Overwatch

BoozeCube · Feb 7, 2018

I don't know what happened but the quality of games have dropped dramatically. I don't know if it's because the season is still newish but I played a few games tonight in mid plat and 1/2 of my games have been double sniper vs shield tanks, or some guy switching off of heals to go dps. I get it everyone thinks they are jesus DEEPS but these faggots can't even get picks. I have mostly played Moria recently but goddamn it's aids when you are the only healer and they dont even give you tanks.

skribble · Feb 7, 2018

Im amazed they aren't looking at DVA. She's a must pick in nearly every game, she's a fucking tank assassin that can fly and has two health bars, and can negate some of the most powerful ultis in the game (and assassinate the person afterward too for good measure). The fact she's not on their radar and they're trying to fix up shithouse heroes no-one gives a fuck about is mind boggling to me. He even she's 'very powerful'. No fucking shit. Would it hurt to adjust her burst damage so she doesn't fucking assasinate nearly every single target she fights? Or stop her guns from being able to crit headshots? Or just any small nerf to make her 'powerful' rather than 'very powerful'

I don't give a fuck about mei blizzard. Just stop adding in heroes with no aim abilities, spam and mobility creep (COUGH MOIRA), and fucking fix the obviously overpowered shit. Orissas shield is too strong. Mercy needed nerfed for like 3 months. DVA needs reigned in. Moira will probably need some adjusting (maybe). Wow, comp is suddenly so much more better.

But nope. Cucklords need to make mei playable. Mei is a fucking niche pick and I think 99% of the game are ok with that because she's another character that if you make her viable in every situations she's gonna be fucking oppressing as shit. Also, hey you know what else people liked fighting throughout the whole time OW was released? Turrets. Better fix those up too.

Valderen · Feb 7, 2018

I think they could Torbjorn an ability when he doesn’t have a turret. Or ressource meter of some kind that fills up when he doesn’t have a turret and allowing him to put down a level 2 turret immediately when it’s full.

No clue what they can do with Symmetra though other than a big rework.

The one they have to be very careful with is Mei. I love Mei but she can be extremely frustrating to play against. If she ends up being good enough to be use on a lot of map, it could be bad for the game. I'd play her all the time though so conflicted here.

Removing or reworking scatter arrow is long overdue...probably the single most annoying ability in the game...1 shot tanks...seriously.

Still nice to see them working on those heroes.

skribble · Feb 7, 2018

I am completely fine with how torb is. Im fine with heroes which are more suitable for offence vs defence. Torb is a hero that punishes unorganised teams because he has a fucking AI sentry which does high dps automatically, and can snowball if he gets some armor packs rolling. On the other side of the coin, he suffers against organised teams which can actually shoot the turret and push correctly.

I love torb, and Im totally fine with this playstyle. Why does torb need to be strong at all levels of the game (which is NEVER gonna be achievable any way as long as he has an AI turret).

Out of their shit list , sombra is the only genuine character which needs some sort of love.

ex-genj · Feb 7, 2018

eh can't agree there. Doomfist is just awful. Way too big, doesnt do shit most of the time, does his combo and dies over and over. Never once this season seen one be effective even after his fixes. Honestly just slap 300 hps on him and that's probably good enough.

Both Mei and Sombra are close to being good. Minor tweaks to cds and they'd be useful. Right now is there ever a time you wish you had any of those 3 over a Tracer? Sombra literally is supposed to do Tracer's job but is 1/2 as effective and in 90% of ranked her ult is the worst in the game.

Araxen · Feb 7, 2018

A lot of the maps weren't designed for Sombra because mega's are in places that her team can't make use of really well. Blizz World is a great map for her I feel. There are mega's all over the place for her to hack and her team to use.

Jeff posted they feel D'Va, Winston, and Pharah are in good spots and they aren't making any changes to them.

Mei needs her bugs fixed and then they need to tweak her. I hope they don't do it the other way around again like they did with D'Va and DM. Who knows what they are going to do with Doomfist. He was an ill conceived hero from the start especially since they just got done gutting and reworking Roadhog.

