Weight Loss Thread
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Pasteton
Blackwing Lair Raider
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Been eating one of these every day and it’s awesome highly recommend if you are doing the meal replacement bar thing. They’re basically the tastiest protein bar you’ll ever have PEANUT BUTTER - Box of 12
ToeMissile
Pronouns: zie/zhem/zer
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I’ve been working on integrating some of these into my daily routine, specifically the light related stuff in the morning and avoiding caffeine until at least 1.5 hours after I wake up, it seems to be making an improvement in wakefulness/alertness during the day. There’s a ton more detail on the podcast, super interesting.
hubermanlab.com
Toolkit for Sleep
The first Neural Network newsletter provides actionable tools, including a 12 step guide, to improve sleep.
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TheNozz
Karazhan Raider
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So question:
Is organic food overrated/ultimately not worth the difference in price?
I buy organic pasture raised eggs and organic grass fed milk for my dairy.
the price difference is incredibly noticeable. but, those are the only two organic products i buy. is it worth it if i dont consume anything else thats organic?
Is organic food overrated/ultimately not worth the difference in price?
I buy organic pasture raised eggs and organic grass fed milk for my dairy.
the price difference is incredibly noticeable. but, those are the only two organic products i buy. is it worth it if i dont consume anything else thats organic?
Fogel
Mr. Poopybutthole
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Not in my opinion. One of the bigger selling points on organics was supposed to be pesticide use, but any US domestic produce is already very safe due to all the pesticide regulations. For example, our plant produces eggplant but the FDA says its so safe that we don't have to do any type of pesticide testing, where as if we imported produce, we'd have to test for pesticides. I wouldn't waste the money.
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Asshat wormie
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Organic, ultimately, is a nonsense label used for marketing. Pasture-raised conveys some meaningful information. While cage-free and free-range are useless word play as both are just fluff covering up the fact that chickens are limited to a small and enclosed area that is mostly inside (free-range requires access to the outside but does not specific the size of the outside area), pasture-raised requires actual open space for chickens to run around in. According to some studies, chickens that get to run around lay more nutritional eggs when compared to those limited to small enclosed areas and especially when compared to those who do not get to move around at all.
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Asshat wormie
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"
What is meant by grass-fed beef?
Simply put, grass-finished beef comes from cattle that ate nothing but grass and forage for their entire lives. Grass-fed, on the other hand, may be used to label meat from cattle that were started on a grass diet but have either received supplemental grain feed or are finished on a fully grain-based diet."
gimmick
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LiquidDeath
Magnus Deadlift the Fucktiger
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All beef is grass-fed. The real difference comes in finishing (last few months of life). Grass finished just keeps them on the same diet where grain-finished moves them to a corn/grain based diet to fatten them up.
My family raised a cow for slaughter every year when I was growing up and we always finished them on grain for the fat content. I prefer the taste of a grain-finished steak, in fact.
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Springbok
Karen
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Yeah we have a guy in Western Oklahoma we have been buying meat from for a few years - started out grass fed/grain finished and was really really good. He switched to grass fed & finished last year and it's not nearly as good. In fact, we're looking for another rancher to get our bulk meat from now as the ground beef from the grass finished in particular wasn't very good imo.
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Borzak
Bronze Baron of the Realm
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They try to make Soy sound like it's healthier than other shit. Soybeans are one of the heaviest and most often sprayed crop there is. See them being sprayed from the air several times a year.
Until recently I ate a lot of organic stuff, not from the store. Purple hull peas someone down the road grew and they never sprayed anything cause that would have been work and cost money. Eat a pig someone had up at the house they would fatten up with table scraps a short time before slaughtering. Still get stuff like if you live in a rural enough area. Always kept 3 cows for ag exemption and they only got to eat the bahia pasture grass and off to slaughter, cheap and was okay eating.
Late summer I can nearly eat my weight (not really) of muscadines while out in the field. Never sprayed and such, just wild grape.
