World of Warcraft: Current Year

Foggy · Apr 20, 2020

They need to really restrict the information available to players for creating boss mods and the power of addons to organize players during an encounter. It has created this absurd arms race mentioned earlier with fights become hilariously complex. Furthermore, their base indicators for when mechanics are coming and what they are doing is a joke. Its made worse by the fact that once you are past the 3 free bosses, a single player dying can possible lead to a wipe and each boss has several mechanics that a single failure of is an auto wipe. Raiding in WoW is a fucking mess to put it lightly and needs a complete overhaul.

And I somehow forgot to get into the awful fucking coding for boss mechanics now. Since every boss has a billion mechanics you would think they would put in protections to prevent RNG mechanics from guaranteeing a death and/or wipe. Mechatok is one of the best examples. Players get bombs on them that must be run LOS before they explode. If they don't, its a wipe because the entire raid starts taking massive damage. Well there is also a mechanic that increases a player's size so that they cannot actually LOS the raid behind the boxes intended for it. You would think it would be impossible for a player to get both mechanics at the same time... NOPE.

Jox · Apr 20, 2020

Sumdain x said:
I mean I can link all of my cutting edges for every legion patch if it adds credibility.

if you don’t like what’s required to mythic raid then don’t do it. I retired in uldir because it interfered with my board game night and I needed a break.

And how many of those did you get before the fights were nerfed 10 times? If your point is that nerfing fights doesn't make them more accessible, I'm sure every fight you killed was the same version as Method right? Idiot.

TJT · Apr 20, 2020

Remember when Heigan was at or near the peak of raid participation and awareness? That was actually somewhat fun because most retards would figure it out eventually.

xzi · Apr 20, 2020

Back when Sekiro came out, there were a bunch of games journalists complaining that the game was too difficult. A bunch of them started using disabilities for their argument, that making a game this difficult is unfair to people with bodies that don't function how the game expects them to play. They argued and argued how there should be a lower difficulty because the game is unfair to that section of people, instead of admitting that they just wanted to actually be able to beat the game without putting in the effort. "It's morally wrong!" they'd say, they'd even use cheat engines so they can review the game and then say weird things like "I still feel good about beating it" despite running around in god mode.

And then a quadriplegic person uploaded a video of him beating one of the harder bosses in the game without cheesing it.

Now, if you just don't like the game that's absolutely fine and you're allowed to say that, and the game does warrant some criticism (it always should), but without even actually playing and putting in effort of learning instead of giving up then why would anyone bother to listen? Instead people are just going to go on the internet and make fun of your stupid article.

Sumdain x · Apr 20, 2020

ill probably pug it with some friends when cross realm opens tomorrow at least the first few.

and yep I retired because it was too much hassle, I don’t mind that there is a raid that I’m not able to complete, I’ll never clear mythic nzoth and i'm okay with that. There being a difficulty aimed at neckbeards (of which i used to be one) i don't mind. my gear is 5 ilevels lower than people who spend 20+ hours a week in mythic, i'm okay sacrificing those item levels for more freetime, But i don't have a problem with their being a difficulty unobtainable by 99% of players.

Khane · Apr 20, 2020

xzi said:
Back when Sekiro came out, there were a bunch of games journalists complaining that the game was too difficult. A bunch of them started using disabilities for their argument, that making a game this difficult is unfair to people with bodies that don't function how the game expects them to play. They argued and argued how there should be a lower difficulty because the game is unfair to that section of people, instead of admitting that they just wanted to actually be able to beat the game without putting in the effort. "It's morally wrong!" they'd say, they'd even use cheat engines so they can review the game and then say weird things like "I still feel good about beating it" despite running around in god mode.

And then a quadriplegic person uploaded a video of him beating one of the harder bosses in the game without cheesing it.

Now, if you just don't like the game that's absolutely fine and you're allowed to say that, and the game does warrant some criticism (it always should), but without even actually playing and putting in effort of learning instead of giving up then why would anyone bother to listen? Instead people are just going to go on the internet and make fun of your stupid article.

