The Big Bad Console Thread - Sway your Station with an Xboner !

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The Master

Bronze Squire
2,084
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Dizzam_sl said:
I'm getting the XB1, and I completely agree with this statement, if by "better system" you mean more powerful. I'm not sure that anyone (sane) is debating that.
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Actually that is what Veil was saying and if you read his response, he doubled-down. So... actually I think we agree.
 
Aaron

Aaron

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Every time I look into this thread it makes me glad I don't own a console and have no intention of ever buying one. I'm not saying that those of you who like to play on consoles are "wrong" - but it does seem that for a long time you've been getting the short end of the stick when it comes to games what with the hardware defects, inflated price and shit like that. Now I'd love to mount my PC gaming moral high horse - but it has ceased to exist, at least for now. I feel that to some extent we are to increasingly getting shat on, at least from MS.

It seems to me that a large portion of the gaming industry has, as some have mentioned here before, turned their backs on gaming and simply want more control. This is true regardless of whether you're looking at the XB1, PS4 or Win8 (let's not talk about Macs!). I think the only thing that might save gaming is a move to Linux for PCs, and possibly 3rd party consoles for console fans. But it will be tough to change the current climate.
 
S

Sean_sl

shitlord
4,735
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Quaid_sl said:
Again man... Where is this data you are getting?

That article you linked is not a press release from Sony, or anything close to confirming either side uses a unified memory architecture. Especially one developed by, or in collaboration with AMD.

Trust me, I've looked... Cuz if they did utilize hUMA (officially) I would have preordered one because then at least one aspect of either of these systems would have felt 'next gen' to me.
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Uh, have you not read about the PS4 hardware at all? It's really pretty clearly a unified memory architecture.

Cerny has talked about the system and its internals multiple times:Gamasutra - Inside the PlayStation 4 With Mark Cerny

Sony's custom work is basically the basis for AMD's next line of hardware:http://www.redgamingtech.com/playsta...-similarities/

Mark Cerny - the lead architect behind the Playstation 4 has spoken heavily of some of the changes that he and his team had made concerning the PS4's hardware. Below is a direct quote from Mark Cerny:

"First, we added another bus to the GPU that allows it to read directly from system memory or write directly to system memory, bypassing its own L1 and L2 caches. As a result, if the data that's being passed back and forth between CPU and GPU is small, you don't have issues with synchronization between them anymore. And by small, I just mean small in next-gen terms. We can pass almost 20 gigabytes a second down that bus. That's not very small in today's terms - it's larger than the PCIe on most PCs!

"Next, to support the case where you want to use the GPU L2 cache simultaneously for both graphics processing and asynchronous compute, we have added a bit in the tags of the cache lines, we call it the 'volatile' bit. You can then selectively mark all accesses by compute as 'volatile,' and when it's time for compute to read from system memory, it can invalidate, selectively, the lines it uses in the L2. When it comes time to write back the results, it can write back selectively the lines that it uses. This innovation allows compute to use the GPU L2 cache and perform the required operations without significantly impacting the graphics operations going on at the same time - in other words, it radically reduces the overhead of running compute and graphics together on the GPU."

Thirdly, said Cerny, "The original AMD GCN architecture allowed for one source of graphics commands, and two sources of compute commands. For PS4, we've worked with AMD to increase the limit to 64 sources of compute commands - the idea is if you have some asynchronous compute you want to perform, you put commands in one of these 64 queues, and then there are multiple levels of arbitration in the hardware to determine what runs, how it runs, and when it runs, alongside the graphics that's in the system."
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Elerion

Elerion

N00b
735
46
aaron_sl said:
Every time I look into this thread it makes me glad I don't own a console and have no intention of ever buying one. I'm not saying that those of you who like to play on consoles are "wrong" - but it does seem that for a long time you've been getting the short end of the stick when it comes to games what with the hardware defects, inflated price and shit like that. Now I'd love to mount my PC gaming moral high horse - but it has ceased to exist, at least for now. I feel that to some extent we are to increasingly getting shat on, at least from MS.

It seems to me that a large portion of the gaming industry has, as some have mentioned here before, turned their backs on gaming and simply want more control. This is true regardless of whether you're looking at the XB1, PS4 or Win8 (let's not talk about Macs!). I think the only thing that might save gaming is a move to Linux for PCs, and possibly 3rd party consoles for console fans. But it will be tough to change the current climate.
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I purchased my PS3 for like $700 6 years ago, and I just played the biggest game of this generation on it a few weeks ago. The graphics were fairly good and it never dropped to unplayable frame rates. Could I have done the same with a PC from 2007? Probably not. I've upgraded my PC twice since then, each time costing $1000. Given the availability of discounted older games and the superior control scheme I won't stop using my PC as my main gaming rig in the foreseeable future, but console gaming doesn't suffer from "inflated prices" in any sense. For people that generally want to play games when they are new, it's the cheapest option. Hardware defects and issues are far more common on PCs as well.

Also, I don't think we have any reason to complain that the industry has "turned its back on gaming". In the last 24 months we have seen more fantastic games than in any 24 month period I can remember historically. I think you're just bitter.
 
Noodleface

Noodleface

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I bought two PS3s. I went halfsies with my brother on a launch PS3, and then later when I moved out I bought my own slim version. I have never in my life played such an everloving amount of fuck out of a system before in my life. What short end of the stick are you referring to?
 
Soygen

Soygen

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One
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C

Column_sl

shitlord
9,833
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I just hope there is allot of exclusives for the PS4, because right now there is no point for me to buy the games coming out on the PC for my PS4.
 
