Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

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Abefroman

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
12,594
11,937
I'd like to officially apologize to anyone who warned about Brad. I was all for this guy getting a second chance and hoped we'd get a solid game in return. you guys were right, he was underserving of my support.
You don't owe an apology. The annoying ones are the people that shouted people down here, calling them haters for warning them about Brad and then have the balls to lecture people that just happened to back him longer then them.
 

Adebisi

Clump of Cells
<Silver Donator>
27,713
32,825
Anyone who actually read your posts should be aware of your good intentions, sir Convo.
 

Eomer

Trakanon Raider
5,472
272
I'd like to officially apologize to anyone who warned about Brad. I was all for this guy getting a second chance and hoped we'd get a solid game in return. you guys were right, he was underserving of my support.
Shit happens. I think that people accusing Brad of outright scamming people, or plotting this all along, are going a bit far. The reality is, is that this whole situation is borne out of a combination of Brad's incompetence, sense of entitlement, and complete lack of self awareness. He didn't set out to scam anyone, whether that be the people "investing", or the developers on his team. He genuinely thought he could make a go of making a throwback MMOG with himself as the head of the development team. The reality of course is that he's incapable of leading/managing a large team (as he proved at least twice before, at SOE and then again at Sigil), and we ended up with that abortion of a Kickstarter. Ever confident in his abilities, he soldiered on with his own Pantheon web page to continue to raise funds. He probably genuinely thinks that he paid out the money to the various parties as fairly as possible, but it just so happens that it's only fair that he gets a far larger portion than anyone else because he's Brad Fucking McQuaid and this shit wouldn't have gotten as far had he not been involved. And in that respect, he's actually kind of correct, although that doesn't mean what he did was fair or equitable.

The guy is an idiot. He might be really smart in some respects and/or have a great imagination, but that doesn't preclude him from being an idiot at running a business. And he has no idea that he's an idiot. None. As we saw in some of his more recent interviews where he talked about Vanguard's failure, that failure was everyone's fault but his own, basically. He blew 20-30 million dollars of MS's money on a game that had to be slapped together in the last year before release by everyone but him, and yet that shit was MS's fault for not believing in him enough. It's both kind of sad, and hilarious at the same time.
 

Gecko_sl

shitlord
1,482
0
I'd like to officially apologize to anyone who warned about Brad. I was all for this guy getting a second chance and hoped we'd get a solid game in return. you guys were right, he was underserving of my support.
As one of the biggest anti-Pantheon people from day one, I'd say the others are right and you have no reason to apologize. I think you believed in the guy and put in more support work on this project than he did.

I have no idea if the failure is due to Brad being inept or just monumentally lazy. I doubt we'll ever know, really. The bigger question is will this be the last of Mr. Mcquaid or when his 100k runs out in a few months will there suddenly be a new Kickstarter?
 

Pasteton

Blackwing Lair Raider
2,741
1,935
Just curious if he were to off himself I wonder how many of you would feel guilty/bad versus how many would be thrilled.
 

Pasteton

Blackwing Lair Raider
2,741
1,935
I'm sure draegan would love the media attention "washed up developer commits suicide following online forum bullying"
 

zzeris

King Turd of Shit Hill
<Gold Donor>
20,314
86,212
Shit happens. I think that people accusing Brad of outright scamming people, or plotting this all along, are going a bit far. The reality is, is that this whole situation is borne out of a combination of Brad's incompetence, sense of entitlement, and complete lack of self awareness. He didn't set out to scam anyone, whether that be the people "investing", or the developers on his team. He genuinely thought he could make a go of making a throwback MMOG with himself as the head of the development team. The reality of course is that he's incapable of leading/managing a large team (as he proved at least twice before, at SOE and then again at Sigil), and we ended up with that abortion of a Kickstarter. Ever confident in his abilities, he soldiered on with his own Pantheon web page to continue to raise funds. He probably genuinely thinks that he paid out the money to the various parties as fairly as possible, but it just so happens that it's only fair that he gets a far larger portion than anyone else because he's Brad Fucking McQuaid and this shit wouldn't have gotten as far had he not been involved. And in that respect, he's actually kind of correct, although that doesn't mean what he did was fair or equitable.

The guy is an idiot. He might be really smart in some respects and/or have a great imagination, but that doesn't preclude him from being an idiot at running a business. And he has no idea that he's an idiot. None. As we saw in some of his more recent interviews where he talked about Vanguard's failure, that failure was everyone's fault but his own, basically. He blew 20-30 million dollars of MS's money on a game that had to be slapped together in the last year before release by everyone but him, and yet that shit was MS's fault for not believing in him enough. It's both kind of sad, and hilarious at the same time.
I completely disagree. That's similar to Donald Trump saying he's not sure how US business bankruptcy laws work. He's done it several times and knows how to benefit from lenient bankruptcy laws. He's worked the system.

