Arkk's Weight Lifting / Fitness Thread

Falkensyn_sl said:

You probably pulled a trap. It's happened to me a few times after doing max effort pull-anything without proper warm-up and mobility work. The pain is usually gone after a few days with some residual stiffness/tightness in the general neck/upper back area for a week or so. Do some light stretching and maybe some T-spine mobility work, if there's actual pain present aside from stiffness or soreness after a week it's probably a good idea to see a doctor.

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This sounds right. The longer it persists, the more it feels like it's my trap. I stupidly went and did shoulders yesterday, and anything that integrated trap work was extra tight/sore. It was starting to get better, now it's sore as shit again. At first I thought it was just my trap/upper back being sore from supporting my neck which was tight as shit, but the more I think about what areas are sore and my range of motion, definitely feels like trap.

Bane_sl said:

This sounds exactly like the injury I have been fighting for years. Its currently shut me down completely from lifting and working out this year. Does it feel like more than a pulled muscle, like deep down nerve/bone style injury? Do you have trouble moving your head all the way to one side? Trouble going from lying down to sitting up? Scalpulae Muscle is like a second group under your traps that is impossible to work and stretch at times. But its been a recurring thing for me and it can go off at any time.

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Luckily no. I have full range of motion looking to the left or right without much pain. Honestly the most pain is doing a shrug or pushing my chin into my clavicle. If I raise my chin to the sky and tilt my head back, the pressure is relieved until the back of my head starts compressing my neck. Any type of compression hurts like shit.

Last night it was pretty painful if I stopped midway from a laying down position to seated. Almost like a crunch where I engaged my abs. That holding was intense pain in neck/traps. But once I raise all the way up, it's pretty normal. At first it felt like a crick in my neck from sleeping weird where I was afraid it was a disc in my neck or something. Now it's just sore as shit and feels like a constant labor to keep my head up. So ready for this to be over.

Take a week off lifting man. Pretty obvious that you pulled or sprained something so let it mend for a week and then see how it goes.

Seems very unwise to carry on stressing your muscles in this situation until you know exactly what you are dealing with.

Neki_sl said:

Take a week off lifting man. Pretty obvious that you pulled or sprained something so let it mend for a week and then see how it goes.

Seems very unwise to carry on stressing your muscles in this situation until you know exactly what you are dealing with.

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Welcome to the internet, where doctors are random people on forums that you do not know and resting an injury for two weeks will magically make your body shrivel to the point of looking like the crypt keeper.

can someone explain starter strength? do you just life the same weight all the time everytime you gym?

i mean im assuming it means you just consecutively do your starting weight over and over again.

Bane_sl said:

Is there a post here with links to the different workout programs people are working on? I'd be interested to see some new ideas instead of going through Gethin's Trainer, or any of the BB.com ones.

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Mine varies if I notice something injures me or if I feel I need to work something a different way, but the "core" of it remains pretty consistent.

Chest/Biceps
Flat Bench 3x5
EZ Bar Curl 3x8
Cable Chest Press 3x10
Hammer Curls 3x10

(Cable Chest replaced Incline Dumbbell Press a while ago because my shoulder couldn't handle it, but it'd be preferred.)

Legs
High Bar Back Squat 3x5
Romanian Deadlift 3x8
Standing Calf Raises 3x12
Front Calf Raises 3x15-20
Bulgarian Split Squat 3x5

(Added RDL recently for extra hamstring work, and I had been doing Power Cleans instead of Split Squats, but my bicep needs time to recouperate. The Split Squats are brand new. I did them at a hotel gym on travel 2 weeks ago and my glutes were fried. So I figured I'd add it in. I've also done Hip Thrusts for glutes, but my lower back was angry at me the one time I did them weighted.)

Shoulders/Triceps
Military Press 3x5
Close Grip Bench Press 3x8
Side Lateral Raises 3x15
Skullcrushers 3x8

(I normally do 3x10 Side Laterals, but I felt like my form was crap with 25lb dumbbells, so I upped the reps until I get to 3x20 before going back to 25's. I also sometimes do Tricep Pushdowns at the end for maybe 2x8 just to pump my tri's up a bit more.)

