Ashes of Creation

Daidraco · May 3, 2021

Im not dropping 500 on a game, but thats my own stinginess. I wanted to play on FV server in EQ ages ago but wasnt willing to pay 30 bucks or w/e it was a month to play on it for example.

I feel like a lot of the sentiment is that if people are willing to spend 500 on a game to get alpha access then not only will every dev want to offer that same type of "plan" but it also excludes people that cant or wont spend that money. A selective lotto was a bit more fair in my mind and others. But if you're dropping 500 on a game, you probably already have the system requirements needed to play the game which gives credence to what Xerge is saying with exclusivity.

Mahes · May 3, 2021

The NDA goes away when Alpha 1 starts so you do not have to play/test the game to see how it is coming along. I am positive there will be many streams to look at, so one does not have to worry about spending $500.00 to see the game. I am still mulling it over whether or not I want to upgrade what I have. I do want too, but I am hoping they also throw in playtime credit with the upgrade.

uniqueuser · May 3, 2021

Mahes said:
It was discussed. They "could" add in the ability to drop items on the ground. The problem is that it leads to things that they do not want to have to deal with. He even sites an example of something he did with it causing players to get booted from Lineage 2 during a siege. It has nothing to do with tech. It has everything to do with players exploiting the feature to gain an advantage or to just be straight out be annoying. I am fine not seeing dicks and player names drawn out everywhere around the game world.

25 years ago they also had unlimited bag space in games. Then it was realized that keeping track of millions of items can cause server issues.

Also, who cares what people choose to spend on the game? I figure the more spent, the more people they can hire, the better the game gets. Unlike Star Citizen, this game appears to be much better run. If you do not want to spend $500.00, then do not spend it. Posting against it comes off as whiny and petty.

Value = What a person is willing to pay for an item or service.

Everyone loves the idea of an MMOMGPLAYERDRIVENOPENWORLDSANDBOX game...until it comes time to actually implement mechanics that support the label, such as the ability to simply manipulate items outside your inventory. Then real visionaries like Steve Sharif and apologists like yourself discuss it only in terms of "time-to-dick" and the exploits it'll enable, writing off the feature instead of acknowledging the flaws in the larger design that make it an issue.

This blasé attitude toward game design and the money that blindly supports it these days is why we can't have any of the nice things we had two decades ago, let alone see them improved on.

Neranja · May 3, 2021

uniqueuser said:
OPENWORLDSANDBOX

I thought it was quite obvious that Steve Sharif wants a sandbox in the style of ArchAge, primarily a Guild vs. Guild system where big organised guilds (who may also buy power, either through the item shop or from other players) have a ridiculous advantage in territorial control. Which of course, is important in game. That is the sandbox part. He wanted to "win" in ArchAge, and now he is making a game where he can "win" again. Everything seems to be subserviant to that goal.

To be completely honest, my preferred playstyle in MMO games is more in small group content, because players can form social bonds more easily that way--instead of being just a cog that has to perform according to pre-designed strategy.

Xerge · May 3, 2021

Just wait until he gets wreckt live on twitch in his own game.

Creslin · May 3, 2021

Neranja said:
I thought it was quite obvious that Steve Sharif wants a sandbox in the style of ArchAge, primarily a Guild vs. Guild system where big organised guilds (who may also buy power, either through the item shop or from other players) have a ridiculous advantage in territorial control. Which of course, is important in game. That is the sandbox part. He wanted to "win" in ArchAge, and now he is making a game where he can "win" again. Everything seems to be subserviant to that goal.

To be completely honest, my preferred playstyle in MMO games is more in small group content, because players can form social bonds more easily that way--instead of being just a cog that has to perform according to pre-designed strategy.

Ya that was pretty clear when they said guild leaders got insane perks like flying mounts etc. Personally I think it is a decent idea, large guilds make people feel like a part of something and community in a small group game is harder and competition is stiffer from other games.

The games that focus on group v group pvp combat tend to not either not have an MMO feel because it is battleground pvp or succumb to the wolves v sheep problem that kills so many pvp games. The guild v guild games tend to do a bit better since you can give players that pvp content in the guild v guild content but give them down time in group pve content when that isn't going on, you still have the wolf v sheep problem to some extent but in the guild focused games atleast the sheep can zerg it up to compensate.

etchazz · May 4, 2021

$500 to alpha test a game...

Neranja · May 4, 2021

Creslin said:
The guild v guild games tend to do a bit better since you can give players that pvp content in the guild v guild content but give them down time in group pve content when that isn't going on, you still have the wolf v sheep problem to some extent but in the guild focused games atleast the sheep can zerg it up to compensate.

