The Art of Conversation

McCheese · Jun 27, 2017

But seriously, I usually stop talking to people that I have to pull stories out of. I meet people at work that will talk to you all day if you sit and question them. When I stop being the interrogator, they shut down, sit there and look at you, or just eat in silence. Then they come and ask you to go to lunch again the next day - so it's not like they are just suffering through seeing me, as much as some of you would like to believe that. A lot of people are just quiet.

And I bet eating in silence is just fine for them. I'm almost the opposite of you, where I'll answer questions all day long, but I have no desire or energy to ask questions and keep the conversation going myself. I can do it when forced to, but it's awful and exhausting. I have no problem just sitting in silence, but I know that makes a lot of people really, really uncomfortable.

Often when I'm in a situation with someone like you who is asking me lots of questions, as I'm answering them orally I'm silently thinking "God I wish he'd just lay off the questions and let me eat/sit/whatever in peace." It's nothing personal against the person, and I usually quite enjoy their company, but the talking is just tiresome.

Cad · Jun 27, 2017

McCheese said:
It's nothing personal against the person, and I usually quite enjoy their company, but the talking is just tiresome.

What is it about a person that you enjoy their company if its not talking to them? Just existing in the same air?

McCheese · Jun 27, 2017

Cad said:
What is it about a person that you enjoy their company if its not talking to them? Just existing in the same air?

I phrased that badly. I meant it's fine when it's them doing most of the talking and I can chime in here or there. You mention the delicate balance between getting/giving information. For me, the ideal would be 80% getting and 20% giving, whereas what you described sounded more like 50/50.

But yeah, I also don't mind having a minute or two of silence now and then. There's nothing wrong with that.

Mrs. Gravy · Jun 27, 2017

Satisfaction is the key for everyone...what am I getting from the interaction...what are the others with who I am engaged?
Am I hearing/understanding what is being said as much as what is not being said; am I picking up on the para-verbal and non-verbal cues...and am I sending them ...and are they being received? To me, conversation is an art and a science.

Addition...yes, sometimes I do like just sitting in silence with another person, sharing the air. It can be comforting to just "be".

In the category of TMI...I have developed unwanted feelings for new man. I am freaked out by it tbh.

Cad · Jun 27, 2017

McCheese said:
I phrased that badly. I meant it's fine when it's them doing most of the talking and I can chime in here or there. You mention the delicate balance between getting/giving information. For me, the ideal would be 80% getting and 20% giving, whereas what you described sounded more like 50/50.

But yeah, I also don't mind having a minute or two of silence now and then. There's nothing wrong with that.

Well thats fine, and there will be people that are happy to do the 80% questioning/leading and allowing the other person to follow. There will be others (like you) who want to be on the other end of that conversation. This is what I believe "getting along" is.

moonarchia · Jun 27, 2017

Cad said:
What is it about a person that you enjoy their company if its not talking to them? Just existing in the same air?

For the people I care about, yeah, that's enough. My family has had almost 0 new conversations in the past 30 years. I still love them and enjoy spending time with them, quiet or otherwise.

moonarchia · Jun 27, 2017

Mrs. Gravy said:
In the category of TMI...I have developed unwanted feelings for new man. I am freaked out by it tbh.

Too vague. Please clarify.

Mrs. Gravy · Jun 28, 2017

moonarchia said:
Too vague. Please clarify.

He intrigues the hell out of me, he is creative and intelligent and funny. He continues to be more open with me, sharing more intimate details of his life.
I really like him.
He is way more experienced than me in re quantity and types of relationships. I have the better record but am no saint. So, I am cautious. I want to be fearless and put my heart out ready to deal with it f it t gets broken. I just don't know if I am prepared. I mean, I knew G was going to die and thought I could handle that but that turned out to be an illusion. I am still a bit of a mess with regard to grief and my G.
Yeah, I am feeling the effects of oxytocin and vasopressin with new man. Sigh.

pharmakos · Jun 28, 2017

Mrs. Gravy said:
Addition...yes, sometimes I do like just sitting in silence with another person, sharing the air. It can be comforting to just "be".

people that either don't understand this or can't do this exhaust me.

moonarchia · Jun 28, 2017

Mrs. Gravy said:
He intrigues the hell out of me, he is creative and intelligent and funny. He continues to be more open with me, sharing more intimate details of his life.
I really like him.
He is way more experienced than me in re quantity and types of relationships. I have the better record but am no saint. So, I am cautious. I want to be fearless and put my heart out ready to deal with it f it t gets broken. I just don't know if I am prepared. I mean, I knew G was going to die and thought I could handle that but that turned out to be an illusion. I am still a bit of a mess with regard to grief and my G.
Yeah, I am feeling the effects of oxytocin and vasopressin with new man. Sigh.