Aaron

Aaron

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Elerion_sl said:
I purchased my PS3 for like $700 6 years ago, and I just played the biggest game of this generation on it a few weeks ago. The graphics were fairly good and it never dropped to unplayable frame rates. Could I have done the same with a PC from 2007? Probably not. I've upgraded my PC twice since then, each time costing $1000. Given the availability of discounted older games and the superior control scheme I won't stop using my PC as my main gaming rig in the foreseeable future, but console gaming doesn't suffer from "inflated prices" in any sense. For people that generally want to play games when they are new, it's the cheapest option. Hardware defects and issues are far more common on PCs as well.

Also, I don't think we have any reason to complain that the industry has "turned its back on gaming". In the last 24 months we have seen more fantastic games than in any 24 month period I can remember historically. I think you're just bitter.
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Well, I live in a small European nation, and if you buy a console title out of the store it costs about $70-80 at least, compared to buying a PC release through Steam for $40-50, so that's what I meant by price inflation. But even if this example is in the extreme, from what I have seen console titles are generally speaking more expensive than PC titles.

Also, I didn't mean that games were less fun than before, but that they restrict you ever more. SimCity is probably the shining example of this, but there are many more. Single player games (or campaigns within games) that require an always on internet connection and shit like that really piss me off. Now, maybe I'm venting my anger at the incorrect source, namely the game developers, and this sort of control freak stuff originates in some other department (marketing? legal?) or maybe from the publishers, licencors or some other part of the game making process that is not directly tied to coding, design and such, so I could be wrong on that account.
 
DickTrickle

DickTrickle

Definitely NOT Furor Planedefiler
13,404
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aaron_sl said:
Every time I look into this thread it makes me glad I don't own a console and have no intention of ever buying one. I'm not saying that those of you who like to play on consoles are "wrong" - but it does seem that for a long time you've been getting the short end of the stick when it comes to games what with the hardware defects, inflated price and shit like that. Now I'd love to mount my PC gaming moral high horse - but it has ceased to exist, at least for now. I feel that to some extent we are to increasingly getting shat on, at least from MS.

It seems to me that a large portion of the gaming industry has, as some have mentioned here before, turned their backs on gaming and simply want more control. This is true regardless of whether you're looking at the XB1, PS4 or Win8 (let's not talk about Macs!). I think the only thing that might save gaming is a move to Linux for PCs, and possibly 3rd party consoles for console fans. But it will be tough to change the current climate.
Click to expand...
Honestly have no idea what you're going on about.
 
Elerion

Elerion

N00b
735
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aaron_sl said:
Well, I live in a small European nation, and if you buy a console title out of the store it costs about $70-80 at least, compared to buying a PC release through Steam for $40-50, so that's what I meant by price inflation. But even if this example is in the extreme, from what I have seen console titles are generally speaking more expensive than PC titles.
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I don't know where you live, but in Norway I paid NOK 500 for GTA5 for PS3 in a physical store. If I was to buy Arkham Origins on Steam right now, that would be ?60 = NOK 489. There used to be a discrepancy, but it seems to be wiped out now. For the next generation it seems that all the games can be purchased online for the consoles anyway (correct me if I'm wrong).

Also, I didn't mean that games were less fun than before, but that they restrict you ever more. SimCity is probably the shining example of this, but there are many more. Single player games (or campaigns within games) that require an always on internet connection and shit like that really piss me off. Now, maybe I'm venting my anger at the incorrect source, namely the game developers, and this sort of control freak stuff originates in some other department (marketing? legal?) or maybe from the publishers, licencors or some other part of the game making process that is not directly tied to coding, design and such, so I could be wrong on that account.
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Sim City was just a bad game on a bad online model. It's not indicative of your typical AAA release nowadays. Skyrim, XCOM, Saints Row, Bioshock Infinite - these are some of the gold standard games of the last two years, none of them have such restrictions. The always on internet requirement usually pops up in games where multiplayer is the core part of the experience. And though I'm no big fan of always on internet requirements when they do pop up, it sure as fuck beats the intrusive, PC destroying rootkit anti-piracy models we saw 5 years ago.
 
Vaclav

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
12,650
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If you're worried about cost don't they allow resales and rentals over there? I don't care for such generally but they attack the value argument handedly - there's NO PC rentals and one new trade in can be $40+ of credit back on a game in the states.

Just from turning in old physical copies I got free from PS+ the last couple months I've got three free games waiting for me at this point. (I was getting doubled up a ton though think it was a 7-8 game pile)
 
Tuco

Tuco

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aaron_sl said:
Well, I live in a small European nation, and if you buy a console title out of the store it costs about $70-80 at least, compared to buying a PC release through Steam for $40-50, so that's what I meant by price inflation. But even if this example is in the extreme, from what I have seen console titles are generally speaking more expensive than PC titles.

Also, I didn't mean that games were less fun than before, but that they restrict you ever more. SimCity is probably the shining example of this, but there are many more. Single player games (or campaigns within games) that require an always on internet connection and shit like that really piss me off. Now, maybe I'm venting my anger at the incorrect source, namely the game developers, and this sort of control freak stuff originates in some other department (marketing? legal?) or maybe from the publishers, licencors or some other part of the game making process that is not directly tied to coding, design and such, so I could be wrong on that account.
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At least the most egregious of always on internet connection singleplayer games were stains on their franchise. (Simcity and diablo3)
 
C

Cor_sl

shitlord
487
0
Drinsic_sl said:
Is there a confirmation somewhere of what resolution it's running at on consoles?
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The embargo on console footage ends around 5pm bst tomorrow. There should be a lot of footage released then. Expect PS4 to run at 900p and Xbox One to run at 720p.
 
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