Marriage and the Power of Divorce

Fuck dude.

Alex said:

Fuck dude.

Click to expand...

Yeah I dont know if people truly get what I mean when I say I have terrible luck with relationships.

I'm not talking about some 6 month dry spell. Its not unheard of for me to go years without so much as a date

It can be a bitter pill.

Expectations, lower them. And i'm not saying to just fuck fatties. I'm talking about personally. Accept what is, find the good in it, and either tolerate or change what isn't.

Avoid self pity. That really is death. And it's a miserable death.

There's so much trite advice and you've heard all of it. The work is the thing, it will never get better on it's own. That's the bitter pill. The work is the thing.

I used to be extremely social. I'm not for the past 10 years, and I don't have the excuse of married with children. I was no happier though. I was often more distracted and connected, and no less happy.

Sweat more, worry less. It sounds stupid but it really does work that way. We're not all that complex, in the meta.

You're no more, or less, alone than anyone in this life. I know that sounds like a lie. It's all just waiting for Goddot.

That may all sound callous. Like many here I have battled depression my entire life. Sometimes i win, sometimes I lose. This is what tends to work from personal experience.

It can be a bitter pill.

Expectations, lower them. And i'm not saying to just fuck fatties. I'm talking about personally. Accept what is, find the good in it, and either tolerate or change what isn't.

Avoid self pity. That really is death. And it's a miserable death.

There's so much trite advice and you've heard all of it. The work is the thing, it will never get better on it's own. That's the bitter pill. The work is the thing.

I used to be extremely social. I'm not for the past 10 years, and I don't have the excuse of married with children. I was no happier though. I was often more distracted and connected, and no less happy.

Sweat more, worry less. It sounds stupid but it really does work that way. We're not all that complex, in the meta.

You're no more, or less, alone than anyone in this life. I know that sounds like a lie. It's all just waiting for Goddot.

That may all sound callous. Like many here I have battled depression my entire life. Sometimes i win, sometimes I lose. This is what tends to work from personal experience.

Click to expand...

You dont think I'm already aware of that? Thats kind of the whole point of my original post. No matter how much I try to lower my expectations or try to get professional help or conform to a standard, nothing seems to help

Autistics indulge in self harm and it's got nothing to do with anything except being autistic.

The rest of us have reasons for doing it. Like I said it's not "just go fuck fatties, lol". That's the wrong response for a variety of reasons.

The place you want to get to is the place where you are important enough that the idea of self harm seems counterproductive. It would be exceptionally advantageous (to you, it matters fuck all to me) if you get there without needing the validation of a woman. But you can get there either way.

I don't know you or your situation, man. I'm not pretending to. Your emotional responses may be entirely reasonable. If they are, and in certain lights they have to be, I would submit that reasonable isn't doing you a bit of fucking good.

You don't get women by changing your hair. If you think you are worthless, and feel that way, there are social cues you don't realize you're sending but are. It's hard to hide. You could learn how to mask those. There's an art to that. But that takes more work than just not feeling worthless.

I'm not being a judgemental dick. On purpose at least. You feel the way you feel. You have tried taking some steps to rectify it. Going to a therapist. That didn't work out so great. It doesn't always click... and i'm 50/50 on how useful they can be to begin with. Some of 'em really fucking suck. But you tried and good on you. Have you tried sweating? I mean worst case, sweat hard for 6 months and you'll still feel like a sack of shit but you'll look better. And honestly, unless you're already in really good shape you'll be amazed.

Women absolutely do care about how you present yourself. That's part of your "aura", and part of that is how you dress. If you look like a slob their first impression will be that you're a slob, and even if it's because you just volunteered for habitat for humanity you're immediately going to be fighting an uphill battle. And you're going to have to hope there is a way to work that explanation into the conversation if you have any shot of changing their mind. Every woman I know wants a man who can take care of himself, and if you can barely dress yourself, a very simple task, what does that say about your ability to take care of yourself?

I think the problem here is when a man talks about dressing nice and other men or women say things like "That doesn't matter", they are envisioning an episode of queer eye for the straight guy. That's not what dressing nice is. It's being clean, having clothes that fit, aren't ragged and aren't wrinkled and displaying good personal hygiene. It doesn't mean the height of designer fashion.

That being said, Nozz are you sure you aren't gay and just trying to fight it? Because if that's the case that could be the problem with women finding you attractive, they can tell you aren't really very interested in them. I'm no psychological expert but it seems pretty rare (outside of prison anyway) for a man who isn't gay to participate in homosexual activity purely out of loneliness. That's what cheap hookers and escorts are for.

Thought I'd pop in to receive my R.I.P.s.

Got engaged in Rome in May and am getting married in August. Trying for kids will likely start shortly thereafter.

On topic... I think what everyone meant was things besides what you mentioned Khane. Having proper hygiene and proper clothes that fit are a given, for anyone of either sex. I think people meant beyond that, designer brands, flashy jewelry, etc.

You can also buy nice clothes that look good without being ripped off, which I think is the way to go even if you are getting married in a few months . A really nice pair of selvedge raw denim jeans costs more than some junk from Walmart (~$120 vs ~$20) but in terms of value the former beat the latter every time. They'll last 10 years look great from the first day to the last.

Khane said:

Women absolutely do care about how you present yourself. That's part of your "aura", and part of that is how you dress. If you look like a slob their first impression will be that you're a slob, and even if it's because you just volunteered for habitat for humanity you're immediately going to be fighting an uphill battle. And you're going to have to hope there is a way to work that explanation into the conversation if you have any shot of changing their mind. Every woman I know wants a man who can take care of himself, and if you can barely dress yourself, a very simple task, what does that say about your ability to take care of yourself?

