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Cad

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Chris said:
Did they know that though? Some guy just shot someone, it's the US and you are a liberal, you are going to think it's a spree killer.

Kyle was 100% correct defending himself, but it's possible that the 2nd and 3rd shooting victims were correct (without hindsight) in taking down what they may have thought was a spree killer.

So basically they need to show that the 1st victim was a thug out looking for trouble, the other two are less relevent.
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Kyle was running towards the police, and was telling the police he just shot someone. The "heroes" were actually trying to stop Kyle from reaching the police.

Spree killer who needs to be stopped, indeed.
 
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Chris

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So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
 
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Sludig

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OneofOne said:
I know this is a foreign concept because you live on that island whose government intentionally terrifies you of all things gun, but just because someone shot someone else, it doesn't automatically mean the shooter is the bad guy. And most sane people know this. Most sane people would take a moment assess the situation BEFORE taking action.

Or do you routinely rush cops shooting at people?
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Well beyond that, that they had to chase him a fair distance, if he was a spree killer why would he run a block rather than yeeting them from a distance.
 
Slaanesh69

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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
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That is an amazing (read: retarded) strawman you have there.

Please stop. You are going to embarrass yourself. Again.
 
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Gavinmad

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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
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Apples to persimmons because of the completely unrelated scenarios but I'll bite anyway.

If you perform a citizen's arrest on this person and it turns out he wasn't the shooter, you are going to jail for assault and false imprisonment. If you kill them, you're going to jail for murder. Your good intentions don't matter if you have the wrong person.
 
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Janx

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Chris said:
Did they know that though? Some guy just shot someone, it's the US and you are a liberal, you are going to think it's a spree killer.

Kyle was 100% correct defending himself, but it's possible that the 2nd and 3rd shooting victims were correct (without hindsight) in taking down what they may have thought was a spree killer.

So basically they need to show that the 1st victim was a thug out looking for trouble, the other two are less relevent.
Click to expand...
Why would you think you need to take down someone that is literally running TO the cops?
 
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Ambiturner

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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
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No.

First, learn what a spree killer is.

Then learn what an active shooter is. I think that's what you're going for, but still doesn't apply.

Finally, never involve yourself (you specifically) in a situation where someone could get hurt because you'll just fuck it all up.
 
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Brodhi

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Janx said:
Why would you think you need to take down someone that is literally running TO the cops?
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Yup, he is not acting like an aggressor whatsoever, he has his gun pointed down, he is running towards police. One possible scenario is no one does anything, another possible scenario is someone goes up to Kyle and asks , "hey, what just happened". Crazy idea, but finding out what happened might have been a better idea than yelling "lets cranium the kid" and charging in like some larping faggots in a conflict zone trying to kill some complete stranger with zero context.
 
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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
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I think you're taking your chances if you do, because what if that guy is a security guard? What if he's a parent that went to his car and got his gun to help his kids? You attack him and he shoots you, who is wrong?

You rush someone you better be right. Because if he's innocent, now you're the criminal and he can kill you.

Which again, is exactly what happened.

Which part of this is confusing for you, sir?
 
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Ishad

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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
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So if I see two people shooting guns at each other with a dead body in between them I can shoot whichever one I want right?
 
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Tmac

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Chris said:
So if you see someone walking around a school with a gun and you heard some loud bangs earlier, you shouldn't try to take them out in an effort to save the students? Because for all you know there is a totally legitimate reason for it?
Click to expand...

The fact that you have to fabricate a retarded example that has nothing to do with this situation should tell you everything you need to know about your position.
 
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Ambiturner

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What part is confusing you idiots? You hear a loud noise then later that day see someone walking down the street while legally carrying a firearm.

The only rational thing to do is to heroically start swinging your skateboard at the guy's head in order to save countless lives
 
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BoozeCube

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Hero Saint AR of Kyle was defending his neighbors and tried to stop felons from burning down a town who were pedophiles, wife beaters and literal scum and retards here are still trying to paint him as the bad guy. It's amazing how far society has fallen.

It comes out the FBI even had film and buried it to fuck over the kid. It's a shame there is even a trial at all
 
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Tmac

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Cad said:
I think you're taking your chances if you do, because what if that guy is a security guard? What if he's a parent that went to his car and got his gun to help his kids? You attack him and he shoots you, who is wrong?

You rush someone you better be right. Because if he's innocent, now you're the criminal and he can kill you.

Which again, is exactly what happened.

Which part of this is confusing for you, sir?
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The lens through which he looks is all fucky. He can’t help himself. I mean he could, he just doesn’t want to, bc that would be unpopular in his country.
 
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Gavinmad

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Ambiturner said:
You hear a loud noise then later that day see someone walking down the street while legally carrying a firearm.
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For the sake of argument, let's say Kyle actually had murdered the first guy. Does hearing people in a mob shout 'he just shot a guy' give me probable cause to attempt a citizen's arrest on that person? I assume it doesn't.
 
Srathor

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Sadly that's what all this bullshit is supposed to find out.

I feel sorry for the kid, and I am amazed he didn't just lose his shit and blow away anyone that came near him.
And I am even more amazed that he isn't trying to blow away everyone else around after what 2 years of this punishing bullshit.
 
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Cad

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Gavinmad said:
For the sake of argument, let's say Kyle actually had murdered the first guy. Does hearing people in a mob shout 'he just shot a guy' give me probable cause to attempt a citizen's arrest on that person? I assume it doesn't.
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Citizen's arrest is a very touchy thing. It depends which state you're in, what the requirements are.

In Texas, for example, you have to be personally witnessing the felony or danger to the community right in front of you. It can't be second-hand. You have to be witnessing it for the arrest to be lawful.

The problem being, what if I just run out and shout "that guy did such and such! Get him!" (again, exactly what happened) - and that guy did nothing? Now you're attacking a guy who did nothing... And he defends himself, and kills you. Now, you thought you were in the right. So did he. Who was right?

It's a very difficult, tough spot to be in. At the very most, I think it would have been a good idea for them to say, "go to the police right now" and follow him to make sure he did. But attacking him? Thats just double-A+ stupid.
 
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Ambiturner

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Gavinmad said:
For the sake of argument, let's say Kyle actually had murdered the first guy. Does hearing people in a mob shout 'he just shot a guy' give me probable cause to attempt a citizen's arrest on that person? I assume it doesn't.
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No. Not even close.

For a little more detail, in Nevada you don't have to actually witness it for a felony citizen's arrest, but still have to reach the threshold of probable cause. Not knowing any facts, circumstances, or even if the alleged crime even happened at all means you have no grounds to do anything.

An officer could probably justify an investigative detention, but if the only information they had was the third hand info and they made an arrest based on that they'd lose their job and the arrestee would have an easy payday coming to them
 
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Gavinmad said:
For the sake of argument, let's say Kyle actually had murdered the first guy. Does hearing people in a mob shout 'he just shot a guy' give me probable cause to attempt a citizen's arrest on that person? I assume it doesn't.
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You are right. If you didn't witness it, it doesn't count. Now let's apply the same logic to Ahmad arbury case.
 
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Chris

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If the dead guys had perfect knowledge of the situation (eg Kyle running to cops), how come they didn't know that they would die?
 
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