The Astronomy Thread

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Captain Suave

Caesar si viveret, ad remum dareris.
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I've never read the paper which is used to say that the CMB was predicted by the big bang. Decided to go read it (The Evolution of the Universe - Nature if you are interested).

You're making a general mistake in your approach to how learning works. Explanations are neither monolithic nor unchanging, nor is there some kind of direct inheritance of credibility at work where the entire field of knowledge must be scrapped because the first paper 75 years ago is imperfect. There are literal generations of work corroborating and refining these ideas. Some avenues are still incomplete, and there are some things we may never know. This is all to be expected.

in any system where distance means light decay, a microwave background is to be expected

Which is not presently the accepted framework, for good reason as we don't see galaxies slowly fading into the microwave. There's a substantial frequency drop between the farthest detectable galaxies and the CMB, which requires explanation.

To be clear here, I'm not saying that our modern model of cosmology isn't weird. It's weird to cosmologists, too. But it's the best and most consistent explanation of the totality of the data that we have right now. It's also entirely possible that we've arrived at fundamental misunderstandings. If so, and if those misunderstandings can be revealed by observations within our power to make, they'll be eventually corrected. Nothing we've seen meets that standard yet, as far as I know. And if/when that happens, it will still take years of work to confirm and redesign the framework.
 
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Furry

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You're making a general mistake in your approach to how learning works. Explanations are neither monolithic nor unchanging, nor is there some kind of direct inheritance of credibility at work where the entire field of knowledge must be scrapped because the first paper 75 years ago is imperfect. There are literal generations of work corroborating and refining these ideas. Some avenues are still incomplete, and there are some things we may never know. This is all to be expected.



Which is not presently the accepted framework, for good reason as we don't see galaxies slowly fading into the microwave. There's a substantial frequency drop between the farthest detectable galaxies and the CMB, which requires explanation.
Something we don't have the technology to observe hasn't been observed? wowsies.

I'll stop responding here though. "the best most predictive theory ever" argument has shifted to "well we just build theories as we go and they are constantly changing. Predicting nothing and being wrong about lots of things is just part of the process."

There's no scientific argument against fiction which stretches over the gaps of what we understand. You are correct there.
 

Captain Suave

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That's not at all what I said, and I maintain that you don't understand how science works.
 
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Lambourne

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Dark matter feels like a kludge, this isn't a new insight. No one disputes that there must be errors in the data and/or in the theory. One theory fits 8 out of 10 pieces of data, the other fits the other 2 but only 3 of the other bits of data. Finding where the errors are is the hard part because you need incredibly detailed knowledge of each bit of data (and how it is measured) to even understand the conventional wisdom.

I've looked into it enough to know that I'm no more qualified to discuss it than I am 19th century Chinese grammar. Popular science explanations only go so far.

If you really know better, well, go prove it and maybe you'll be the first person to collect a Nobel in a fur suit. This decade feels incredibly silly so far so maybe you really will.

Realistically though, I think it will be an AI because we might well be limited by the human brain, figuring this out might need an understanding simultaneously deeper and broader than a human can have.


1735559850076.png
 

Furry

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<Gold Donor>
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Dark matter feels like a kludge, this isn't a new insight. No one disputes that there must be errors in the data and/or in the theory. One theory fits 8 out of 10 pieces of data, the other fits the other 2 but only 3 of the other bits of data. Finding where the errors are is the hard part because you need incredibly detailed knowledge of each bit of data (and how it is measured) to even understand the conventional wisdom.

I've looked into it enough to know that I'm no more qualified to discuss it than I am 19th century Chinese grammar. Popular science explanations only go so far.

If you really know better, well, go prove it and maybe you'll be the first person to collect a Nobel in a fur suit. This decade feels incredibly silly so far so maybe you really will.

Realistically though, I think it will be an AI because we might well be limited by the human brain, figuring this out might need an understanding simultaneously deeper and broader than a human can have.
At least quote me if you want to respond to me. I'm trying to figure out your point. The big bang theory fits 0/10 pieces of data until its updated to match 2/10 after the point of observation. Yea other theories are just as bad, so what? Bullshit theories aren't made any less bullshit because the other theories are just as bullshit.

My schtick on this forum has been pointing out awful science with citation for 20+ years. The big bang is awful science much like global warming or (not nearly even close to as bad as...) quantum entanglement. If I gave one iota about what the right answer was I'd be posting my theories. I don't care, and I'm not posting those theories.

Thinking that an AI will somehow save us from the loop of prior reasoning being reinforced by calculative explanation does not seem likely. As a mathematical amalgamation of retarded reddit posters, AI will likely be.. a reflection of its creators.
 
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Borzak

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The Meade and Orion telescope company auctions were coming up after they shut down a while back. Today I saw the auction was cancelled and they said someone bought all stock and IP at once ahead of the auction which apparently was an option. I can see the stock selling, Meade IP is probably worth something since they actually made stuff. I can't see Orion name being much of a name since they only branded stuff made by someone else to their specs. The unsold stuff would sell easily I guess.

Astronomics sent out an email for a 150mm f/8 ED lanthanum doublet refractor they have been working on. Just under $3k. That sounds very low but I'm old. I can remember decades ago just getting an 80mm ED refractor was something and not cheap.
 
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Lambourne

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Starship test 7 now scheduled for the 15th, 4pm CT

 
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Kajiimagi

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I read the glenn rocket launch hasn't been rescheduled. They need time to figure out wtf first.