Kharzette · Feb 7, 2018

I think Mei is fine. If I think about all the times I've died in iceblock, or died to bullets coming through the wall I just put down, those would be nice to have. But they would probably have to trust my client over others (which is what hitscan shots do anyway). And we all know how fun it is to dodge round a corner and have bullets come through the wall and kill you anyway.

Would be like old roadhog hook.

Araxen · Feb 8, 2018

Mei's left-click should slow down vertical movement and currently it doesn't. If a Genji is jumping around it's almost impossible to freeze him.

Edit: WTF is going on with Seoul. Losing to LAV. LAG could have beaten LAV, but they just had to sub Surefour out!

Whidon · Feb 8, 2018

I don't see how they can't realize DVA ult blast radius is to damn big and seems to often ignore LOS.

Maybe it's a bug or something but it feels like if I'm playing a hero like Mercy and i hear that stupid "nerf this" nearby i am basically dead unless I'm already behind cover, and forget moving out of range since they nerfed valk speed. One game today i had suspicions this was happening but one game today i clearly moved behind a wall or something and got killed anyways, I watched the video to confirm it, maybe it's a bug? Maybe lag? but i never seem to have this problem except on that one ability so i doubt it.

Moiria is really strong but she at least requires a fair bit of skill to play decently and the right map/squad comp/coordination for her to be really good. I had a few games the other day where we had a Mercy + Moiria and basically our DVA + Rein/Orisa never died. We had almost no offensive ability coordination and just out healed/dps the opponents in every fight for hours.

But if you try to use her as a main healer with dumb players and on certain maps your going to have a really bad time. Knowing Blizz they will probably "fix" her by nerfing Mercy again as she's not super strong without another good healer imo..

Araxen · Feb 8, 2018

They aren't going to nerf D'Va's Ult. In the higher elo's its just used to get her mech back more quickly and any kills is a bonus. I rarely have a hard time getting out of the way of it. Sometimes a D'Va will throw it up at a good time though and get me. I used to think the range was too far, but not anymore. I just try and keep myself prepared for it and close to a get out of the way quickly spot.

Valderen · Feb 8, 2018

I think what we are seeing with Seoul is that the biggest advantage the Korean teams had over the other teams was greater team cohesion since they have been together for so long. It isn't so much individual player skills. The other teams are getting better at working together while the Korean team are pretty much the same, so the gap is closing somewhat.

I think by stage 4 we might have a much more balanced league. There will still be teams at the top and at the bottom but I think the gap will be smaller.

Cybsled · Feb 8, 2018

D'vas ult is fine. It is no coincidence that virtually all the heroes listed on their balance list are almost never used in pro games.

Ravishing · Feb 8, 2018

Whidon said:
I don't see how they can't realize DVA ult blast radius is to damn big and seems to often ignore LOS.

Maybe it's a bug or something but it feels like if I'm playing a hero like Mercy and i hear that stupid "nerf this" nearby i am basically dead unless I'm already behind cover, and forget moving out of range since they nerfed valk speed. One game today i had suspicions this was happening but one game today i clearly moved behind a wall or something and got killed anyways, I watched the video to confirm it, maybe it's a bug? Maybe lag? but i never seem to have this problem except on that one ability so i doubt it.

Moiria is really strong but she at least requires a fair bit of skill to play decently and the right map/squad comp/coordination for her to be really good. I had a few games the other day where we had a Mercy + Moiria and basically our DVA + Rein/Orisa never died. We had almost no offensive ability coordination and just out healed/dps the opponents in every fight for hours.

But if you try to use her as a main healer with dumb players and on certain maps your going to have a really bad time. Knowing Blizz they will probably "fix" her by nerfing Mercy again as she's not super strong without another good healer imo..

lol... That's weird, i just find the nearest lightpost and seem to escape unscathed.
They could always try buffing her ult and nerfing something else.

I think the game is in a decent spot after Mercy nerf. I would like a fix to "Ult disappears if you die". This especially hurts Mei. I hesitate buffing Mei because you definitely don't want Mei being a viable pick everywhere. I love Mei and she's my go-to more often than not. If you're on point with the Right-Click then you can do some work. I love sniping widows and pharahs with Mei.