Back
Deadlift 1x5
Dumbbell Shoulder Shrugs 3x10
Cable Rows 3x10
Lat Pulldown 3x8
Facepulls 3x10

(The Lat Pulldowns are because, once again, my left bicep just can't handle Pullups right now. I have tendonosis that won't go away. Facepulls are technically a shoulder exercise - Anterior Deltoid - but I like them on back day.)

My program was adapted from Starting Strength, hence the rep ranges on the compound lifts. I feel that I get enough work on the compound lifts. I've tried extra squats on back day, but my calf tore back in April from that. I do also frequently do partial rep overload squats on leg day after my normal squats. For those I basically set the safety bars in the power rack to just above belly button level and set the bar on them. It's the upper portion of the squat, and you do supra-maximal sets. So for instance if I'm doing 225 for normal reps, I'd do 250 or so for these. I've been doing 3x8 for those.

My isolation lifts are very bodybuilding heavy. While the compound lifts are more powerlifting influenced. So basically I'm going for strength on the compounds, and size on isolation. My isolation exercises hit pretty much every muscle group. Overall I like it, but I do tweek it often. At least one of my split days changes every month by adding or subtracting something. The major changes were annotated in parenthesis below that day, just to give you an idea of what I used to do and may likely add back in at some point (mostly due to injuries).

TecKnoe_sl said:

can someone explain starter strength? do you just life the same weight all the time everytime you gym?

i mean im assuming it means you just consecutively do your starting weight over and over again.

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ReadFAQrogram - Starting Strength Wiki

The goal of Starting Strength is to build a base of strength before you do whatever it is you want to do afterwards (Sports, Powerlift, Bodybuild, Olympic Lift, whatever). It's completely focused on compound lifts and has you squatting 3 times a week. It's a great program if you're new, but not perfect. Every single time you go into the gym, you're raising the amount on the bar until you fail 3 times (or 2? can't remember). Then you reset and start at a lower weight to build back up. If you stick with it you can make some pretty incredible gains. Personally I think I stopped it because I just couldn't handle the volume of compound lifts. Squatting 3 times a week or deadlifting twice is rough.

I'm ballparking, but I probably gained about 130 pounds on my squat, 200 on my deadlift, 100 on my bench, and 50 on my press. But I was also like 130 pounds when I started and was using just the bar for a lot of my lifts.

Edit: Oh, and here's the video that got me to consider pin squats (what I called partial rep overload squats, above). There was a post on T-Nation about them, but I can't remember where I saw it. Glad I saw it again though, cause apparently I'm doing way too many reps with it.

Elurin_sl said:

Why are you switching to a new program and then going back to SS, as opposed to just staying with SS?

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Because I won't be able to keep consistent training schedules over the next few weeks, because of summer. And it will cut into how well I can control my diet as well.

Oh and, bw @ 95kgs, height @ 194cm

I was reading an article about over training, and how a lot of people don't believe it exists. The main comparison that was used was if you do manual labor for your work, such as a garbageman. The first time you're out there hauling those heavy ass bins filled with pounds of McDonalds and shit, you're going to be incredibly sore the next door, especially if you're not into fitness. But you can't call in the next day and be like "nah son, today's my rest day." You go in the next day, work through the soreness and pain and fatigue, and keep going. Eventually, your body adapts, you become stronger, more fit to sling these shits around into the truck, and it becomes a lot easier. Obviously this can be applied to any line of physical work.

They were trying to equate that to lifting, saying you should lift every day essentially, because your body will adapt, you'll become stronger quicker, and it will fight off the soreness and fatigue.

Just wondering your opinions on it.

I can really only speak to running but that seems to be asking for overuse injuries (stress fractures and the like). Guessing you'd have to be incredibly careful about your weight/speed/whatever and not increase too quickly since you're not going to be having off days for the inevitable DOMS when you push the difficulty higher.