Most PvP games, be it small scale or large scale had sub-par PvE. It seems getting the PvE right and balance it against the PvP is just really hard, and no one has yet managed to bottle that lightning into a seamless experience. Even WoW partitioned off large-scale PvP into battlegrounds to make it somewhat structured and not "biggest zerg wins".

Mahes · May 5, 2021

The Alpha One purchase is up now along with the new skins and such.

Nola · May 5, 2021

The hype around this game.

Amycus · May 7, 2021

Bored and have plenty of disposable income. I bought in for the alpha. Other than EQ TLP haven’t played a mmo in forever.

Mahes · May 7, 2021

I am also in the Alpha. Looking forward to this next weekend. Just need to figure out where download client is but I am sure I can find it this week.

Leibowitz · May 10, 2021

NDA lifting delayed link : Alpha One Schedule Update

Mahes · May 11, 2021

Kind of figured that was going to happen. The staff moving into the new building on top of the game not quite being where it needed to be were two strong reasons. It also did not help that it almost seemed like all the other companies were targeting their releases around the AoC NDA lift. Now they have some time to finish up and polish/test the siege system, while not conflicting with Everquest, Blizzard, and apparently ESO.

Cinge · May 11, 2021

Little conspiracy time.

I wonder if this guy is literally just making a game world where he can play king. I can't imagine him not playing himself. And i can easily imagine him giving himself every bit of help he wants. I'd say its a giant waste of money, but its a kickstarter game, so he didn't invest entire thing. Also the dude was spending thousands in closed beta of archeage to be on top, so wasting money is not a problem.

The amount of control and power given to guilds(and the GL). Who can keep the credit line going.

xmod2 · May 11, 2021

Mahes said:
It was discussed. They "could" add in the ability to drop items on the ground. The problem is that it leads to things that they do not want to have to deal with. He even sites an example of something he did with it causing players to get booted from Lineage 2 during a siege. It has nothing to do with tech. It has everything to do with players exploiting the feature to gain an advantage or to just be straight out be annoying. I am fine not seeing dicks and player names drawn out everywhere around the game world.

Players drawing dicks with droppables when bored is exactly the kind of content you DO want in an MMO. I want to hang out with my friends and bullshit in the game and do stuff that isn't 100% active gameplay all the time. If your game is just a 'well designed' single player experience that happens to be online, I'll just go play a single player game and not deal with the tedium of an MMO.

Mahes · May 11, 2021

You know there is PVP in the game. The game is centered around guilds forming to create cities that can be sieged by other guilds/alliances. The game is very group oriented. Not sure why you think having the ability to draw dicks adds to how the actual game functions. If you get bored with the game, you log out? I disagree that having the ability to drop items onto the grounds, adds that much playability to the game as to cure the boredom of the rest of the game. What it does add is the potential for players to abuse the system in ways that take away Dev time to deal with. In the end, this most likely is not the game for you, if you honestly have not done enough research to understand that this game is far away from a single player game.

etchazz · May 12, 2021

Mahes said:
You know there is PVP in the game. The game is centered around guilds forming to create cities that can be sieged by other guilds/alliances. The game is very group oriented. Not sure why you think having the ability to draw dicks adds to how the actual game functions. If you get bored with the game, you log out? I disagree that having the ability to drop items onto the grounds, adds that much playability to the game as to cure the boredom of the rest of the game. What it does add is the potential for players to abuse the system in ways that take away Dev time to deal with. In the end, this most likely is not the game for you, if you honestly have not done enough research to understand that this game is far away from a single player game.

I don't know why PvP is always seen as something good in a MMO. It has never been implemented into any game that I can think of that it was actually fun. Maybe vanilla WoW, but even then the class imbalances were insane. It always sounds great that they'll let you create cities that can be sieged by other guilds, but it just turns into a shit show and is never fun. Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2 come to mind as games that were built around PvP, and they sucked.

Kirun · May 12, 2021

etchazz said:
I don't know why PvP is always seen as something good in a MMO. It has never been implemented into any game that I can think of that it was actually fun. Maybe vanilla WoW, but even then the class imbalances were insane. It always sounds great that they'll let you create cities that can be sieged by other guilds, but it just turns into a shit show and is never fun. Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2 come to mind as games that were built around PvP, and they sucked.

Because a lot of people like the drama and dynamic content it creates? If people expect classes in MMO PvP to be balanced, you're better off sticking to an FPS where everyone can use the same guns, same body armor, etc. Half the fun of PvP in MMOs is for all the crazy, overpowered/underpowered shit that you can do.

uniqueuser · May 12, 2021

etchazz said:
were built around PvP, and they sucked.

Explicitly designing for PvP paradoxically results in not only bad PvP, but typically a bad game overall.

Too many games turn out like an overmixed cake because devs are so terrified of any lumps in the batter they'll beat it into a fine, homogeneous state and then wonder why it crumbles after it's baked.

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Ashes of Creation

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