1. There is no better or worse record when it comes to sexual history. If he has a good sense of humor you could probably call him a manslut.
2. You will never be prepared. That's just the nature of love, and life in general. You should probably tell him the part about G and how messed up it makes you feel now that you're starting to like him. If he's not a sack of shit he'll wait for you. Or you can go to Vegas and get married and adopt Noodle's kids.

Xarpolis · Jun 28, 2017

I didn't understand the oxytocin & vasopressin line at all. I'm such a beginner.

Mrs. Gravy · Jun 28, 2017

moonarchia and

Xarpolis
He has a great sense of humor and I already have talked to him about being a slut. I actually call him that sometime...but now it has a "my slut" slant.
I talk to him about G and ask if it is too much - he says no. I am pretty sure he gets it. He knows I struggle and he still wants to hang out with me. Crap, I showed him the little vial of G bones/ash that I keep with me; shook it like a motherfucking maraca and he just smiled and laughed and joked with me about it. I did that early - I have been pretty open with him. I told him about this place - sort of - that I consulted this group about my relationships and my behavior and men's behaviors in general. I don't know if I am ready to let him in on all of this - maybe one day. He is pretty great. Fuck for all I know he might be here already.
If I put anything in writing to him - he remembers it word for word - he has an eidetic memory for written text. It doesn't stop me from being a fool even though it should. So most of my caution is actually thrown to the wind. Again -life is fucking short -I have to try and remember how fearless I can be. There is no hurry for marriage or adopting anyone but Noodle. I don't need children - I am one.

X - oxytocin and vasopressin play chemical/hormonal roles in bonding - I feel like I am pair bonding - it scares me.

Xarpolis · Jun 28, 2017

Ahh, I understand. You also seem to be in that gitty and excited stage of early love/lust. Is this guy someone you want to be around all day for no real reason? Just to be around him, that is? Also, what age range are you, if you don't mind me asking? 30's? 40's? 50's+?
This is just a curiosity, more so that I can put an image (in my mind) about the person I'm talking to.

Mrs. Gravy · Jun 29, 2017

Xarpolis said:
Ahh, I understand. You also seem to be in that gitty and excited stage of early love/lust. Is this guy someone you want to be around all day for no real reason? Just to be around him, that is? Also, what age range are you, if you don't mind me asking? 30's? 40's? 50's+?
This is just a curiosity, more so that I can put an image (in my mind) about the person I'm talking to.

I am a youthful 52. People guess me younger all the time. And not to brag...but really to brag...I get hit on by both younger men and younger women....like in the 25 to 35 y.o. category. (edit - I think more because of my attitude than my looks though. I am just a tad on the pretty side of plain but I have a good ass.)
TBH, I am in a damn near constant state of self-analysis. I do not feel giddy and I can separate lust from more complex emotion. The man possesses numerous character traits that tick my friendship as well as my lover boxes ...no pun intended. I just did not expect it so early in my get back out there dating plans.

Prodigal · Jun 29, 2017

Mrs. Gravy said:
So, I searched the word introvert to get your collective insight. I liked this thread the best for results.
I fall under...and I am sure this is hard for you to believe...the empathic extrovert category.
New man, def. on the introvert side of the scale.
I can get a story out of almost anyone to whom I speak and in a very short amount of time. I do appreciate greatly though, not HAVING to talk. Even for me, it can be exhausting. I tend to feel other people's suffering a bit too much at times and need silence for introspection and to maintain a healthy sense of balance.
Anyway, as usual the perspectives gathered here are helpful and again, I feel fortunate to be here amongst you.

My wife is very outgoing and actively seeks new relationships and loves small talk. It's what makes her great at her job (training groups of people). People like her because she shows genuine interest it what's going on with them.

I'm introverted and analytical and from what I've been told somewhat intimidating to those who don't know me. I am fine with social interaction but don't actively seek It. I don't carry conversations but contribute when I'm engaged by the subject matter (rarely).

A big part of our problem is wife and I have completely different interests, so her friends (and family) are, for lack of a better term, tedious to interact with. I think it is unfortunately obvious to them I'm just hanging out because she wants me there.