Itlan_sl said:

I was reading an article about over training, and how a lot of people don't believe it exists. The main comparison that was used was if you do manual labor for your work, such as a garbageman. The first time you're out there hauling those heavy ass bins filled with pounds of McDonalds and shit, you're going to be incredibly sore the next door, especially if you're not into fitness. But you can't call in the next day and be like "nah son, today's my rest day." You go in the next day, work through the soreness and pain and fatigue, and keep going. Eventually, your body adapts, you become stronger, more fit to sling these shits around into the truck, and it becomes a lot easier. Obviously this can be applied to any line of physical work.

They were trying to equate that to lifting, saying you should lift every day essentially, because your body will adapt, you'll become stronger quicker, and it will fight off the soreness and fatigue.

Just wondering your opinions on it.

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You'll only become stronger to a point in that situation because those trash barrels full of McD's aren't changing weight. You'll plateau. So yes, while in this situation you could work every day and get to a point where your body adapts, bodybuilding is the exact opposite of adaptation. The goal is constant change. Constant improvement so the situations don't relate at all. Unless those McDonalds barrells get 5lb heavier every week. Then you'll be in a continuous state of exhaustion.

You might find this article interesting.

T NATION | 6 Weeks of Squatting Insanity

Excerpt:

The plan is fairly simple: squat every day (except Sunday), which involves either working up to a certain weight for multiple singles or a flat-out max.

Since it's still a powerlifting program there will also be other exercises to do - I didn't do them as I was way too trashed - though I think it would've worked even better if I had.

Just remember, you're not allowed to stretch or do any sort of warm-up besides squatting with the bar on your back. And when you do this, day after day, without so much as a hip flexor stretch or a roll on the foam roller, you get seriously tight.

In my case, my psoas were so tight that having them released after this program made me throw up. My hips were like boards. My entire upper back was sore in a way I'd never felt before - tight, achy, and burning. By the end I had a permanent bar indent.

My entire left leg went into a spasm and I could hardly straighten it, so I limped when I walked. Both knees were sore to the touch; heck if you blew on them I'd flinch. Even sleeping was a nightmare - I couldn't put my arms in any position that was comfortable.

Looking back, I have no idea why I stuck with the program.

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I'm currently looking for a weight training routine that will help me improve my overall strength as much as possible while limiting as much muscle related weight gain as I can. Historically I've gained mass pretty easily when I was lifting for a while, but right now I'm just trying to get the best strength to body weight ratio I possibly can. Any thoughts?

My current training plan (For the last month or so ) has been the following:

• Monday - Run 3 miles.
• Tuesday Morning - Sets of Jumping jacks, flutter kicks, push ups, dips and pull ups.
• Tuesday Evening - Swim, typically for an hour, a mix of laps (freestyle, breaststroke, css) and treading water.
• Wednesday - Run 5 miles.
• Thursday - Run 3 miles, Sets of Jumping jacks, flutter kicks, push ups, dips and pull ups.
• Friday - Swim, the same as Tuesday.
• Saturday - Run 10 miles (started at 6, going up every week.)
• Sunday - Rest.

Next week the 3 mile runs become 4 mile runs.

I'm thinking that I should be focusing on compound lifts, bench, squat, clean and jerk, dead lift. But I wanted to get some ideas and feedback before I start.

Zaide_sl said:

I'm currently looking for a weight training routine that will help me improve my overall strength as much as possible while limiting as much muscle related weight gain as I can. Historically I've gained mass pretty easily when I was lifting for a while, but right now I'm just trying to get the best strength to body weight ratio I possibly can. Any thoughts?

My current training plan (For the last month or so ) has been the following:

• Monday - Run 3 miles.
• Tuesday Morning - Sets of Jumping jacks, flutter kicks, push ups, dips and pull ups.
• Tuesday Evening - Swim, typically for an hour, a mix of laps (freestyle, breaststroke, css) and treading water.
• Wednesday - Run 5 miles.
• Thursday - Run 3 miles, Sets of Jumping jacks, flutter kicks, push ups, dips and pull ups.
• Friday - Swim, the same as Tuesday.
• Saturday - Run 10 miles (started at 6, going up every week.)
• Sunday - Rest.

Next week the 3 mile runs become 4 mile runs.

I'm thinking that I should be focusing on compound lifts, bench, squat, clean and jerk, dead lift. But I wanted to get some ideas and feedback before I start.

