The D&D thread

I would buy that they are trying to eliminate in game racism- it sounds like par for the course for them- But I haven't seen anything from them directly saying so. Can you point to anything at all they have said directly? I'm curious.

off the top of my head i can't remember specifics, and i think wizards are trying to say very little specifically because they don't want to get caught backpedaling anymore than they already are. but i KNOW i've read some stuff where they've talked about reducing that kind of thing. i'll see what i can find and post back

Who gives any fucks what so ever? If you are a gm, run your game how you want. If you are a player, find a GM who runs it how you want. It's not like they are showing up on your doorstep and forcing you to play any certain way.

Also, racial tropes of 'everyone of a certain race is evil' are stupid and unrealistic.

if there was any actual in game racism, like some kind of black minstrel race with giant red lips or a race that just wears sombreros and sleeps under cacti, I would be against that. And I'm all for fleshing out races like orcs to make them a more full and realistic culture. But I don't really understand their mentality, and wormie's meme is pretty spot on. Cringe as fuck.

As for LoTR being inspired by WW2, he had much of the story already prior to WW2, he had been writing it since WW1. In addition to what he said about allegory, I don't think he wanted anyone drawing parallels to real life because he wanted the story to last, not be some political story for the moment. The comparison only really fits if you strain it and completely dehumanize the Axis powers, which I don't know if he would have liked.

They did 'flesh out' Orcs in 3.0/3.5. It was a major turning point in the Forgotten Realms and the Drizzt saga.

Obould Many-Arrows (Orc Chieften/Chosen) beat the dwarven nations and the combined forces of the North to force them to give his people a large portion of land as a sovereign nation, including trading rights and peace treaties.

But they just erased it all to reset the status-quo as they do with EVERY SINGLE NEW EDITION.

If any of you guys are using Foundry or considering it but don't want to due to having to rebuy all your roll20 shit again, 5etools has a module for everything.

And I mean EVERYTHING.

It's..all......so............tiresome.

I find the people whom are offended by 'issues' with race in a fantasy GAME insufferable.

Let's be sure to avoid the remote possibility of an inference between orcs and Blacks, but we'll all sit around the table and cackle after hundreds of innocent villagers get murdered by our wizards Earthquake spell.

I go out of my way to trigger the absolute fuck out of those people at real gaming tables.

It's my favorite when they come to me after a session about my "problematic" behavior. I swear I can nearly orgasm when I tell them to get fucked and leave if they don't like the way I run games.

Surprisingly, of the few players that have gotten triggered, most shut the fuck up and play after I draw the hard line. And they should because our game is 'normal.' Harsh realities exist (slavery, rape, etc) but they're not fetishized or grossly embellished in narration.

You sound like someone who is awful to play games with. I'm glad I don't have to play with a piece of shit like you.

Arden said:

Honest question: are they trying to eliminate "in game" racism, like you are describing? Or are they trying to prevent traditional real world tropes and assumptions that they believe are racist from influencing the game? Because everything I've read seems like the latter- but i fully admit I might not have read something that indicates the former.

Before you guys flip out, I actually have serious issues with both approaches, but like I said, I haven't seen what you are describing (yet).

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Frankly, I've seen nothing concrete. (Though I may have missed a post pages back where it was discussed more in depth). I'd say the latter is more likely, but in doing so, I'm not sure how it wouldn't alter both in some way.

Fyff said:

Who gives any fucks what so ever? If you are a gm, run your game how you want. If you are a player, find a GM who runs it how you want. It's not like they are showing up on your doorstep and forcing you to play any certain way.

Also, racial tropes of 'everyone of a certain race is evil' are stupid and unrealistic.

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Yeah, I feel this way 95%. I'm gonna run the game how I want. Still, I feel like potentially eliminating a real world concept, no matter how unpalatable, would diminish one of the most attractive elements of D&D: Creating a world that's so nuanced (despite being fantasy) that it feels real.

As an aside, I have also volunteered at a local high school D&D club. I think acting out notions of race in a safe space in a low stakes, imaginary setting among friends can be really helpful to kids who are developing their understanding of who they are and how they are perceived in society. Race is obviously one aspect of that understanding, so why sweep it under the rug? The real world won't.

That said, sexual encounters have always been off the books, but that has NEVER stopped my players from.. threading that needle. So worst case scenario, I guess race would just become another one of those unspoken but frequently indulged in aspects of the game.

