Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

  • Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!



    Go here and give us your nominations!
    Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!

Laura

Lord Nagafen Raider
582
109
Compared to a very small number if MMO publishers, Sigil was mediocore at best, you mean?

If big publishers like SOE and Blizzard failed to deliver their years-under-development MMOs, I find it amazing how Sigil managed to deliver their ambitious project.
In essence there's no shame in delivering a buggy MMO when big publishers failed to launch theirs.
 

Hateyou

Not Great, Not Terrible
<Bronze Donator>
16,652
43,325
So you're saying "Other companies sucked worse!" is a viable excuse. You guys are nuts.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user

Reht

Molten Core Raider
1,115
317
Sigil failed to deliver, without SOE or some other company buying the game, it never would have been released. Got to love revisionist history.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user

goishen

Macho Ma'am
3,620
14,726
Holy hell. 25 mil is the figure that MS gave? lol The entire team left after Brad got caught with his hands in other people pockets? lmao Good god. Yah, fire them all in fucking parking lot Brad. Use that 25 mil for snorting oxycodone. Play Hero Clix in your office some more as some more of your co-workers bang. Holy hell, enough bad shit can't happen to this man.
 

tyen

EQ in a browser wait time: ____
<Banned>
4,638
5,164
What investor in their right mind would give Brad money when Sigil Games took a fuckton (what, 25 mil) of Microsoft cash and lit it on fire back in the Vanguard era. Investors don't forget that shit, and it's not like kickstarter shenanigans have done anything to convince them otherwise.

Dude, there are retarded amounts of investors. They don't have shared portfolios of people that they can just look up whatever fucked up shit they did to another investor.

There really is no "vetting" software that investors can use to pinpoint an individual's historic failures in a reasonable amount of time.

Before you start thinking, "Can they not use Google? wtf?" You gotta realize, the skills of sleuthing through the internet to either solve a problem or gain information is pretty poor amongst the average worker bee plebe.

Lying is totally cool now. It doesn't ruin your chances to become president ~
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users

Arden

Blackwing Lair Raider
2,732
2,055
Sigil failed to deliver, without SOE or some other company buying the game, it never would have been released. Got to love revisionist history.

Vanguard was released prior to SOE's acquisition. Since you're not a fan of revisionist history, you probably want to get it right.
 
  • 1Solidarity
Reactions: 1 user

Reht

Molten Core Raider
1,115
317
Vanguard was released prior to SOE's acquisition. Since you're not a fan of revisionist history, you probably want to get it right.
I stand corrected, SOE took over marketing, publication, distribution, sub services and maintenance of servers in May of 2006 but acquired all the assets five months after launch.
 

Arden

Blackwing Lair Raider
2,732
2,055
I stand corrected, SOE took over marketing, publication, distribution, sub services and maintenance of servers in May of 2006 but bought the assets five months after launch.

SOE was handling some marketing stuff for months prior to release and then after release, correct. They also handled publishing and payment upon release. Then, a little after release, they began to field some of the customer support stuff (but not all of it). Eventually, they purchased the IP.

SOE (or certain employees of SOE) helped in other, more discreet ways too-- well before release.

SOE was the crutch Sigil used to lean on in order to walk VG out the door to release.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
1,678
149
What investor in their right mind would give Brad money when Sigil Games took a fuckton (what, 25 mil) of Microsoft cash and lit it on fire back in the Vanguard era. Investors don't forget that shit, and it's not like kickstarter shenanigans have done anything to convince them otherwise.
Vanguard was awesome. And 25 million is a pittance compared to what most MMOs of the time got. The reason that game failed so hard is because MS bailed. They don't care about 25 million, it is nothing to them, that's why they just walked away from it because they found something else to do. If MS didn't renege Vanguard would have been a success for sure. It would have been Black Desert, ArcheAge, TESO, etc.. only 10 years earlier, and better.

The fact that some people are dumb enough to still believe in this mess is crazy to me. (I'm looking at you QWERTY!)
But there is no mess... We've only seen bits of the game and it looks promising, and they are still plugging away. Get something better to whine about.

Sigil failed to deliver, without SOE or some other company buying the game, it never would have been released. Got to love revisionist history.
You could say that about any game... If a publisher or private funding didn't 'buy the game' every game ever would have failed to deliver. Very few companies make a big game all by themselves. It relies on outside funding. Sigil did a decent job at making the game, but the management did a crappy job at securing funding. And selling to SOE was a desperate move and a shame that SOE was too broke to put in the money the game needed to finish it off. They had a tiny budget for that compared to other games at the time. If Sigil had the budget something like Rift got, they would have developed the game another several months and released a really great game that could have grown huge.
 

Hateyou

Not Great, Not Terrible
<Bronze Donator>
16,652
43,325
I doubt it would have been a success even if MS stayed on board. The code is such a fucking mess that when the game was actually good a year+ after release it still ran like shit. No one would have stuck around even it would have released at it's best state.
 

etchazz

Trakanon Raider
2,707
1,056
I doubt it would have been a success even if MS stayed on board. The code is such a fucking mess that when the game was actually good a year+ after release it still ran like shit. No one would have stuck around even it would have released at it's best state.