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You should do something like Wendler's 5-3-1, and only that. By only that I mean chill with the assistance work if not putting on muscle is that important to you.

Also, what the fuck is a flutter kick?

arkktheseaotter_sl said:

You should do something like Wendler's 5-3-1, and only that. By only that I mean chill with the assistance work if not putting on muscle is that important to you.

Also, what the fuck is a flutter kick?

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You lie on your back, hands on your sides or under your ass and your legs flutter up and down slowly, working the core.

This is a video I just found to illustrate, not in any way related to me.


Thanks for the advice!

Zaide_sl said:

I'm currently looking for a weight training routine that will help me improve my overall strength as much as possible while limiting as much muscle related weight gain as I can.

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So you came to the weight lifting thread to ask for a weight lifting routine that won't produce muscle? Uh...if that's the case, keep on keeping on with what you're doing.

You also gave us no point of reference for where you currently are. Not very helpful.

Elurin_sl said:

So you came to the weight lifting thread to ask for a weight lifting routine that won't produce muscle?

You also gave us no point of reference for where you currently are. Not very helpful.

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I said I wanted the best strength to body weight ratio I could attain. I never implied that I could go about it without gaining any weight or muscle. I feel like this is a realistic goal from an athletic standpoint and for the purposes of my training plan. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong and this is highly unrealistic.

As for a point of reference, I don't think I could give you an accurate one, I haven't been lifting for a couple months now. I did give you exactly the training I've been doing for the past month however.

Arkk provided a workout which I've since researched and it looks promising, I intend to try it out. It details percentages of my one rep max that I should be lifting with various reps, and that's something along the lines of the sort of information I was hoping to find. The amount I'm actually lifting seems less of a factor than that it be within a given percent range of my max.

You at least know your height and weight? Estimated body fat?

That you're wanting to gain muscle for athleticism is a help.

Elurin_sl said:

You at least know your height and weight? Estimated body fat?

That you're wanting to gain muscle for athleticism is a help.

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Sure thing,

Height - 5''9.5
Weight - 183lbs
BF % - Uncertain (Most likely rather low)
Resting Heartrate - 42bpm

Concerning body fat, I haven't checked it in a long time and it wasn't really anything I was concerned with. I'm relatively well defined (Considering how much cardio I do, that's to be expected.)

I'm active duty military, if that's pertinent.

Zaide_sl said:

I said I wanted the best strength to body weight ratio I could attain. I never implied that I could go about it without gaining any weight or muscle. I feel like this is a realistic goal from an athletic standpoint and for the purposes of my training plan. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong and this is highly unrealistic.

As for a point of reference, I don't think I could give you an accurate one, I haven't been lifting for a couple months now. I did give you exactly the training I've been doing for the past month however.

Arkk provided a workout which I've since researched and it looks promising, I intend to try it out. It details percentages of my one rep max that I should be lifting with various reps, and that's something along the lines of the sort of information I was hoping to find. The amount I'm actually lifting seems less of a factor than that it be within a given percent range of my max.

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As you get stronger, you'll eventually add muscle. It's kind of inevitable.

Zaide_sl said:

You lie on your back, hands on your sides or under your ass and your legs flutter up and down slowly, working the core.

This is a video I just found to illustrate, not in any way related to me.


Thanks for the advice!

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I do these and then go into my "crunch" workout which consist of:

1) 200 Crunches, normal leg position
2) 20 crunches, both feet on ground
2) 20 crunches, right leg slightly off ground
3) 20 crunches, right leg raised 90 degrees in air
4) 20 crunches, left leg slightly raised off ground, continuing to hold right leg in air
5) 20 crunches, left leg raised to 90 degrees
6) 20 crunches, right leg lowered slightly off ground
(etc, etc.)


then do another 20 crunches with feet spread out. Then grab medicine ball, both feet in 90 degrees in air, reach for sky with ball reading forward.



Try and do that every day. Burns so good. ;o


That squat program looks pretty neat, lol. Any negatives about it that you guys can think of?


edit: nice article on that Wendler site.