Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016)

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C

Column_sl

shitlord
9,833
7
Lyrical_sl said:
As one reviewer said, go see this if you want to see Batman and Superman fight. Don't go see this if you are expecting a good story, or character advancement (there wasn't any). They even made Batman one-dimensional, and there were gaping plot holes.
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Yeah, but it's not supposed to be Shakespeare . It's the same formula that Marvel is using on their big films.

Group of Super Heroes fighting ,and a big bad at the end that is defeated. As far as character development, we got a major change to a character in this Film, as well as introducing new ones into their cinematic universe.

I'm not saying this movie is the greatest thing ever, but the excuses to hate it are quite silly given the movies these same people praise.
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
Column_sl said:
Yeah, but it's not supposed to be Shakespeare . It's the same formula that Marvel is using on their big films.

Group of Super Heroes fighting ,and a big bad at the end that is defeated. As far as character development, we got a major change to a character in this Film, as well as introducing new ones into their cinematic universe.

I'm not saying this movie is the greatest thing ever, but the excuses to hate it are quite silly given the movies these same people praise.
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No.

In Batman v Superman, the only winner is Marvel.
 
Jive Turkey

Jive Turkey

Karen
6,737
9,143
Lyrical_sl said:
84% on RT
65 on Meta

Usually anything close to 70%+ on meta is golden.
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I guess it was more the idea of "When was the last time a superhero movie scored so high on RT/Meta?" I was responding to. Guardians of the Galaxy did better on both. Avengers too. Even Ant Man has similar scores to Deadpool. Fans loved Deadpool (myself included), but it was very divisive with critics. Metacritic gives a better idea of the quality of a movie than the binary nature of Rotten Tomatoes
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
Column_sl said:
You just sound like a fanboy now. I like Marvel a lot as well, but there is room for other franchises.
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Anyone that says that the last two DC movies have been on par with the Disney/Marvel movies story wise, is trolling. And you are correct. I am a DC fan boy that has a $4,000 statue of Batman sitting in his mancave. I can still be objective. Marvel > DC in movie superhero storytelling. Duh.

There is room for more superhero story telling, but get rid of Snyder.
 
Cad

Cad

scientia potentia est
<Bronze Donator>
25,818
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I think part of the issue is the same reason Professor X never participates in the battles in X-men, or there's some retarded reason he can't use his powers. He's overpowered.

Superman should be part of the story but just swoop in and wtfpwn at the end (or not). But continually coming up ways that people can fight him or having completely insane monsters for him to fight gets old.

At the end of the day Superman is just kind of a shit character if there's supposed to be any danger in the movie, but the only thing worse than having a shit character is having shit plot holes to justify fights with him.
 
mkopec

mkopec

<Gold Donor>
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The batman thing I can get behind. Hes a good hero. Vigilante type with limitless money to make shit happen, like suits of armor, bat car, bat plane and the such. along with his martial training, you can see this guy actually existing to some point.

But Superman on the other hand is just made too perfect as a super hero. Limitless strength, super speed, xray vision, lazer vision, fly, even turn back time as in the original Superman movie. With only one real weakness which is kryptonite. Its just too one dimensional. So its either get a hold of some kryptonite or be some super bad alien or something. Because as a human from this earth, you just have no chances.

And no, I have not seen this movie nor do I plan to until it comes to cable. As far as a fight between Superman and Bat man, its laughable at best. A human vigilante against a god like figure with no weakness other than kryptonite? Come on.
 
Phazael

Phazael

Confirmed Beta Shitlord, Fat Bastard
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
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I told you guys Affleck was going to be the least of this movies concerns. Snyder or not (and I happened to really like Watchmen), its near impossible to have the kind of levity or buddy cop dynamic of the Marvel IP with the DC characters. They are all generally absurdly overpowered (aside from their one consistent cash cow, Batman) and generally lack any sort of meaningful character flaws to make them interesting (aside from, again, Batman). They were modern takes on greek gods, not relatable characters. Superman is the ultimate expression of this issue, as he is invincible and a flawless person. How the hell do you write for that kind of character? That they drew elements from several disparate sources (DKR, Killing Joke, some Kingdom Come, ect) just made things even more difficult.

The abusive nature of their powers and what can be done with them is the only thing that makes DC characters interesting, never the characters themselves (again, aside from Batman). Its the major reason for all the grimdarking and the WB teams seeming complete inability to get the movie IP going. The best superhero movies are greek tragedies, with strong character arcs, great acting, and strong villains. The battles are there for eye candy to tie things together. ITs a major reason TDK and Winter Soldier were so good and why no DC movie will ever get the kind of long term prestige that some of the Marvel movies have.
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
Jive Turkey_sl said:
I guess it was more the idea of "When was the last time a superhero movie scored so high on RT/Meta?" I was responding to. Guardians of the Galaxy did better on both. Avengers too. Even Ant Man has similar scores to Deadpool. Fans loved Deadpool (myself included), but it was very divisive with critics. Metacritic gives a better idea of the quality of a movie than the binary nature of Rotten Tomatoes
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As an aside about positive social media (Deadpool Is Now Highest Grossing R-Rated Movie Ever At Worldwide Box Office | Comicbook.com). Deadpool cost like 50m, and has made 750m? Batman v Superman will struggle to make 1B off of a cost of 400m. Who has the better ROI?
 
T

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
14,163
607
mkopec_sl said:
A human vigilante against a god like figure with no weakness other than kryptonite? Come on.
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You're being a bit shallow here. Batman has access to unlimited tech. It isn't like he squares off and roundhouses Superman in the jaw and Superman drops. You listed reasons Batman is an interesting hero above and then just completely discounted them below.
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
mkopec_sl said:
As far as a fight between Superman and Bat man, its laughable at best. A human vigilante against a god like figure with no weakness other than kryptonite? Come on.
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The fight was indeed laughable, but the opposite of what you were thinking.
 
