World of Warcraft: Current Year

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R

Razzes

Trakanon Raider
850
537
Merrith said:
Why would pvp die? I thought it always had its own dedicated group. Although with the current downturn of the entire game maybe the pvp population is at such a low level it couldn't handle that.
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2s and 3s ladder is already dead. Anyone can check that with their own 2 eyes by looking at the LFG. Part of it is because of solo shuffle. But solo shuffle isn't working either, since Queue time average above 30min for DPS because of the healers/dps imbalance. Some DPS wait 1h++ for a game, only for the game to be canceled by a leaver. Tbf, solo shuffle could probably make pvp work if they can address the healer shortage.

I don't think they can with their current philosophy. They tried buffing healer and nerfing dps self healing to make healers stronger relative to dps, but that doesn't work. People do not like playing healer in pvp, they need to adapt the game to this reality.
 
Merrith

Merrith

Golden Baronet of the Realm
18,414
7,126
Razzes said:
2s and 3s ladder is already dead. Anyone can check that with their own 2 eyes by looking at the LFG. Part of it is because of solo shuffle. But solo shuffle isn't working either, since Queue time average above 30min for DPS because of the healers/dps imbalance. Some DPS wait 1h++ for a game, only for the game to be canceled by a leaver. Tbf, solo shuffle could probably make pvp work if they can address the healer shortage.

I don't think they can with their current philosophy. They tried buffing healer and nerfing dps self healing to make healers stronger relative to dps, but that doesn't work. People do not like playing healer in pvp, they need to adapt the game to this reality.
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As anyone with eyes could have read my previous comment that noted I hadn't touched the game since 9.0. But honestly could care less about pvp. It shouldn't need pve'ers to be forced to participate in it just to keep it afloat.
 
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R

Razzes

Trakanon Raider
850
537
Merrith said:
As anyone with eyes could have read my previous comment that noted I hadn't touched the game since 9.0. But honestly could care less about pvp. It shouldn't need pve'ers to be forced to participate in it just to keep it afloat.
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Euh, you misinterpreted what I meant. I'm not saying you should have known...I'm saying you don't have to take my word for it cause it's easily verifiable in case you are skeptical. Don't be so defensive.

Again, pvers were never "forced" to participate in pvp. Only world first raider needed that extra advantage to compete. Previous system encouraged pvers to try and participate in pvp. That's a way to insert new blood into the game mode. It's also effective for the participation of players like me that don't find the pvp game mode sufficient by itself if it doesn't connect to the other form of content. Right now, investing into pvp for me is not worth it anymore since it only gives you access to pvp content. Unlike in SL where I played and enjoyed pvp for hundred of hours.

My point is that the game is (or rather "was") a whole greater than the sum of its parts. That's why it fails when you isolate each of its components. Now, each game mode competes with each other. Each hour spent in pvp slows my progress in M+.
 
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Cybsled

Cybsled

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
17,086
13,608
Ideally they would just dump PVP gear altogether and just have normalized gear in instanced PVP
 
Daidraco

Daidraco

Avatar of War Slayer
10,051
10,366
Ill play an FPS, a MOBA, an MMO dedicated to PVP (AA etc.) - but I will clock the fuck out the minute I have to PVP in WoW. Rock, Paper, Scissors took a complete shit in class design and I find that shit to be about as fun as gouging my eyes out. To get a weapon that wasnt shit tier at the beginning of SL's before the raids, you had to PVP up to 2100 to get the fucking thing. Literally forced? No. But forced in a sense that you're just wasting your time if you dont? Yes. Then that skill upgrade in BFA that was BIS for PVE, but you had to PVP for it? Fucking cut my life into pieces, this is my last resort.
 
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RobXIII

RobXIII

Urinal Cake Consumption King
<Gold Donor>
3,851
2,219
Khane said:
No, everyone hates that shit. PvE players do not want to beg for carries to get PvE gear from the shitty Arena system. And PvP mains sure as shit don't want to deal with the artificial influx or have to PvE for their PvP gear
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Does anyone else really, and I mean REALLY hate arena? BGs can be fun, especially the bigger pop ones, but man, for some reason Arena's just make me want to punch a toddler.

And you HAVE to do them if you want to be competitive in BGs, because all of the better gear is gated behind them, at least in WOTLK classic out now. Plus you can only buy weapons with arena points, unless you are a hunter for some reason? /boggle
 
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Merrith

Merrith

Golden Baronet of the Realm
18,414
7,126
Razzes said:
Euh, you misinterpreted what I meant. I'm not saying you should have known...I'm saying you don't have to take my word for it cause it's easily verifiable in case you are skeptical. Don't be so defensive.

Again, pvers were never "forced" to participate in pvp. Only world first raider needed that extra advantage to compete. Previous system encouraged pvers to try and participate in pvp. That's a way to insert new blood into the game mode. It's also effective for the participation of players like me that don't find the pvp game mode sufficient by itself if it doesn't connect to the other form of content. Right now, investing into pvp for me is not worth it anymore since it only gives you access to pvp content. Unlike in SL where I played and enjoyed pvp for hundred of hours.