What?

Sumdain x · Apr 20, 2020

Jox said:
And how many of those did you get before the fights were nerfed 10 times? If your point is that nerfing fights doesn't make them more accessible, I'm sure every fight you killed was the same version as Method right? Idiot.

The only one that had to be nerfed 10x was KJ - still imo the hardest boss i ever had to deal with, we had 300 pulls on him prenerf and about 200 post nerf.

xzi · Apr 20, 2020

Khane said:
What?

git gud

Khane · Apr 20, 2020

Sumdain x said:
ill probably pug it with some friends when cross realm opens tomorrow at least the first few.

and yep I retired because it was too much hassle, I don’t mind that there is a raid that I’m not able to complete, I’ll never clear mythic nzoth and i'm okay with that. There being a difficulty aimed at neckbeards (of which i used to be one) i don't mind. my gear is 5 ilevels lower than people who spend 20+ hours a week in mythic, i'm okay sacrificing those item levels for more freetime, But i don't have a problem with their being a difficulty unobtainable by 99% of players.

Right, something you used to enjoy became way too much of a chore and was no longer fun. So you stopped. Like almost all of the rest of us here. And we are just here commenting on that problem and hoping it changes. Because the problem isn't just with raiding, it's the trickle down effect it has on everything else. These players that Blizzard is trying to offer this challenge to find ways to circumvent the inherent difficulty with release tuning. So Blizzard keeps handcuffing the rest of the systems in the game that these players are exploiting so that they can't bypass the way Blizzard thinks they should be forced to play the game. Which then forces the rest of the playerbase into this really idiotic situation where things get constantly nerfed or changed solely because Blizzard doesn't like that Method and Limit are doing things like chain running islands to max their neck. Better nerf AP gains in islands for everyone!

As an example

Sumdain x · Apr 20, 2020

I disagree, for example they nerfed AP gains in islands but why is jimmy_lfr_raider bitching that he can't get his neck to 80 now? why did jimmy need an 80 neck the week the patch came out for lfr? if he would have just played casually which lets be honest anyone not mythic raiding is pretty casual his neck would have been 80+ without even trying a week or two later.

Khane · Apr 20, 2020

Sumdain x said:
I disagree, for example they nerfed AP gains in islands but why is jimmy_lfr_raider bitching that he can't get his neck to 80 now? why did jimmy need an 80 neck the week the patch came out for lfr? if he would have just played casually which lets be honest anyone not mythic raiding is pretty casual his neck would have been 80+ without even trying a week or two later.

Yea we've already rehashed all the systems that were gutted and made terrible to try to handcuff bleeding edge raiders throughout BfA. Ad nauseum in fact. And the rebuttal is always this tired argument about LFR players that has nothing to do with what is being discussed.

I'm afraid whatever disease Fyff has is starting to infect other posters in this thread.

BoozeCube · Apr 20, 2020

Sumdain x said:
ill probably pug it with some friends when cross realm opens tomorrow at least the first few.

and yep I retired because it was too much hassle, I don’t mind that there is a raid that I’m not able to complete, I’ll never clear mythic nzoth and i'm okay with that. There being a difficulty aimed at neckbeards (of which i used to be one) i don't mind. my gear is 5 ilevels lower than people who spend 20+ hours a week in mythic, i'm okay sacrificing those item levels for more freetime, But i don't have a problem with their being a difficulty unobtainable by 99% of players.

You are just confirming exactly what Khane said so I don't understand the belligerent attitude about it. Mythic raiding, in fact the entirety of raiding in the current tier is some of the lowest turn out in this games history. You can see this first hand just by the number of guilds with even one kill in world of logs.