I think the problem here is when a man talks about dressing nice and other men or women say things like "That doesn't matter", they are envisioning an episode of queer eye for the straight guy. That's not what dressing nice is. It's being clean, having clothes that fit, aren't ragged and aren't wrinkled and displaying good personal hygiene. It doesn't mean the height of designer fashion.

That being said, Nozz are you sure you aren't gay and just trying to fight it? Because if that's the case that could be the problem with women finding you attractive, they can tell you aren't really very interested in them. I'm no psychological expert but it seems pretty rare (outside of prison anyway) for a man who isn't gay to participate in homosexual activity purely out of loneliness. That's what cheap hookers and escorts are for.

Click to expand...

I do wear clothes that fit and everything you said

I’ve paid for escorts: I’ll prob see one this weekend

I’m not actively attracted to men and live near Santa Monica LBC and W Hollywood. I don’t go out of my way to have sex with men: it usually just happens as opposed to being actively sexually attracted to women

What you mentioned about homosexuality in prison is a pretty accurate statement: I feel like I’m trapped in a prison, or at least a deserted island
Seems I can’t win either way; if I show any sign of interest, then I tried too hard, if I don’t show any interest I’m ignored anyways

oh. You live in a county that is world famous for shallow gold digging bitches.

I revise my previous statements. Still work on yourself, I take none of that back, but youd have better luck in oregon.

TheNozz said:

I do wear clothes that fit and everything you said

I’ve paid for escorts: I’ll prob see one this weekend

I’m not actively attracted to men and live near Santa Monica LBC and W Hollywood. I don’t go out of my way to have sex with men: it usually just happens as opposed to being actively sexually attracted to women

Click to expand...

If you are looking for a partner then even if you were bi, you are much more likely to find a woman to settle down with. Just by virtue of math finding a compatible female partner is way easier than a male one.

Truth be told it is really hard to diagnose the issues you are having from across the internet. I've generally been surprisingly good with women, but I had a 2 year dry spell after moving for work that didn't end until I left. I don't know if my issues were the same as yours but I can tell you about my experience and it might help.

In retrospect several simultaneous problems occurred concurrently. I moved to a place with no social network, worked most of the time, and my health declined due to a lack of exercise and poor eating habits. I became depressed which compounded everything that was going wrong already. I eventually started working on my health issues and then moved back home to a more normal job. Everything improved from that point, including running into someone I sort of knew from High School whom I had a relationship with for a while.

When I moved a second time (even further away) I was determined not to repeat those mistakes. I maintained my health, didn't work too much, and so on. The most important thing I did was establish a new social network. I am a natural homebody but I worked hard on making friends and attending social events right away. I spring-boarded one friendship into another and ended up building a pretty wide network of friends by putting in some early effort.

The key difference was not focusing on romantic relationships but building genuine friendships with people I enjoyed spending time with (of both sexes) and cared about platonically. Despite living in a foreign country I am surrounded by friends that are as close as my childhood ones back home, and having such friends has been critical to my happiness.

I met both my ex and my current fiance through them, which is how I've always met partners. I can't recall ever meeting someone via the more standard social channels like bars. It was always just hanging out and running into enough new people in low pressure social situations. I don't know what your friendship network looks like, but if you don't have a good one I can see that making meeting someone more difficult.

Like I said I don't know you so it is hard to pinpoint the issues you are having. They can often be esoteric or deeply psychological. And things compound, so you might be in a situation with 3 or 4 small problems that individually aren't a problem but together contribute.

^^ Seems like concentrating on making friends is a much better first step than trying to find love. Aside from the intrinsic benefits of having friends and social outlets it's also a bit of a red flag for potential lovers to find out that you have no friends.

Khane said:

^^ Seems like concentrating on making friends is a much better first step than trying to find love. Aside from the intrinsic benefits of having friends and social outlets it's also a bit of a red flag for potential lovers to find out that you have no friends.

Click to expand...

That was my conclusion too, my fiance is 5th order relationship that started 10 years ago.

I became friends with a guy at work who was a local (and therefore had a social network in place). I met a now close friend during an MST3K party at his house, we bonded over our mutual love of Pop Tarts which don't exist here but she had while living in the US. Later at one of her parties I spent most of the night talking about Fallout 3 with a girl in her university program. We too became close friends.

8 years later, I was at her boyfriend's (now my friend also) birthday party, where a friend of theirs I had only briefly met once before asked me if I was single while we were playing Mario Kart and chatting. She wasn't interested in me, but had recently eaten dinner with a high school friend that was complaining about guy trouble. That night she arranged the introduction with my now fiance.

This is how things happen in my opinion, not just in love but for all sorts of important events in life. There is no way I could have predicted or arranged that highly improbable multi-year chain of events and it would be futile to try. They key is to cultivate all sorts of relationships in a genuine and meaningful way. Don't pretend to be someone you aren't to impress a girl, be the best version of you possible. Be a good person and a good friend, someone other people enjoy being around and so many things will fall into place.

TheNozz said:

You dont think I'm already aware of that? Thats kind of the whole point of my original post. No matter how much I try to lower my expectations or try to get professional help or conform to a standard, nothing seems to help

Click to expand...

How much do you make? Just go get a call girl or few dude.

Don’t have a lot of money these days?

I use escorts when I can but I can’t afford to do it more than once every couple months

TheNozz said:

Don’t have a lot of money these days?

I use escorts when I can but I can’t afford to do it more than once every couple months

Click to expand...

What do your non-romntic relationships look like?

With women or you mean my friends?