On an inerview once in WA state guy was tooling me around town and we stopped at an overlook so I could see the town and him give me his "come work her spiel" I picked a blackberry off a bush and ate it "OMG you didn't spray it off and it's not labeled organic". I passed on that job, no way in hell we would have ever gotten along.
Spend enough time in the woods and rural areas you always find something to eat.
Until recently I ate a lot of organic stuff, not from the store. Purple hull peas someone down the road grew and they never sprayed anything cause that would have been work and cost money. Eat a pig someone had up at the house they would fatten up with table scraps a short time before slaughtering. Still get stuff like if you live in a rural enough area. Always kept 3 cows for ag exemption and they only got to eat the bahia pasture grass and off to slaughter, cheap and was okay eating.
Late summer I can nearly eat my weight (not really) of muscadines while out in the field. Never sprayed and such, just wild grape.
On an inerview once in WA state guy was tooling me around town and we stopped at an overlook so I could see the town and him give me his "come work her spiel" I picked a blackberry off a bush and ate it "OMG you didn't spray it off and it's not labeled organic". I passed on that job, no way in hell we would have ever gotten along.
Spend enough time in the woods and rural areas you always find something to eat.
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Rezz
Mr. Poopybutthole
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Organic thing is and always has been a scam. The nutritional differences are negligible, and there's varying levels of organic. Not to mention, the entire farm doesn't have to be 95/85/70% synthetic pesticide free (that's what they test when they "certify" a farm - the amount of synthetic pesticides of certain types in the soil/water) - only the areas tested have to be, and the certification doesn't get revoked immediately if there's runoff from another farm into yours. Farms will often grow a high yield "safe" crop that they don't have to worry about using a lot of treatments on, then also grow some -very- heavily treated plants that they can sell for much higher with the organic tag. As long as they stay above the 70% "free" aggregate at the test sites, they can retain their organic certification.
It's basically less total work with some scamminess mixed in to generate higher prices because of a label that effectively means "The soil/water at select parts of our farm are 70% synthetic commercial pesticide free" - Organic shit isn't better for you; it's better for the wallet of the person selling it to you.
The animal side of things is literally just "room to roam" "not fed synthetic materials" "no antibiotics/horomones." That's effectively it. The type of "fed" has nothing to do with being organic or not. It's just a lot of word salad to charge higher prices at the register. Flavor differences? Yeah; how the animal is finished will definitely impact the flavor, but that's basically about it. You could eat standard commercial products every day vs. spending 3-5x as much for the "organic" variant and you would have no noticeable difference in health outcomes at all. Not to mention if you touch multi-vitamins for any reason, you are going to crap/piss out any potential difference because those things are loaded with way more than you need, so the .01% more B12 you were getting from your $5.99 organic carrots isn't going to matter.
Had to do a lot of research when I worked in the UC system doing food; basically kept getting pulled off campus ad campaigns afterwards because the "facts" we were trying to promote about how magically healthy our overpriced food was compared to the same ingredients just not organically labeled were misleading and in most cases just flat out wrong.
Not that it mattered; the nutritional information was wrong 90% of the time because -every- cook in every dining common thought they were a Michelin star chef and fucked with the recipes, so the information for every meal was just flat out wrong.
The organic stuff has been a pet peeve of mine for 20 years =|
It's basically less total work with some scamminess mixed in to generate higher prices because of a label that effectively means "The soil/water at select parts of our farm are 70% synthetic commercial pesticide free" - Organic shit isn't better for you; it's better for the wallet of the person selling it to you.
The animal side of things is literally just "room to roam" "not fed synthetic materials" "no antibiotics/horomones." That's effectively it. The type of "fed" has nothing to do with being organic or not. It's just a lot of word salad to charge higher prices at the register. Flavor differences? Yeah; how the animal is finished will definitely impact the flavor, but that's basically about it. You could eat standard commercial products every day vs. spending 3-5x as much for the "organic" variant and you would have no noticeable difference in health outcomes at all. Not to mention if you touch multi-vitamins for any reason, you are going to crap/piss out any potential difference because those things are loaded with way more than you need, so the .01% more B12 you were getting from your $5.99 organic carrots isn't going to matter.
