WarCraft (2016)

Szlia

Szlia

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jayrebb said:
You could tell it was a Chinese movie. Toothless, soulless, forgettable. No risks taken, vanilla garbage. Everything said this was not produced grass roots by an American studio.

Delaying the project for 5-6 years didn't do it any favors.
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This is wrong on both counts.

The film is a pretty big co-production that involved a number of american, chinese and japanese companies, but the project was initiated and helmed by Blizzard that basically wanted to pull a Marvel and keep total control of their property instead of selling the movie rights away (note that Ubi Soft also did that for Assassin's Creed). If you don't like the end result, you can blame Duncan Jones who directed and is responsible for the heavy rewriting of the original script (he apparently added the most interesting element : the fact it's not a "human = good, orcs = bad" story).

Chinese movies as whole can also hardly be described as "Toothless, soulless, forgettable. No risks taken, vanilla garbage." There are some mainstream chinese movies that could fit that description (like the not very inspiring fantasy cgi fest Monster Hunt) or that are at the very least the weirdest pieces of propaganda, seemingly disconnected to any kind of social reality (the rom-com Tiny Times comes to mind, or the representation of police force in Saving Mr. Wu, or of the air traffic sector in The Captain). But chinese cinema is also the home of some of the most brilliant film makers currently in activity, be it in the realm of arthouse film (Jia Zhangke, Diao Yinan, Bi Gan), documentary (Wang Bing) and also more mainstream movies (Feng Xiaogang). Many big names of Hong Kong cinema also have shot films in the mainland, like Johnnie To's Drug War. Even in the realm of propaganda pieces, some of the films are so over the top in the absurd or the violence that you would be hard pressed to call them vanilla (garbage may apply though). Even Steven Seagal never dared to do something as unabashedly dumb as Wolf Warrior 2 and even Michael Bay on coke would not do Operation Red Sea.



About Warcraft, I re-read my notes and I think its main problem was it was a little too faithful to the video games. Too faithful to the cartoonish aesthetic of WOW, that works in a game but feels extremely dated in a contemporary fantasy film, and too faithful to a story that works poorly in movie form. With a mix of poor performances and lack of screen time, some of the characters' trajectories just did not work.
 
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Fadaar

Fadaar

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Think I'd tolerate China a lot more if hearing their language didn't make me immediately reach for the mute button. Maybe it's from years of watching dubbed anime and other western languages subtitled in English but good lord, Chinese fucking hurts to listen to.
 
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Araxen

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
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Deathwing said:
No, I was referring to the wrecking Warcraft (2016) did to Warcraft lore. The Warcraft story has been passable(for a video game) at best to shit most of the time.
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lol what? They started shitting on the story with BC. The only good story is the Lich King stuff with Arthas.
 
jayrebb

jayrebb

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Szlia said:
This is wrong on both counts.

The film is a pretty big co-production that involved a number of american, chinese and japanese companies, but the project was initiated and helmed by Blizzard that basically wanted to pull a Marvel and keep total control of their property instead of selling the movie rights away (note that Ubi Soft also did that for Assassin's Creed). If you don't like the end result, you can blame Duncan Jones who directed and is responsible for the heavy rewriting of the original script (he apparently added the most interesting element : the fact it's not a "human = good, orcs = bad" story).

Chinese movies as whole can also hardly be described as "Toothless, soulless, forgettable. No risks taken, vanilla garbage." There are some mainstream chinese movies that could fit that description (like the not very inspiring fantasy cgi fest Monster Hunt) or that are at the very least the weirdest pieces of propaganda, seemingly disconnected to any kind of social reality (the rom-com Tiny Times comes to mind, or the representation of police force in Saving Mr. Wu, or of the air traffic sector in The Captain). But chinese cinema is also the home of some of the most brilliant film makers currently in activity, be it in the realm of arthouse film (Jia Zhangke, Diao Yinan, Bi Gan), documentary (Wang Bing) and also more mainstream movies (Feng Xiaogang). Many big names of Hong Kong cinema also have shot films in the mainland, like Johnnie To's Drug War. Even in the realm of propaganda pieces, some of the films are so over the top in the absurd or the violence that you would be hard pressed to call them vanilla (garbage may apply though). Even Steven Seagal never dared to do something as unabashedly dumb as Wolf Warrior 2 and even Michael Bay on coke would not do Operation Red Sea.



About Warcraft, I re-read my notes and I think its main problem was it was a little too faithful to the video games. Too faithful to the cartoonish aesthetic of WOW, that works in a game but feels extremely dated in a contemporary fantasy film, and too faithful to a story that works poorly in movie form. With a mix of poor performances and lack of screen time, some of the characters' trajectories just did not work.
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China's not going to fuck you dude.
 
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Singh'sSpot

Singh'sSpot

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How about that Warhammer movie? Don't need to have any complex story, just pick a war and have the factions duke it out.
 
Aldarion

Aldarion

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Fadaar said:
Think I'd tolerate China a lot more if hearing their language didn't make me immediately reach for the mute button. Maybe it's from years of watching dubbed anime and other western languages subtitled in English but good lord, Chinese fucking hurts to listen to.
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This. Its a funny thing, the perception of languages that one doesnt understand.