Brad has done the same thing. Several people in the industry have mentioned how Brad really didn't do much with EQ. He hit gold and took credit. Eventually, SOE wanted someone who was actually going to do real work in his spot. Later, he tries to sit back and let others make him rich again. Hit the Pot O' Gold once again. Yes, his leadership helped sink that boat as did his lack of work ethic. But that's not the main point. When the going got rough, he DUPED SOE into taking over for him and jetting off into the sunset. He intentionally lied to SOE. He conned people who had worked with him before. Once again, later, Brad wants another crack at that Pot O' Gold! SOE isn't biting. Other publishers aren't biting. He has nothing to show! He has done nothing! What is he to do?!! He sees hard workers like Roberts, Jacobs, and even Spaceman Garriott trying their hands as crowd sourced funding. He's a gaming god! He'll make a game but the point of this endeavor is to sit around, ride his bike, and let others do the work, WHILE HE"S MAKING BANK!

He didn't care about a game. He didn't bust his ass making stuff while out of work. He didn't plan ahead, get something going early. He never did much of anything. The goal was never to make a game. It was to hit that Pot O' Gold again while others did the work. And if he had to dupe a couple thousand people to get that Pot O' Gold? He's done it to many others so why not these guys? He's got people to support. He didn't mean for it to go sideways. He made a few mistakes. It was that Salim's fault. Blah, blah, blah.

Brad wanted another easy source of money and he didn't care how he got it. The website still took donations after he knew development was over. The website was only really used to pay off some bills. He didn't care how it was going to get done...he was going to get some money off people. This was a scam. No MMO gets made with 800,000. No piddly website will get an MMO made. No sitting around for 9 months gets stuff done. This was a scam from day 1. He lost all his support in the industry to rob others while sitting on his ass. He just needed to scam one last group of people. His fans. And of course the latest batch of developers he puts together.
 

Tenks

Bronze Knight of the Realm
14,163
607
Just curious if he were to off himself I wonder how many of you would feel guilty/bad versus how many would be thrilled.
I doubt anyone would feel guilty or bad. I'm not even a Brad hater but if someone is in the mental state that they feel suicide is an option simply openly rejecting their idea shouldn't put the burden of the other person's psychological issues on your mind.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,768
617
I completely disagree. That's similar to Donald Trump saying he's not sure how US business bankruptcy laws work. He's done it several times and knows how to benefit from lenient bankruptcy laws. He's worked the system.

Brad has done the same thing. Several people in the industry have mentioned how Brad really didn't do much with EQ. He hit gold and took credit. Eventually, SOE wanted someone who was actually going to do real work in his spot. Later, he tries to sit back and let others make him rich again. Hit the Pot O' Gold once again. Yes, his leadership helped sink that boat as did his lack of work ethic. But that's not the main point. When the going got rough, he DUPED SOE into taking over for him and jetting off into the sunset. He intentionally lied to SOE. He conned people who had worked with him before. Once again, later, Brad wants another crack at that Pot O' Gold! SOE isn't biting. Other publishers aren't biting. He has nothing to show! He has done nothing! What is he to do?!! He sees hard workers like Roberts, Jacobs, and even Spaceman Garriott trying their hands as crowd sourced funding. He's a gaming god! He'll make a game but the point of this endeavor is to sit around, ride his bike, and let others do the work, WHILE HE"S MAKING BANK!

He didn't care about a game. He didn't bust his ass making stuff while out of work. He didn't plan ahead, get something going early. He never did much of anything. The goal was never to make a game. It was to hit that Pot O' Gold again while others did the work. And if he had to dupe a couple thousand people to get that Pot O' Gold? He's done it to many others so why not these guys? He's got people to support. He didn't mean for it to go sideways. He made a few mistakes. It was that Salim's fault. Blah, blah, blah.

Brad wanted another easy source of money and he didn't care how he got it. The website still took donations after he knew development was over. The website was only really used to pay off some bills. He didn't care how it was going to get done...he was going to get some money off people. This was a scam. No MMO gets made with 800,000. No piddly website will get an MMO made. No sitting around for 9 months gets stuff done. This was a scam from day 1. He lost all his support in the industry to rob others while sitting on his ass. He just needed to scam one last group of people. His fans. And of course the latest batch of developers he puts together.
Actually I completely agree with Eomer. I think he nailed it and would echo my thoughts had I posted. But I'l also second you with the lying part.

As for Brad and EQ. just say ask the people who were there. That's what I did. I was told EQ was very much Brad's idea and baby. So I wont discredit him those achievements. Of course luck played a factor but that's typically the case for a lot of peoples success.
 

Gecko_sl

shitlord
1,482
0
Just curious if he were to off himself I wonder how many of you would feel guilty/bad versus how many would be thrilled.
Two words for you, my friend: Personal responsibility.

Most of the community here would feel bad, but most of us do not know the guy. We just do not trust him and wouldn't give him our money for a project. That in no way makes most of us less apathetic, but you are talking money versus empathy.

If a business fires a meth addict who commits suicide, do you blame the business? This is one shade further: if a community does not donate money to a guy, are we responsible for him? C'mon, man. It's tough to feel bad for a well off game developer, when most of this board lives paycheck to paycheck.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,768
617
Two words for you, my friend: Personal responsibility.

Most of the community here would feel bad, but most of us do not know the guy. We just do not trust him and wouldn't give him our money for a project. That in no way makes most of us less apathetic, but you are talking money versus empathy.