Had to do a lot of research when I worked in the UC system doing food; basically kept getting pulled off campus ad campaigns afterwards because the "facts" we were trying to promote about how magically healthy our overpriced food was compared to the same ingredients just not organically labeled were misleading and in most cases just flat out wrong.
Not that it mattered; the nutritional information was wrong 90% of the time because -every- cook in every dining common thought they were a Michelin star chef and fucked with the recipes, so the information for every meal was just flat out wrong.
The organic stuff has been a pet peeve of mine for 20 years =|
BrutulTM
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"Organic" meat means the animals were fed organic feed which is why you don't see it very often. "Natural" beef means that it was raised without synthetic hormones or antibiotics and is much more common.
Organic doesn't really mean healthier, or better for the environment, it just means that synthetic pesticides weren't used. In some cases they use "organic" pesticides which can be toxic themselves but as long as they are "natural" it doesn't count. That said though, there are real issues with the amount of pesticide being used and glyphosate is basically in everything now including breast milk. Luckily it's one of the least toxic pesticides and I don't believe that the link to cancer with glyphosate is well supported. There is concern that it is fucking with our microbiome but I don't think that's really understood right now. It's definitely ruining our soil along with a lot of other things that come from industrial agriculture so that might be a consideration for some but from a purely health standpoint, it's pretty hard to say that eating organic is going to make a significant difference in your health one way or the other. It's my belief that sooner or later we're going to have to dispense with pesticides because more and more plants are becoming resistant to them and we're not finding any new ones. Insecticides kill beneficial and predator insects as well as the problem bugs and I really think in a lot of situations they make things worse long term.
Grass fed beef doesn't have to be leaner than grain fed. It's harder though, and takes longer to get cattle fat without grain and I think some people give grass fed beef a bad name by just selling under-finished animals because they don't want to wait for them to fatten up on forage. We eat beef we raise ourselves and fatten on grass and I think it tastes great. Better than you get in a typical steakhouse anyway. There are people who feel differently though. My own aunt and uncle won't buy beef from us because they want it grain fattened. Some people that do buy from us think it tastes much better than what you get at the store. YMMV I guess.
Organic doesn't really mean healthier, or better for the environment, it just means that synthetic pesticides weren't used. In some cases they use "organic" pesticides which can be toxic themselves but as long as they are "natural" it doesn't count. That said though, there are real issues with the amount of pesticide being used and glyphosate is basically in everything now including breast milk. Luckily it's one of the least toxic pesticides and I don't believe that the link to cancer with glyphosate is well supported. There is concern that it is fucking with our microbiome but I don't think that's really understood right now. It's definitely ruining our soil along with a lot of other things that come from industrial agriculture so that might be a consideration for some but from a purely health standpoint, it's pretty hard to say that eating organic is going to make a significant difference in your health one way or the other. It's my belief that sooner or later we're going to have to dispense with pesticides because more and more plants are becoming resistant to them and we're not finding any new ones. Insecticides kill beneficial and predator insects as well as the problem bugs and I really think in a lot of situations they make things worse long term.
Grass fed beef doesn't have to be leaner than grain fed. It's harder though, and takes longer to get cattle fat without grain and I think some people give grass fed beef a bad name by just selling under-finished animals because they don't want to wait for them to fatten up on forage. We eat beef we raise ourselves and fatten on grass and I think it tastes great. Better than you get in a typical steakhouse anyway. There are people who feel differently though. My own aunt and uncle won't buy beef from us because they want it grain fattened. Some people that do buy from us think it tastes much better than what you get at the store. YMMV I guess.