C

Column_sl

shitlord
9,833
7
Lyrical_sl said:
Anyone that says that the last two DC movies have been on par with the Disney/Marvel movies story wise, is trolling. And you are correct. I am a DC fan boy that has a $4,000 statue of Batman sitting in his mancave. I can still be objective. Marvel > DC in movie superhero storytelling. Duh.

There is room for more superhero story telling, but get rid of Snyder.
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On par story wise? Do you watch these films? lmao. The reason the Marvel movies are good is because of great casting, direction, Dialogue, and a respect for their comic book counterparts.

Their stories have been greatly criticized. They are literally bad guy appears, and group beats bad guy at the end. We haven't even gotten one strong antagonist yet in a full film, and we are well into phase 3....

And just because you are batman nerd who buys 4000 dollar life sized dolls doesn't give you an credibility that you have an open mind when it comes to anything that isn't Marvel in film.
 
Royal

Royal

Connoisseur of Exotic Pictures
15,077
10,643
Lyrical_sl said:
No.

In Batman v Superman, the only winner is Marvel.
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There's another way to look at it that doesn't come up smelling like roses for Marvel.

Some people keep saying, in the hopes of eventually being right, that the super hero movie bubble is going to burst. It eventually will, but one of the things that will be a major factor in that will be if, on balance, the movies stop being particularly good. What the general audience considers good not the critics on Rotten Tomatoes. Throw enough F4's and Amazing Spider-Man 2's into the mix and audiences will start to cool on super hero movies in general. Even Disney/Marvel won't be immune to the sinking tide since a lot of general audience members don't even distinguish between DC and Marvel, much less the different Marvel properties spread out across different studios.

Marvel as the lone competent player on the field isn't good for Marvel, in the long run.
 
mkopec

mkopec

<Gold Donor>
26,477
40,550
Tenks_sl said:
You're being a bit shallow here. Batman has access to unlimited tech. It isn't like he squares off and roundhouses Superman in the jaw and Superman drops. You listed reasons Batman is an interesting hero above and then just completely discounted them below.
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No its not "unlimited tech" because there is no tech to beat back a god such as Superman. At least the way I understand the two heroes from my limited knowledge of them in comics and movies.
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
Phazael_sl said:
I told you guys Affleck was going to be the least of this movies concerns. Snyder or not (and I happened to really like Watchmen), its near impossible to have the kind of levity or buddy cop dynamic of the Marvel IP with the DC characters. They are all generally absurdly overpowered (aside from their one consistent cash cow, Batman) and generally lack any sort of meaningful character flaws to make them interesting (aside from, again, Batman). They were modern takes on greek gods, not relatable characters. Superman is the ultimate expression of this issue, as he is invincible and a flawless person. How the hell do you write for that kind of character? That they drew elements from several disparate sources (DKR, Killing Joke, some Kingdom Come, ect) just made things even more difficult.

The abusive nature of their powers and what can be done with them is the only thing that makes DC characters interesting, never the characters themselves (again, aside from Batman). Its the major reason for all the grimdarking and the WB teams seeming complete inability to get the movie IP going. The best superhero movies are greek tragedies, with strong character arcs, great acting, and strong villains. The battles are there for eye candy to tie things together. ITs a major reason TDK and Winter Soldier were so good and why no DC movie will ever get the kind of long term prestige that some of the Marvel movies have.
Click to expand...
The way to make Superman interesting is to nerf him. After Crisis on Infinite Earths, he could barely lift 100 tons, couldn't fly through time, was only mostly invulnerable, and could only fly in space as long as he could hold his breath. He became more interesting when he started losing fights without the villain using Kryptonite, magic or telepathy. He does better when he's nerfed down say, Thor's level (base level, not all of that rune power or Odin power crap).

Unfortunately, they upped his power level again, and he's now able to move planets once more. And Batman outsells Superman 3:1 in comics.
 
C

Column_sl

shitlord
9,833
7
mkopec_sl said:
No its not "unlimited tech" because there is no tech to beat back a god such as Superman. At least the way I understand the two heroes from my limited knowledge of them in comics and movies.
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Eh? What exactly are you talking about Super Man has been beaten several times....
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
mkopec_sl said:
No its not "unlimited tech" because there is no tech to beat back a god such as Superman. At least the way I understand the two heroes from my limited knowledge of them in comics and movies.
Click to expand...
Go see the movie first, and then come back here talking shit.
 
Shonuff

Shonuff

Mr. Poopybutthole
5,538
791
Royal_sl said:
Marvel as the lone competent player on the field isn't good for Marvel, in the long run.
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I'm on team DC. No one wants to see a full DC cinematic universe on here than I do. But let's do it right. This is DC's fault. They were talking about doing a JLA movie since X1, but they kept putting it off. Now, after Avengers has made like 3.5B, they tried to get caught up in a three hour movie. Sorry DC, but Marvel took eight years to build up. Stop being so short-sighted.
 
C

Column_sl

shitlord
9,833
7
Lyrical_sl said:
I'm on team DC. No one wants to see a full DC cinematic universe on here than I do. But let's do it right.
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And exactly how do you do it right when there are tons of interpretations of every aspect of that universe.

Marvel has been pretty consistent, DC has not. They have always let the creative personnel re invent everything on a yearly basis, sometimes on a Story ARC basis.

Be like saying let's do Batman right. Which version of Batman. Franks? Neals? Bobs? Jims? Etc Etc....
 
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