Dude, just give up. Arguing with Qwerty is like arguing with Terri Schiavo.
 
  • 4Like
Reactions: 3 users

BoozeCube

The Wokest
<Prior Amod>
51,539
302,561
Yeah the success/fail ratio MMO's overall is like what 1/20 if that.. I am sure people are falling over their dicks to hand Brad bundles of cash. Trying to say Vanguard was a success because you enjoyed playing some piss poor coded bag of shit game isn't the metric anyone is going to judge by.

Did it turn a profit? Seeing as that shit had its servers shut down would lead one to believe it did not. I.E. A Fucking Failure

So how long exactly until "it's gonna rock" happens?

latest?cb=20151204065950
 
1,678
149
I doubt it would have been a success even if MS stayed on board. The code is such a fucking mess that when the game was actually good a year+ after release it still ran like shit. No one would have stuck around even it would have released at it's best state.
No it was good a year after release. They fixed everything except chunking which never took more than 5 seconds even without an SSD. And this was all done by SOE's team of 3 interns. If they had the original team of hundreds of people working another several months, the game would have been great at release. And it was built to grow as well with ideas for the first expansion, a soft level cap of 200. They had player controlled ships and oceans everywhere, it just needed mobs adding to them, etc. All this could have come after a successful release.

Dude, just give up. Arguing with Qwerty is like realizing you are a whiner with no life and nothing to do and you don't know what you are talking about.
 

Laura

Lord Nagafen Raider
582
109
Yeah the success/fail ratio MMO's overall is like what 1/20 if that.. I am sure people are falling over their dicks to hand Brad bundles of cash. Trying to say Vanguard was a success because you enjoyed playing some piss poor coded bag of shit game isn't the metric anyone is going to judge by.

Did it turn a profit? Seeing as that shit had its servers shut down would lead one to believe it did not. I.E. A Fucking Failure

So how long exactly until "it's gonna rock" happens?

View attachment 100198

If I was an investor I would never fund Brad's project. But people here don't like to hear an opposite argument, when you say the whole MMO scheme is shit people suggest that you're saying something else. I am not, it's how things are. Many big companies failed to deliver, it doesn't make them shit and it doens't make Brad's great. The focus shouldn't be "Vanguard was horrible, no one should support Brad." that argument is retarded. The real argument is simply watch Pantheon's failed kickstarter and that alone would warrant any person with their right mind not to fund this game. Because it's crystal clear the team behind it (at least then) was incompetent.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
1,678
149
If I was an investor I would never fund Brad's project. But people here don't like to hear an opposite argument, when you say the whole MMO scheme is shit people suggest that you're saying something else. I am not, it's how things are. Many big companies failed to deliver, it doesn't make them shit and it doens't make Brad's great. The focus shouldn't be "Vanguard was horrible, no one should support Brad." that argument is retarded. The real argument is simply watch Pantheon's failed kickstarter and that alone would warrant any person with their right mind not to fund this game. Because it's crystal clear the team behind it (at least then) was incompetent.
I agree with all that but they have done everything right since then. The Kickstarter just seemed rushed by over excited people who had good internal plans but didn't have anything to show the public. But since then he has set up the company properly with a whole management team so Brad can focus on the game itself. In other words, I don't think they are incompetent anymore. They may be, but I doubt it. We wont know until the December video.
 

Jysin

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
6,457
4,345
... The real argument is simply watch Pantheon's failed kickstarter and that alone would warrant any person with their right mind not to fund this game. Because it's crystal clear the team behind it (at least then) was incompetent.

The kicker is (pun intended), this forum immediately warned Brad that the KS page needed to be worked on. Hell, I think Draegan even offered to clean it up. This forum gave Brad a ton of great suggestions while he was active in the thread. What was Brad's response? "We are not Kickstarter experts, we just make games!"

*facepalm*
 
  • 1Solidarity
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 users

Furious

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
2,948
5,032
If they cared about Kickstarter they could have done it again and would have easily got a good amount with what they have to show now.
They do care about Kickstarter but they have 0 credibility with the gaming community. This is why they are trying to put in some show work to get some VC.

Pretty simple homie.

Problem is it still looks bad.

VC will stay away, despite what you and 2 others here think.

I hope the Dec build looks a lot better because I do want a game like EQ to come out again in my life time but a HIGHLY, HIGHLY suspect that Brad and crew will not be the team to make it (Unless they hire Salty)
 
  • 2Like
Reactions: 1 users

Mur

Trakanon Raider
845
2,009
I hope the Dec build looks a lot better because I do want a game like EQ to come out again in my life time but a HIGHLY, HIGHLY suspect that Brad and crew will not be the team to make it (Unless they hire Salty)

Agree. I think our last hope is that Daybreak has secretly let the guys who were developing the version of EQ3 prior to Next re-start their project. Maybe we'll get a tour of the "black box" soon™.