Lanx
<Prior Amod>
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i don't give in to organic shit, i'll probably be visiting friends who get the 150$ organic whole foods turkey, but i will not ever buy tyson chicken, whatever the fuck they inject those boobies with, is fucking weird.
ToeMissile
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I think the label “organic” as managed by whichever govt agencies is as prone to fuckery like anything else (hello stock market), but I’m all for reducing the amount of chemicals and shit we put into the ground and our food as much as possible. 
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Rezz
Mr. Poopybutthole
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I'm not against reducing chemical usage in farming at all, I'm just opposed to how much we put emphasis on "organic" labeling when in a very large swatch of cases, it's basically a scam that is perpetrated by manipulating aggregate test site numbers. What I would prefer is intelligent use of chemicals that mitigates damage to the environment (synthetic doesn't automatically mean bad for the environment) and maximizes yield on acreage. I'd also like to see the corn subsidies dry up completely, but that's a separate issue entirely.
A -lot- of the evil attributed to companies like Monsanto or whatever they are called now, is due to the legal practices they engage in when it comes to the natural migration of seeds from crops. The growers that run into issues with them are typically part of seedshares that don't want to pay for the roundup-ready stuff, but due to things like uh... the air, it spreads and then there's a percentage of crops that have the gene and the lawyers get sic'd on them. If they could afford it, the farmers who are running afoul would 100% use the roundup ready stuff in a legal fashion, it's just hella expensive for non-massive growing ops. The legal shit is pure evil and I'll agree with that all day, but the nature of genetically modified plants and the methods of maximizing their growth is enviable by most farms. It's the fart smellers that don't get that, or the ones who do not need to rely on their crops to make a living. Or, and this is the case for most California growers at least, they are gaming the absolute shit out of the system and selling their goods to places like Whole Foods at a premium, because that 70% is an aggregate and you can still use incredibly toxic pesticides as long as the total farm aggregate doesn't go below 70% synthetic free.
It's the scamminess of the whole thing that bothers me; not the actual utilization of organic crops/animals. That $3.50 "organic" cabbage is almost certainly being grown with the same chemical mix that is used on the $1.80 cabbage, but the big ass field of yellow onions they are just spraying water on nearby when being grown is how that price difference comes around. That's the stuff I'm bothered by.
A -lot- of the evil attributed to companies like Monsanto or whatever they are called now, is due to the legal practices they engage in when it comes to the natural migration of seeds from crops. The growers that run into issues with them are typically part of seedshares that don't want to pay for the roundup-ready stuff, but due to things like uh... the air, it spreads and then there's a percentage of crops that have the gene and the lawyers get sic'd on them. If they could afford it, the farmers who are running afoul would 100% use the roundup ready stuff in a legal fashion, it's just hella expensive for non-massive growing ops. The legal shit is pure evil and I'll agree with that all day, but the nature of genetically modified plants and the methods of maximizing their growth is enviable by most farms. It's the fart smellers that don't get that, or the ones who do not need to rely on their crops to make a living. Or, and this is the case for most California growers at least, they are gaming the absolute shit out of the system and selling their goods to places like Whole Foods at a premium, because that 70% is an aggregate and you can still use incredibly toxic pesticides as long as the total farm aggregate doesn't go below 70% synthetic free.
It's the scamminess of the whole thing that bothers me; not the actual utilization of organic crops/animals. That $3.50 "organic" cabbage is almost certainly being grown with the same chemical mix that is used on the $1.80 cabbage, but the big ass field of yellow onions they are just spraying water on nearby when being grown is how that price difference comes around. That's the stuff I'm bothered by.
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BrutulTM
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Yeah I'm not a fan of the "organic" label or the rules around it either. It's a dumb little check box of doing things that sound good to the consumer but might not actually be better for health or the environment. "Regenerative farming" is a new buzzword, but they're actually trying to do things right, measuring the amount of carbon stored in the soil and the amount of bare ground on the farm and the like. Wouldn't be surprised if it turns into a scam too once the politicians get in charge of it though.
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