So, we get by. She's aware if she drags me to a social event and leaves me alone with a bunch of people while she walks off I'll be congenial, but there will be hell to pay later.

Mrs. Gravy · Jun 29, 2017

Prodigal said:
My wife is very outgoing and actively seeks new relationships and loves small talk. It's what makes her great at her job (training groups of people). People like her because she shows genuine interest it what's going on with them.

I'm introverted and analytical and from what I've been told somewhat intimidating to those who don't know me. I am fine with social interaction but don't actively seek It. I don't carry conversations but contribute when I'm engaged by the subject matter (rarely).

A big part of our problem is wife and I have completely different interests, so her friends (and family) are, for lack of a better term, tedious to interact with. I think it is unfortunately obvious to them I'm just hanging out because she wants me there.

So, we get by. She's aware if she drags me to a social event and leaves me alone with a bunch of people while she walks off I'll be congenial, but there will be hell to pay later.

I genuinely am interested in other people's histories/lives so it is easy for me to engage. That being said, it also can be too much for me...now. Before I lost G, I did not get overwhelmed. Now, even with the people I love the most, I have to sometimes escape. It has given me a better perspective into how G may have felt. He could not tolerate a crowd and I come from one. Perhaps this also helps me to better understand New's need for quiet and different methods/expressions of affection.
You have helped too...thank you.
BTW, I warned all of you over a year ago that I would be thanking you...that won't likey stop. Gratitude gets me through my days, esp. the hard ones, Today is a hard one. I haven't slept well for the past few years. Since Sunday I have had a total of about 10 hours and only about 3 were consecutive thanks to 50 mg of benadryl and 10 of melatonin.
But, as usual, I digress.
Where was I? Oh yeah, thank you!

moonarchia · Jun 29, 2017

Mrs. Gravy said:
I genuinely am interested in other people's histories/lives so it is easy for me to engage. That being said, it also can be too much for me...now. Before I lost G, I did not get overwhelmed. Now, even with the people I love the most, I have to sometimes escape. It has given me a better perspective into how G may have felt. He could not tolerate a crowd and I come from one. Perhaps this also helps me to better understand New's need for quiet and different methods/expressions of affection.
You have helped too...thank you.
BTW, I warned all of you over a year ago that I would be thanking you...that won't likey stop. Gratitude gets me through my days, esp. the hard ones, Today is a hard one. I haven't slept well for the past few years. Since Sunday I have had a total of about 10 hours and only about 3 were consecutive thanks to 50 mg of benadryl and 10 of melatonin.
But, as usual, I digress.
Where was I? Oh yeah, thank you!

So, meditation would help a lot with the sleep problems. If you do it right you'll be able to hunt down the thoughts and emotions keeping you awake and put them to more effective use. Even if you do it badly it is inherently relaxing. So win/win either way.

jayrebb · Jun 30, 2017

pharmakos said:
people that either don't understand this or can't do this exhaust me.

Nothing sucks worse than getting stuck with someone who absolutely cannot read other people.. I hope its IT industry nerds and software programmers you are drilling with 21 questions and offering lengthy mundane color-by-number answers to-- please leave the rest of us alone.

Find out who you are-- what is your identity. Now find someone with swagger from X Y Z movie or television show. Something realistic, not a dramatization or a caricature. Pay attention to the specifics. The humor, the rolloffs, the body language, the tone inflections, the pauses. He's having a good time. Why does he feel good? You should feel good. Find the mentor you never had. In an actual tribal community you would have latched on to someone who either liked you or tolerated your presence and learned from them.

Don't pick a role model that you can't relate to, you pick one that resembles your personality and build from there. If you're already married and over the age of 30 with kids forget about it. You missed the whole self-improvement boat. Just do everyone else a favor and lock yourself inside your house.

Human interactions are about way more than just inputting some questions and querying a bunch of junk data.

Search

The Art of Conversation

McCheese

SW: Sean, CW: Crone, GW: Wizardhawk

Cad

scientia potentia est

McCheese

SW: Sean, CW: Crone, GW: Wizardhawk

Mrs. Gravy

Quite Saucy

Cad

scientia potentia est

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord

Mrs. Gravy

Quite Saucy

pharmakos

soʞɐɯɹɐɥd

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord

Xarpolis

Life's a Dream

Mrs. Gravy

Quite Saucy

Xarpolis

Life's a Dream

Mrs. Gravy

Quite Saucy

Prodigal

Shitlord, Offender of the Universe

Mrs. Gravy

Quite Saucy

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord

jayrebb

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider