World of Warcraft: Classic
- Thread starter Tmac
- Start date
-
Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!
Go here and give us your nominations!Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
Adebisi
Clump of Cells
- 27,713
- 32,825
I would /sit in a not-so-busy area of AV on my hunter, with an ice trap on my ass and an invis pet. Rogues would assume I'm AFK and try to kill me.
- 1
- 51,506
- 302,339
Nope seems Korak is just flat out removed. Fucking gaybos.
This is a subject that has been asked about several times recently, and we want to clarify some of the details surrounding it. Like many aspects of the game, Alterac Valley was tuned and adjusted in different ways from patch to patch in 2005-2006.
First and foremost, we’re planning to use the 1.12 version of Alterac Valley. For many parts of the game like this, we’re picking an original WoW patch that gives us the most clarity for WoW: Classic, and 1.12 is that patch.
In Alterac Valley, that puts us before the introduction of reinforcements. It puts us before the removal of all of the Commanders and Lieutenants. The only win conditions are the killing of Drek’thar in Frostwolf Keep or Vanndar Stormpike in Dun Baldar.
It gives us several early improvements to the BG that we’re glad to have in place. Early on in AV, there were too many NPCs and they were too hard to kill. By 1.12, many had been removed and NPC health was brought down to a reasonable level. Turning in armor scraps is an encouraged, supportive activity by this point. Many capture points (mostly graveyards) had been moved away from their initial placements to gain better balance across the map. Korak the Bloodrager was removed, and killing opposing players no longer drops items like Dwarf Spines, Orc Teeth, or Human Bone Chips. Gross.
In our content plan update, we mentioned that we’re still working out exactly how and when PvP elements of Classic will roll out. We’ll update you on that here very soon.
Actually my primary concern about Classic servers is that all static servers degenerate over time as users discover exploits and degenerative metas which become more and more abused. #nochanges people will fight any attempts to enforce an environment that was more like the original game, and they will have a legitimate argument so it's not easy to dismiss. I've been a developer for an EQ emu for the last 5.5 years, so I understand this well.
Some examples: (I could provide many)
Al'Kabor/EQMac was stuck in PoP for 10 years and developers abandoned it. What happened there? Nobody killed Vex Thal trash because they abused an exploit that allowed them to get targets for mages across the zone which they parked half a dozen of in the zone to summon the raid to each boss. The zone was essentially ruined. Behavior that would have been disallowed in 2002 had developers noticed it, but the exploit was not well known in 2002.
Then there was pet pulling, which allowed people to use low level pets to single pull anything in the game. We had that in for awhile on our emu, and the result was people pet pulling every goddamn mob in the game (fire giants, lguk named, kithicor DEs etc) which fundamentally broke a core aspect of the game. Sony developers didn't fix this at the time because it wasn't abused anywhere near the level it was on our emu, but they certainly would have if it was. (it was fixed after our era) So by demanding zero changes, #nochanges people are demanding a gameplay experience unlike the original.
Now as for WoW, I saw a YouTube video yesterday which discussed the Blizzard AV post, and it mentioned that AV was the highest honor farm for ranking. This was the exact opposite of my experience with the game in 2005: I was #1 on my server until BGs launched (I won the tabard) then my rank tanked because I did nothing but AVs. The reply I got was this:
That is badly deteriorated gameplay. Players abusing how the honor mechanics work by throwing games and ruining the experience for themselves and everybody else in the BG. It's Blizzard's fault for making such an abuseable system, but if you #nochanges the server, then it's going to end up being something unlike what we experienced in 2005-2006. WoW is less a sandbox than EQ was so it's not as severe there, but PvP ranking will probably end up quite different and AV could potentially be ruined.
Incidentally my Preform AV Enabler addon wasn't released until just several weeks before BC, so if that's usable then AV isn't going to feel very classic. I seriously hope they disable it in the same manner they did in 2012 as I do not like what it did to the game.
Some examples: (I could provide many)
Al'Kabor/EQMac was stuck in PoP for 10 years and developers abandoned it. What happened there? Nobody killed Vex Thal trash because they abused an exploit that allowed them to get targets for mages across the zone which they parked half a dozen of in the zone to summon the raid to each boss. The zone was essentially ruined. Behavior that would have been disallowed in 2002 had developers noticed it, but the exploit was not well known in 2002.
Then there was pet pulling, which allowed people to use low level pets to single pull anything in the game. We had that in for awhile on our emu, and the result was people pet pulling every goddamn mob in the game (fire giants, lguk named, kithicor DEs etc) which fundamentally broke a core aspect of the game. Sony developers didn't fix this at the time because it wasn't abused anywhere near the level it was on our emu, but they certainly would have if it was. (it was fixed after our era) So by demanding zero changes, #nochanges people are demanding a gameplay experience unlike the original.
Now as for WoW, I saw a YouTube video yesterday which discussed the Blizzard AV post, and it mentioned that AV was the highest honor farm for ranking. This was the exact opposite of my experience with the game in 2005: I was #1 on my server until BGs launched (I won the tabard) then my rank tanked because I did nothing but AVs. The reply I got was this:
That is badly deteriorated gameplay. Players abusing how the honor mechanics work by throwing games and ruining the experience for themselves and everybody else in the BG. It's Blizzard's fault for making such an abuseable system, but if you #nochanges the server, then it's going to end up being something unlike what we experienced in 2005-2006. WoW is less a sandbox than EQ was so it's not as severe there, but PvP ranking will probably end up quite different and AV could potentially be ruined.
Incidentally my Preform AV Enabler addon wasn't released until just several weeks before BC, so if that's usable then AV isn't going to feel very classic. I seriously hope they disable it in the same manner they did in 2012 as I do not like what it did to the game.
- 51,506
- 302,339
When PvP was first introduced in WoW there was no honor system, there was no honor points , HK's, dishonorable kills, and/or ranks gear from it. You simply saw the red guy from the other faction and shit on his face because the world demanded it. Not for some reward. Bring back full on classic.
- 5
Warmuth
Molten Core Raider
- 877
- 520
Sniping killing blows for leaderboard bragging rights was all the reward pvp ever needed.
- 1
Ehrgeix
Trakanon Raider
- 186
- 129
I'm pretty sure I like leveled a priest from 50something to 60 killing stuff in a pve cave while getting a bunch of honor.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
- 20,336
- 14,000
I'm guessing we have a bunch of alliance players and a bunch of jerkoffs like the 2 people above remembering AV as being good. Original AV was garbage. It was completely imbalanced and turned into a zergfest long before any changes were made once the Alliance realized they had a much easier time than horde could ever hope to have if they just rushed to the faction leader.
That bridge made it almost impossible for the horde to beat the alliance once that shit was figured out. And you can't make people forget what they already know.
That bridge made it almost impossible for the horde to beat the alliance once that shit was figured out. And you can't make people forget what they already know.
- 2
- 1
AV was epic and a lot of fun. Farming for all the wolf riders and ice lord and all that stuff was fun. Wow now is about the grind and not that kinda play, whiny min max people who wanted it to be just another honor grind ruined it.
Blizzard should just fix the honor grind anyway that rank system was terrible and toxic.
Blizzard should just fix the honor grind anyway that rank system was terrible and toxic.
- 51,506
- 302,339
Didn't matter when the map lasted 8 days at a time. The Win/Loss shit is where bliz fucked up.
Chanur
Shit Posting Professional
- 28,514
- 45,529
Being able to solo cap towers because the horde towers can't shoot you at the flag. Being able to jump over the fence into the frost wolf village. Being able to cap the final flag with the towers not being in range to shoot you.
The map was vastly easier for alliance.
Alliance could also skip all of the NPCs in the horde base after 1.11, while the horde still had to kill many of them. (i.e. the blacksmith) A single alliance of any class could take the relief hut, solo, which meant that it was just a matter of how fast they could ride there. The NPCs provided a means of protection to the defending Alliance in their base who could hide behind them.
Archer coverage in the horde base was just awful. Alliance had a large building right under the towers that shielded them from the archers and horde players. It's a very short run up that ramp into the inner base under the towers. The choke there wasn't very effective largely because of that building.
Also don't forget Stormpike graveyard which is by far the hardest non-base graveyard to take. The entire north region of the map is very linear while the area around the horde base is wide open.
I would also argue that paladins with DA gave them an edge in defense of graveyard banners as well.
I liked AV because I like large scale PvP (it's a fucking MMOG after all) and AV was the only option for it. I hated how unbalanced the map was, which is why I originally made Preform horde only in protest. (yeah, it was petty)
Archer coverage in the horde base was just awful. Alliance had a large building right under the towers that shielded them from the archers and horde players. It's a very short run up that ramp into the inner base under the towers. The choke there wasn't very effective largely because of that building.
Also don't forget Stormpike graveyard which is by far the hardest non-base graveyard to take. The entire north region of the map is very linear while the area around the horde base is wide open.
I would also argue that paladins with DA gave them an edge in defense of graveyard banners as well.
I liked AV because I like large scale PvP (it's a fucking MMOG after all) and AV was the only option for it. I hated how unbalanced the map was, which is why I originally made Preform horde only in protest. (yeah, it was petty)
- 51,506
- 302,339
The classic version of AV they are going with is the one with all the NPC's and shit removed. It's like the people are blizzard really are retarded.
Chanur
Shit Posting Professional
- 28,514
- 45,529