You guys are being autistic and going herp derp design for people with disabilities or whatever are just trying to redirect the issue. MMORPG's shouldn't have 30 difficulty sliders, hell even two is pushing it, and the content should be challenging but not to the point you actively can't let Sandoso the cool dude who is on daily but isn't an amazing player but contributes into the raid. Because again it's the anesthetists of what MMORPG's and Community should be, somehow everyone seems to miss that argument? Also again trying to somehow cater to single players, Pokemon lovers, Facebook game faggots, Auto chess retards, LFR window lickers, and jobless eurofags isn't a winning play. This genre is already niche so trying to please everyone you please nobody. You can tell me how this is wrong but the fact that BFA is pulling the weakest numbers this game has ever seen especially in the number of active guilds raiding and the fact classic is flat out blowing it out of the goddamn park in total engagement numbers tells a different story.

xzi · Apr 20, 2020

I mean this completely unironically, I want major attunements with huge time investment and only 1% of the playerbase ever stepping inside the raid let alone killing anything

because it's been all downhill since killing 4 horsemen in naxx in 2006

Sumdain x · Apr 20, 2020

I honestly don't even know what you guys are even advocating at this point. you want every benefit in the game but you dont want to put in the effort to do any of it?

why does mythic being tuned exceptionally high matter? because you want a few extra ilevel? I just don't understand i guess.

BoozeCube · Apr 20, 2020

xzi said:
I mean this completely unironically, I want major attunements with huge time investment and only 1% of the playerbase ever stepping inside the raid let alone killing anything

because it's been all downhill since killing 4 horsemen in naxx in 2006

Attunements and effort required from a character to enter a raid is a different story all together. In general I agree these are a positive both from lore set up to basic role play elements, but that is a completely different design.

BoozeCube · Apr 20, 2020

Sumdain x said:
I honestly don't even know what you guys are even advocating at this point. you want every benefit in the game but you dont want to put in the effort to do any of it?

Some of you are missing the point on purpose it seems.

Khane · Apr 20, 2020

I'm on board if it's not artificially cockblocked by dailies and weeklies spreading out what I could get done in 40 hours to 8 weeks. Original Naxx didn't actually affect players who were never going to do it. Blizzard didn't nerf shadow protection potions or mana pots just because they were being used in raids. They didn't remove the ability to stack buffs or nerf/get rid of effects/world buffs from previous raid tiers to stall progression. They didn't remove Master Loot during AQ because they didn't want guilds gearing up too fast for Naxx. The content was hard, but they let the players play the game.

If you make content that's extremely difficult but then let players do whatever they can to beat it, unrestricted, I don't really have an issue with it. Artificially restricting previously available gameplay or outright removing it because you don't have the skills to create content for those players without putting handcuffs on them is terrible. Especially since it handcuffs players who were never interested in it in the first place as well.

xzi · Apr 20, 2020

Khane said:
They didn't remove Master Loot during AQ

This would have been my favorite thing of just Ion and Furor and Death & Taxes calling each other faggots for 3 months until they reverted it

kinadin · Apr 20, 2020

I'm pretty new to the game but I'm frankly surprised how the mythic system works for both dungeons and raids. It seems silly that a group of 13 (or whatever number) can't just run a mythic raid and have it scale like a heroic raid.

Merrith · Apr 20, 2020

Khane said:
I'm on board if it's not artificially cockblocked by dailies and weeklies spreading out what I could get done in 40 hours to 8 weeks. Original Naxx didn't actually affect players who were never going to do it. Blizzard didn't nerf shadow protection potions or mana pots just because they were being used in raids. They didn't remove the ability to stack buffs or nerf/get rid of effects/world buffs from previous raid tiers to stall progression. They didn't remove Master Loot during AQ because they didn't want guilds gearing up too fast for Naxx. The content was hard, but they let the players play the game.

If you make content that's extremely difficult but then let players do whatever they can to beat it, unrestricted, I don't really have an issue with it. Artificially restricting previously available gameplay or outright removing it because you don't have the skills to create content for those players without putting handcuffs on them is terrible. Especially since it handcuffs players who were never interested in it in the first place as well.

They did slightly nerf stuff like whipper root tubers and night dragon's breath where before you could have all on separate CD's where players who put in the extra effort farming them could benefit, but that was a small case in general, and most other beneficial stuff you could still farm a ton of and stack to your heart's content.

World of Warcraft: Current Year

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