Fyff said:

You sound like someone who is awful to play games with. I'm glad I don't have to play with a piece of shit like you.

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I'm sure the feeling would be mutual if you're able to draw any reasonable conclusion that I'm "a piece of shit" because I have zero tolerance for whiny faggots that foam at the mouth about slave traders existing in Faerun. Not to mention the cults/societies that sometimes buy captives for rituals/magical experimentation.

You faggots need to all find each other so you can play in your safe space. Leave the rest of us alone so we can game in peace while listening to Conan the Barbarian/Destroyer in the background.

Anyone who 'goes out of their way' to trigger people over a game where everyone is there to have fun is a piece of shit. I don't care what macho bullshit you try and use to justify it. You are everything that is wrong with people in the TTRPG community.

Yeah, do you have any specific examples of people that have been "triggered" by something you did while DMing? What was it? I assume you're playing with a lot of randoms at game stores or online. You can't please everyone, but I feel like the people I play with in my free time are all friends and would all generally be okay with whatever the hell I did at the table. I can't picture a circumstance where I would deliberately trying to offend someone with some off the wall shit. Part of my enjoyment is when my table's enjoying themselves, but knock yourself out.

Fyff said:

Anyone who 'goes out of their way' to trigger people over a game where everyone is there to have fun is a piece of shit. I don't care what macho bullshit you try and use to justify it. You are everything that is wrong with people in the TTRPG community.

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Ok, queen.

Ya, we're all there to have fun, but too many snowflakes create problems.

Here's a single type of example that's happened in my games -- I've had TWO players (two separate occasions) dramatically get up and leave the table because "they needed a break" from the scene. One even came back pretending to be quivering so badly that he had to have the player next to him roll his dice for him over the next hour......pathetic.

Anyway,

One of the scenarios was about the smuggling of children out of Calimport via ship. The players were the heroes intent on stopping the trafficking. There were no disgusting details beyond the fact that human life was being purchased.

The second situation I've experienced was even more ridiculous. I was loosely roleplaying a scene of a father not wanting his daughter to take up combat arms. The entitled fuckwit player stopped the game for 20 minutes after his 'break' to lecture me about misogyny.

I'm a good guy; great in fact. I run fun games, put in a ton of preparation/effort, and go out of my way to accommodate my players. That said, I have zero tolerance for the kind of bs those two players pulled.

D&D is not real life. Campaigns are not appropriate platforms for your attention-whoring pseudo-activism. That behavior is, at best, selfish.

I have no shame in having zero tolerance for that trash and I whole heartedly believe that once you cross that line it's completely appropriate that I craft a social scene that I KNOW will trigger the coding of those pathetic NPC humans.

Once that happens one of two things happens: They leave the game or just shut up and play. Typically the latter. Far too few people call those assholes on their "activism" and they keep pushing the envelope. It's reminiscent of bad parenting. I make it crystal clear that their tantrums aren't going to fly.


Also, I want to point out that I don't specifically target those 'type' of players. I'm protective of everyone's fun. Simply follow basic decorum and they'll have zero problems with me or the games I run.

Phanton said:

Yeah, do you have any specific examples of people that have been "triggered" by something you did while DMing? What was it? I assume you're playing with a lot of randoms at game stores or online. You can't please everyone, but I feel like the people I play with in my free time are all friends and would all generally be okay with whatever the hell I did at the table. I can't picture a circumstance where I would deliberately trying to offend someone with some off the wall shit. Part of my enjoyment is when my table's enjoying themselves, but knock yourself out.

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Part of the problem is that none of my close friends live near me and I prefer real table top to VTT so I'm forced to get my players from ads in local shops.

I always play in my house and I'm sure that element only heightens the disrespect I feel when some 22 year-old, blue-hair'd Bernie bro trys to lecture me about some real world issue he's trying to shoe horn in to a fantasy game.


D&D is becoming infested with those low-lifes.

Mmm yeah I get it now. Those people sound baby soft. Like, the girl's dad scenario? In-game you could be like "hey, fuck you old man. My mom was a great warrior, and she woulda kicked your ass. Little girl, you can be whatever you want." GG. I don't see it as misogynistic to present a scenario like this to your group. That shit happens every day. Human trafficking too, sadly. I don't get how people shove their head in the sand so far that they think they're solving an issue simply by ignoring it/avoiding it completely.

The two examples you describe would have me quoting some Bad Santa to those players...Are you fucking with me.