If a business fires a meth addict who commits suicide, do you blame the business? This is one shade further: if a community does not donate money to a guy, are we responsible for him? C'mon, man. It's tough to feel bad for a well off game developer, when most of this board lives paycheck to paycheck.
Yea, i'm not looking for anything thing like that. On a personal note, I know he is/was dealing with some RL issues during all of this. Possibly a serious illness with a family member. Details are a bit sketchy atm and it's on him if he wants to put that out there.. but it might be a reason why he looked run down in some videos. Just a hint, chill with the wife comments. Let's keep this on target. It doesn't excuse the other shit that transpired.
 

zzeris

King Turd of Shit Hill
<Gold Donor>
20,314
86,212
Convo,

Normally I'd agree with Eomer as well but he's done nothing at all. Seriously, how could he possibly see this turning out well? There was no planning, no creative property, no effort applied. This isn't some magical fairyland where wishing on a star makes games. He's been a part of the industry for how long? Yet, that part eludes him? I just can't believe it.

EQ was Brad's baby. And he did more work with it than anything else. I just don't think he did a lot of the work. And that's what got the game made. Not copied ideas from your favorite game. He copied a game, put it into 3d and then had the real workers get it into playing form. I don't give him a lot of credit because other guys from that time are still making games. They still have a passion, they still make mistakes but they ALL have put out the work to get their visions made. What did Brad do to get his made?
 

Gaige

Legal Ephebophile
1,912
116
I know he is/was dealing with some RL issues during all of this. Possibly a serious illness with a family member. Details are a bit sketchy atm and it's on him if he wants to put that out there.. but it might be a reason why he looked run down in some videos. Just a hint, chill with the wife comments. Let's keep this on target.
Fuck that. Brad doesn't get anymore passes. The dude drugged his way through Vanguard now it's okay that he basically stole from people and fucked over yet another team of devs relying on him because of a mystery illness his wife is suffering from? It's probably just as likely that Brad was stoned off his gourd in those videos off the money donated.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,768
617
Fuck that. Brad doesn't get anymore passes. The dude drugged his way through Vanguard now it's okay that he basically stole from people and fucked over yet another team of devs relying on him because of a mystery illness his wife is suffering from? It's probably just as likely that Brad was stoned off his gourd in those videos off the money donated.
no, I'm not giving him a pass. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. There were some wife comments that came up. Just saying let's keep this on target and keep her out of it.
 

El Santo_sl

shitlord
10
0
I'd like to officially apologize to anyone who warned about Brad. I was all for this guy getting a second chance and hoped we'd get a solid game in return. you guys were right, he was underserving of my support.
You've been one of the most level voices in the conversation on this, and as a person who lost money in the deal. You have more right than the bystanders to be yelling invective about the state of this shit. If anything, more people shoudl take a page from your playbook, Convo.

Would that there were +internets, sir. You would have many of them.
 

Ambiturner

Ssraeszha Raider
16,043
19,530
I'm sure draegan would love the media attention "washed up developer commits suicide following online forum bullying"
Yes, a middle aged loser killing himself would be front page news all over the US. Barbara Walters and Oprah would be fighting over the interview and Nancy Grace would talk about it non-stop.

If you're not a cute white chick, nobody gives a shit.
 

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
no, I'm not giving him a pass. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying. There were some wife comments that came up. Just saying let's keep this on target and keep her out of it.
I can only speak for myself, but I think a lot of the frustration with that statement is, once again,poor Brad."He wasn't involved with the project because (insert lame excuse number 91)". He did the same shit with Vanguard. Just up and fucking disappears while everyone else is left holding the bag. So true or not, he reappears and floats this rumor about a family members illness. I just can't believe anything he says anymore. The dude has an excuse for everything. He originally said he was gone "trying to acquire investors", which is the same crap he told us during Vanguard, now this rumor about health issues.....STFU (not you Convo, Brad). Hes off playing with other peoples money. PERIOD, and for that there is no excuse.
 

Kirun

Buzzfeed Editor
19,240
15,629
Convo,

Normally I'd agree with Eomer as well but he's done nothing at all. Seriously, how could he possibly see this turning out well? There was no planning, no creative property, no effort applied. This isn't some magical fairyland where wishing on a star makes games. He's been a part of the industry for how long? Yet, that part eludes him? I just can't believe it.

EQ was Brad's baby. And he did more work with it than anything else. I just don't think he did a lot of the work. And that's what got the game made. Not copied ideas from your favorite game. He copied a game, put it into 3d and then had the real workers get it into playing form. I don't give him a lot of credit because other guys from that time are still making games. They still have a passion, they still make mistakes but they ALL have put out the work to get their visions made. What did Brad do to get his made?
Nailed it.

Did Brad have nothing but ill intent when coming into the project? Was it nothing more than a malicious plot? Probably not. However, he sought to make as much money as possible, as quickly as possibly, while simultaneously doing as little work as possible. I refuse to believe that a guy with 15+ years of industry experience is genuinely that "inept". Brad knowsexactlywhat he's doing.