I think Mei just needs an Ult buff. Line of Sight glitches need to be fixed (remove LOS from Ult), and the ult disappearing thing that I mentioned already.

Maybe it can do slightly more damage too as a bonus.

But otherwise I think she's about where you want her.

Valderen · Feb 8, 2018

I think Blizzard will try to do the same thing in Overwatch that they did in WoW.

You know the "Bring the player, not the class" thing. Never really worked, but they'll try anyway "Bring the player, not the hero".

To that end, they attempt to make all hero viable in all situations, hoping that will fix the toxicity with one-tricks. I mean no one will be toxic toward a Symmetra if she's always viable right? Right?

I don't agree with that philosophy to be honest, I like that there are niche heroes, allows for more unique design of heroes.

Whidon · Feb 8, 2018

Valderen said:
I think Blizzard will try to do the same thing in Overwatch that they did in WoW.

You know the "Bring the player, not the class" thing. Never really worked, but they'll try anyway "Bring the player, not the hero".

To that end, they attempt to make all hero viable in all situations, hoping that will fix the toxicity with one-tricks. I mean no one will be toxic toward a Symmetra if she's always viable right? Right?

I don't agree with that philosophy to be honest, I like that there are niche heroes, allows for more unique design of heroes.

Man i hope your wrong about that. That would pretty much kill the game.

Fixing DVA's ult would be so easy i don't understand why they haven't done it yet. Just don't let her "Throw" it. IE no using it during boosters and it halts movement speed 95% once the ability has been triggered.

I simply don't believe "People don't die to it at high elos" given people used correctly it can nearly be nearly impossible for 2-3 guys not to get away from it in the right area. Maybe reduce the Aoe fall off so it won't kill a full HP 200 hp hero who is 20m+ away.

The biggest problem for me Right now it's a no risk ult Something that was not even the case with Valk. I or my team mates can and often do shoot down Junkrat Tires but DVA get's a free, no risk chance to kill your opponents key heroes every few minutes.

It would still be a powerful ability as she has a fuck ton of HP but you would at least have to risk something to make use of it.

skribble · Feb 8, 2018

Im actually ok with DVAs ult. It definitely has some counterplay because you can kill the DVA before she can resuit, and she also has to stand still to resuit and you can burst her in this window. All other tank ultimates are pretty strong with the exception of orissas being kind of garbage. It also has some skill factor because if you took some gold DVA and tried for her to ultimate kill a bunch of GMs, no-one would ever get hit by it. But a well placed ulti from someone like poko can snipe grandmasters, and ults should have an impact right?

The problem with DVA is that she has a totally inflated kit. She can burst down nearly any non tank hero in the game with hardly any risk because of her jet packs, RMB, and the fact she has to be killed twice. She can also peel very well, and can negate a lot of powerful ultimates. Her sustained dps is also very strong.

Its hard to know where blizzard are going with overwatch. It seems like it was designed initially as this 'everyone can play and have fun!' type of game with low skill required but high impact characters and the fact that there is no scoreboard in the game.

Now there is this massive push to make it an esport, but these type of heroes are still being introduced. Maybe moira does have a higher skill cap (im not convinced), but the fact they added another hero with mostly auto lock on and high mobility/self sustain for relatively low skill required makes me wonder what exactly their overall design goal is. Heroes like zen/ana are fun to watch because we can appreciate the skill involved when jjonak kills 3 people in a row with orbs. Watching moria hold RMB or aoe heal 4 tanks, not so much.

Whidon · Feb 8, 2018

Lets compare DVA's ULT to other tank Ults.

Rein: Shatter. Well Balanced, can win a team fight but requires excellent placement and risk in your big slow hero getting into the correct spot.

Orisa: Supercharger. Again it's strong and can swing a fight, but the charger itself can easily be blown up and requires the player using Orisa to physically get to the correct spot to use it despite being a slow Hero with a big hitbox.

Roadhog: Wholehog. Can do great dmg and push heroes off ground you don't want them on. Another well balanced ULT as it requires you again to move a slow fat Hero very close to the enemy and keep him protected/healed during the whole duration of the setup and the ult itself.