My point is that the game is (or rather "was") a whole greater than the sum of its parts. That's why it fails when you isolate each of its components. Now, each game mode competes with each other. Each hour spent in pvp slows my progress in M+.
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I was merely poking fun at what seemed like you meant, don't be so on the defensive yourself just because everyone else pretty much was on the same side I was, to keep the two essentially completely separate. There's disadvantages to linking everything together, as it does make some players feel forced to at least complete whatever weekly/daily stuff there is for each subset of content. Keeping things on their own paths, separate from each other allows people to choose which content they want to engage in. Entry level gear rewards if people want to do it? Sure. Otherwise let each set of content stand on its own and let players choose what they want to do and what they don't want to do.
 
Penance

Penance

Silver Baronet of the Realm
6,428
8,353
I get the point about segregating game modes separates game populations. I think an idea for that is to have as much horizontal progression as possible that's tied to all 3 modes so you can incentive the players to run stuff they normally wouldn't. And when they don't like it and nope out for that season then they aren't missing out on vertical progressions for the modes they do like to play.
 
Cybsled

Cybsled

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
17,086
13,608
I kind of like how FF handles PvP. Gear means nothing, you basically get a default template for your class stat wise and some PvP only abilities (your hot bar is different for pvp as well). Most of the abilities are similar to regular abilities, although most are simplified. All classes get an ultimate ability that you can charge up to try to make big plays

But it is completely segregated. The only reason to do it is if you like it, or want armor/item skins/mounts from PvP
 
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Daidraco

Daidraco

Avatar of War Slayer
10,051
10,366
Cybsled said:
I kind of like how FF handles PvP. Gear means nothing, you basically get a default template for your class stat wise and some PvP only abilities (your hot bar is different for pvp as well). Most of the abilities are similar to regular abilities, although most are simplified. All classes get an ultimate ability that you can charge up to try to make big plays

But it is completely segregated. The only reason to do it is if you like it, or want armor/item skins/mounts from PvP
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I can see cosmetics being a good reward for it, but not everyone. We all know the spergs that get off on being geared to the brim and shitting on the brand new PVP player based on stats alone.
 
Penance

Penance

Silver Baronet of the Realm
6,428
8,353
Cybsled said:
I kind of like how FF handles PvP. Gear means nothing, you basically get a default template for your class stat wise and some PvP only abilities (your hot bar is different for pvp as well). Most of the abilities are similar to regular abilities, although most are simplified. All classes get an ultimate ability that you can charge up to try to make big plays

But it is completely segregated. The only reason to do it is if you like it, or want armor/item skins/mounts from PvP
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I think this is closer towards what I'd like to see. Templates mixed with some sort of universal progression unlocked per stage kind of how mobas do it.
 
Merrith

Merrith

Golden Baronet of the Realm
18,414
7,126
Having the new hot bar/abilities simplifies keeping them separate, as we've seen plenty in the past history of WoW how abilities being overpowered in pvp or pve and vice versa cause issues with class balancing.
 
Chris

Chris

Potato del Grande
19,436
-10,733
Cybsled said:
I kind of like how FF handles PvP. Gear means nothing, you basically get a default template for your class stat wise and some PvP only abilities (your hot bar is different for pvp as well). Most of the abilities are similar to regular abilities, although most are simplified. All classes get an ultimate ability that you can charge up to try to make big plays

But it is completely segregated. The only reason to do it is if you like it, or want armor/item skins/mounts from PvP
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They also limit/expand healing and tanking abilities.

Healers can still heal but they have 2 charges on cooldown or need to proc it somehow. Tanks get stuff like zone control abilities to make everyone invulnerable or take less damage in a specific AoE. Also everyone has heal potions on cooldown.

So it makes healers less important in that you don't need to focus them down 100%, but also more important in the skill of when they use heals. For me as a healer, basically being the tank and stunlocked/focused to oblivion made it not be fun.

FF14 went from sucking to being a really fun and fast activity that's like the arcade gaming of MMOs.
 
Tholan

Tholan

Blackwing Lair Raider
825
1,543
Dont make any difference between PVE and PVP. make corpses fully lootable.
bring back Ultima Online PVP madness.
 
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Janx

Janx

<Silver Donator>
6,592
17,968
Animosity said:

Ex-Blizzard execs Jen Oneal, J Allen Brack, and John Donham form Magic Soup Games | Massively Overpowered

massivelyop.com

Interesting team-up
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Rofl
I also feel strongly about creating a diverse and inclusive company, and it’s fulfilling to be able to create something from the ground up where that is a core principle from day one,” she further notes, and it’s hard not to imagine her looking pointedly at ABK as she says it.

Dumpster Fire GIF by MOODMAN
 
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Gavinmad

Gavinmad

Mr. Poopybutthole
43,737
52,284
"I also feel strongly about creating a diverse and inclusive company, and it’s fulfilling to be able to create something from the ground up where that is a core principle from day one"

Well at least now we know she had absolutely nothing to do with the high quality of the Crash Bandicoot and Tony Hawk remasters, which I was previously willing to give her credit for.
 
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Opimo

Opimo

Golden Knight of the Realm
128
95
Wasn't she just a token diversity hire so that Activision could be like "SEE WE HIRE WOMEN!!"
 
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