in Basic rather than concern themselves with progressive 6 month long circle jerk meetings over Zoom on how to approach a character selection screen to ensure non-binary Avatars have options for Cock, Pussy, or none.
 
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Big Phoenix

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Cybsled said:
One issue is people always use a monolithic “the devs” to describe the problem

On games this size, the blame usually rests with the people who hold the final decisions. Coders and artists and the like are doing what they are told.
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iirc that's the person in charge of their writing, not just some random. He's one of the key reasons starfield was underwhelming.
 
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sleevedraw

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Valderen said:
It's not a game industry specific problem though. It's everywhere today, this current generation was raise in such a way that they cannot in any way shape or form receive any sort of criticism...period. They can't handle it.

This sucks because it leads to stagnation if you can't take constructive criticism you can't learn from your mistake and improve.

So for a while, things will stagnated until it collapse and hopefully at some point we raise children with some balls that can take being no, or be criticize and things start improving.

So for a while we'll see game studios make the same mistake over and over again wondering why it's bad, not working or people don't buy their game.

The world just sucks right now....or maybe I'm just turned into the old man yelling at clouds. :)
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Every generation has its moochers and go-getters. Even back in Sumerian times, you have cuneiform lamenting the laziness of the youth.

I think as every generation gets older, it has a tendency to see people younger than them as lazy and entitled. It's not always the case, though - my best friend is a Zoomer in his early 20s who's lived in a "dry cabin" (i.e. no plumbing) in Alaska. His spouse was homeless in high school and is currently trying to get either an environmental or petroleum engineering degree part-time (has the grades, just doesn't have much money, and he's a FUCKING WHITE MALE, so he's dead last for financial aid.) Both of them are always trying to self-improve.

If something has changed recently, I think it's more just that mass culture no longer favors a "culture of excellence," it favors gaming the system, and we may be reaching a critical value where the ratio of go-getters to moochers has become unsustainable.
 
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Cybsled

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Humans have always tried to game the system - that isn’t a new development.

The only thing that has changed is the speed and scope at which people can communicate to others that they gamed the system
 
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Dr.Retarded

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Cybsled said:
Humans have always tried to game the system - that isn’t a new development.

The only thing that has changed is the speed and scope at which people can communicate to others that they gamed the system
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Path of least resistance. Think the point he's making is there's newer generations of people that always gravitate toward that direction, and the current world with technology, ease of life, strong vs weak men, etc just reinforce that behavior.

Life can be hard for a lot of people, but unfortunately it's not hard enough on some to teach them the necessary skills to not be a fuck up. Whether you choose to challenge yourself, better yourself that's something a lot of the younger generation isn't apt to do, or at least in the eyes of older people. By no means am I saying that's all of them, but that trend seems to be increasing. How many kids nowadays do you think are able to change a goddamn tire versus just calling AAA, if they even know what the hell that is.

Anyways that's a big conversation and way off topic, I'd rather still state that the game is at least fun to me, and I'm not autistic Big Phoenix Big Phoenix 😉.
 
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