Winston: Primal Rage. Again involves a good bit of risk as it involves getting right up and personal, It can win a fight and take a point but involves a good bit of risk and can be neutralized rather easily if not used just right.

Zarya: Graviton Surge. Again you need to at least be in the thick of things to really use this. + it requires strong coordination or else it often does little.

Noticing the patterns here and how DVA's Self Destruct defies them? When you compare it to other ULTs of her Hero class Self Destruct is just as far different then Mercys old Valk was.

Volto! · Feb 8, 2018

No offense, but you’ve been playing the game for a few weeks right? You’re going to find yourself in the extreme minority regarding DVA ult. Get used to the maps more and you’ll find that hiding around the nearest corner once you hear the audio cue is very feasible. You can choose not to believe that at higher elo players don’t die much to her ult, but it’s absolutely true. Watch some streams. Watch OWL. That’s not to say that a well placed DVA ult can’t get kills, but it really is a balanced ability. Learn the maps, and don’t fly out above everyone while you valk unless you’re still near something you can use to LoS an enemy ult.

Her ult used to actually be too good. Her bomb exploded in maybe half the time it takes to activate now. You were fucked unless you just happened to find yourself already LoS’ing her. It’s *so* much better now.

Valderen · Feb 8, 2018

D'va is in need of a balance pass for sure, but her ultimate is fine. It rarely gets more than 1 or 2 kills. As mentioned at higher level it's mostly used for getting a new mech or just zoning people out...kills are almost a bonus.

As for the design of Moira. I think she was specifically designed to counter the dive meta which was/ dominating forever. She's not easily diveable, somewhat counters the 2 dive DPS in Genji and Tracer. She's also not a good healer for a dive comp., she's better for team comp. that stays grouped up.

I think it's why a lot of people thinks she's OP...she's not really OP, she just counters the most popular comp in the meta and people haven't started to play something other than dive.

Jeff mentioned that the next hero will change the meta too. I think this might be their philosophy going forward. Create heroes that counter the current meta, or synergize with other hero in a different way, creating new ways to approach the game.

Ravishing · Feb 8, 2018

Whidon said:
Lets compare DVA's ULT to other tank Ults.

Rein: Shatter. Well Balanced, can win a team fight but requires excellent placement and risk in your big slow hero getting into the correct spot.

Orisa: Supercharger. Again it's strong and can swing a fight, but the charger itself can easily be blown up and requires the player using Orisa to physically get to the correct spot to use it despite being a slow Hero with a big hitbox.

Roadhog: Wholehog. Can do great dmg and push heroes off ground you don't want them on. Another well balanced ULT as it requires you again to move a slow fat Hero very close to the enemy and keep him protected/healed during the whole duration of the setup and the ult itself.

Winston: Primal Rage. Again involves a good bit of risk as it involves getting right up and personal, It can win a fight and take a point but involves a good bit of risk and can be neutralized rather easily if not used just right.

Zarya: Graviton Surge. Again you need to at least be in the thick of things to really use this. + it requires strong coordination or else it often does little.

Noticing the patterns here and how DVA's Self Destruct defies them? When you compare it to other ULTs of her Hero class Self Destruct is just as far different then Mercys old Valk was.

Dude...

I was going to be harsher, but the poster above says you've only been playing a short time, so I'll give a pass.

But yea, don't even talk about DVA ult. It's the weakest most useless garbage ult in the game.

All it is good for is full-healing yourself.

Sure, sometimes you snag a lucky kill, but you never expect it.

Rein Shatter is the most buggy OP tank ult IMO. I'm not advocating a nerf, but his ult is ALWAYS game changing. But it's also buggy as hell. It can either completely MISS or it HITS where it shouldn't. It's so messy. But it's incredibly impactful and the counterplay is much more limited when compared to DVA.

Your explanations on all of those Tank hero ults is so flawed and misguided.

I'd like to see DVA lose the rockets tbh. Shit was stupid to add to her. Now she's this tank-assassin. I wouldn't mind seeing her ult buffed in some way, maybe allow a greater Z-axis distance, so if it's launched overhead it can still deal a lot of damage to heroes below.

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