German, French, Spanish, Portugese... these are charming to listen to. Almost musical. I dunno WTF theyre saying but it sounds pleasant. There is an aesthetically pleasing quality to the sounds, completely aside from any meaning one might extract from them.

Chinese is so unpleasant (yes I know there are multiple Chinese languages, this applies to both of the ones I've heard). The grating whining tones. The slurred slushy sounds like theyre talking with a mouthful of water. The sharp variation in tones, where they're talking then all of a sudden make a sound like a 3 year old having a tantrum, then go back to lower tones.

Its hard to describe properly, but holy crap are these languages annoying to hear. The only thing I can compare it to is how some middle Eastern languages have a "clearing your throat" sound as one of their consonants. But thats kind of funny. These languages sound like someone talking and occasionally interrupting their speech with a loud comical bodily function.

Its like "talking talking talking ***clear a giant wad of plhegm*** talking talking *another giant wad of phlem** talking talking talking".

Chinese on the other hand just sounds like a long string of unpleasant sounds strung together.
 
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Gavinmad

Gavinmad

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Aldarion said:
This. Its a funny thing, the perception of languages that one doesnt understand.

German, French, Spanish, Portugese... these are charming to listen to. Almost musical. I dunno WTF theyre saying but it sounds pleasant. There is an aesthetically pleasing quality to the sounds, completely aside from any meaning one might extract from them.

Chinese is so unpleasant (yes I know there are multiple Chinese languages, this applies to both of the ones I've heard). The grating whining tones. The slurred slushy sounds like theyre talking with a mouthful of water. The sharp variation in tones, where they're talking then all of a sudden make a sound like a 3 year old having a tantrum, then go back to lower tones.

Its hard to describe properly, but holy crap are these languages annoying to hear. The only thing I can compare it to is how some middle Eastern languages have a "clearing your throat" sound as one of their consonants. But thats kind of funny. These languages sound like someone talking and occasionally interrupting their speech with a loud comical bodily function.

Its like "talking talking talking ***clear a giant wad of plhegm*** talking talking *another giant wad of phlem** talking talking talking".

Chinese on the other hand just sounds like a long string of unpleasant sounds strung together.
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Chinese is fine.

Thai is the worst thing I've ever heard.
 
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Alex

Alex

Still a Music Elitist
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Gavinmad said:
Thai is the worst thing I've ever heard.
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Yes. When I was in Thailand at the beginning of the year nothing was worse than when your driver was listening to Thai talk radio. Very annoying language. Kinda sounds like baby noises.
 
Xarpolis

Xarpolis

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Thailand doesn't have many hot chicks either. Do a google search, you'll be disappointed. I guess that's why lady boys are so big out there.

We could skip over them in the coming genetics war.
 
Sevens

Sevens

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Every time I watch a Vietnam war movie I want to kick a puppy, I hate the high pitched whiney noise (usually) the females make that is suppose to be "language". Drives me apeshit. I also hate french, such a wimpy language that even when a moderately macho man speaks it they just sound gay.
 
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Chris

Chris

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Szlia said:
About Warcraft, I re-read my notes and I think its main problem was it was a little too faithful to the video games. Too faithful to the cartoonish aesthetic of WOW, that works in a game but feels extremely dated in a contemporary fantasy film, and too faithful to a story that works poorly in movie form. With a mix of poor performances and lack of screen time, some of the characters' trajectories just did not work.
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I agree about the art style but the story wasn't faithful at all.

WC1 is The Horde systematically destroying every town in the Kingdom of Stormwind, before destroying the city itself. There's a subplot about Ogres in the Deadmines and Medivh/Khadgar/Garona investigating the origins of The Horde at Kharazan and eventually Medivh/Garona's betrayals and the death of King Llane.

The movie has several elements from later in the story:

Gul'dan as the power behind Warchief Blackhand is from WC2 and could have been saved for when there's a new Warchief Doomhammer in a second movie. Durotan's story is from WC3 and could have been saved for a flashback in a third movie. You can show them but don't explore the characters yet.

There's a trip to Ironforge, a trip to Dalaran and scenes with High Elves/Dwarves which only appeared in WC2 and could have been saved for a second movie. Have some in the background but forming The Alliance is the next story.

Additionally WC1 has parallel Human/Orc campsigns and whatever side you played win. WC2 assumed an Orc victory. The movie had a Human victory which derails the entire story which comes next.
 
j00t

j00t

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Quineloe said:
wait, what?
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yeah, i thought the same thing. i mean, personally i don't have a problem with german but let's not pretend it's nice to listen to like french or spanish. it's got the exact same "gutteral consonants" that middle eastern languages have that he complained about...
 
Szlia

Szlia

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Chris said:
I agree about the art style but the story wasn't faithful at all.
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My choice of word was probably not the best. I trust you that the film's story does not match closely to the one of the games, but, correct me if I am wrong, it is faithful to the type of story the game tells, in the sense that it attempts to chronicle a war, so you have many places, many characters, many point of views, back stories for it all, etc. It can work in games, in literature, in TV shows even, but in a single movie, not so much. I mean the story is even less focused than in the Lord of the Ring, where you at least have the fellowship's clear trajectory. So when I saw Warcraft, I could not shake off the feeling that the story did not work and the characters had no room to exist, because it tried to shoehorn into a movie a type of story inadequate for the medium.
 
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