Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

  • Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!



    Go here and give us your nominations!
    Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
595
Tad, you're in Ut territory with that statement.
That stings
frown.png


I'll agree that Hartsman can get stuff completed - I just though Rift was bland on bland on bland. I mean Two factions really? Quest hub's with horrible multi-quests? Thing is, I really wanted to like that game.

Anyway, work calls...
 

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,525
12,565
Anyway, work calls...
I'll take a number 2 supersized with a coke.

(Sorry)

I don't think it's a big deal if anyone running this site wants to attract hits by asking others to post here. There is a thread for that though so I can elaborate there. This thing probably won't even reach 800k and none of this will matter anyway.
 

popsicledeath

Potato del Grande
7,547
11,831
Sure, probably not everyone is saying the game should be exactly like Everquest and not fix any of these issues. But it sure as hell seems that way at a glance.
If you don't believe they can 'fix' some of these issues in their design, that's one thing. But saying it's going to be like anything is a bit misleading. I'm following the project closely and I wouldn't feel comfortable saying it 'seems' like it's going to be one way or the other. Not enough info?
 

shabushabu

Molten Core Raider
1,408
185
Actually Hartsman was in charge of a complete redesign of Rift. It was a disaster pre-Hartsman and a lot of the assets you don't like were already in place. From what I've heard, he did an amazing job turning the game around in the space of a single year. Kudos to him.

Tad, you're in Ut territory with that statement.
Why people give credit to Hartsman for Rift is beyond my comprehension. Talk about a mediocre piece of junk of a game ( RIFT ) that could have been so much more. If your goals are shoot for the WoW experience with little to no innovation and give them maybe 1/4 the experience of WoW, hats off to Hartsman !!! woohoo thats one hell of a success right there.
 

Quaid

Trump's Staff
11,782
8,267
There have been plenty of non-established studios with veterans working on triple A games. So basically vanguard wasn't a AAA game because Sigil wasn't established? An 8 million dollar budge goal comprised of veterans shouldn't not be considered AAA because the name of the company is new should it? Maybe I'm reading you wrong.
Hold up... are we really arguing that VR is a AAA studio? Aren't they developing Pantheon part-time out of a garage for no salary?

@Kreugen: The people advocating for fully contested raid spawns are out to lunch and probably haven't raided in an uninstanced environment since 2003. It's not even worth a discussion, and Brad wouldn't be retarded enough to include spawn racing as a 'feature'.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,767
617
I'll take a number 2 supersized with a coke.

(Sorry)
lol!

I didn't really care for Rift long term or some of Hartsman's philosophy in his blog(maybe some of it has changed) but man that team was good. Too bad some of them lost their jobs b/c they did have the best release that Ive been a part of.
 

Draegan_sl

2 Minutes Hate
10,034
3
Do you think any of those people throwing money at it will accept being on the losing side of such a race? Because the majority of them will be.

At least we'll all get a good laugh out of it.
No they won't accept it. If this game actually launches they will have their paradise. If it fails, then it will be used as a counter aruegment in future threads. I'm willing to donate the $45.00 to see if the experiment work. This whole project is a fantastic social experiment that's well worth the observational value.

Shit, the game might actually be fun. Win win from my perspective.
 

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,525
12,565
Why people give credit to Hartsman for Rift is beyond my comprehension. Talk about a mediocre piece of junk of a game ( RIFT ) that could have been so much more. If your goals are shoot for the WoW experience with little to no innovation and give them maybe 1/4 the experience of WoW, hats off to Hartsman !!! woohoo thats one hell of a success right there.
I give him credit for more of turning a complete waste of a game, EQ2, into a better experience ten fold due to his work on the EoF expansion. But that's just me.
 

Fubarbox_sl

shitlord
84
0
That's a really cool idea, but I'm bettin' it would cost more than just $100. $165-$175 would sound about right, and if it were me, it would be limited to maybe half the current Knight's Pledge level.
More than $100 I agree. Mainly because of what it is now. But $165 plus for a pet, tunic, and horse for the second copy of the game is a little much. I would agree with that cost if alpha and a free month were included though. But just for the couple of cosmetic items I would be willing to go up to $115-$125. With so many couples who play MMORPGs, it could make that higher tier much more appealing to the masses. Which would net VR double the money for minimal work (since those cosmetic items are already being made for everyone else). My only other choice is to make a second account and back at $45 (KS experience tells me those spots will open heh) which gets me the same stuff for $90. Granted no horse, but 1 month free and alpha access.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,767
617
Hold up... are we really arguing that VR is a AAA studio? Aren't they developing Pantheon part-time out of a garage for no salary?

@Kreugen: The people advocating for fully contested raid spawns are out to lunch and probably haven't raided in an uninstanced environment since 2003. It's not even worth a discussion, and Brad wouldn't be retarded enough to include spawn racing as a 'feature'.
That's the thing tho.. nobody is really arguing it.. Tad just made a counter.. He's not a raider. He's was just putting some balance into the assumption Kreugen is making.. Which isn't fair b/c there is no real info to go off.
 

Draegan_sl

2 Minutes Hate
10,034
3
There have been plenty of non-established studios with veterans working on triple A games. So basically vanguard wasn't a AAA game because Sigil wasn't established? An 8 million dollar budge goal comprised of veterans shouldn't not be considered AAA because the name of the company is new should it? Maybe I'm reading you wrong.
I don't see your point? Sigil was backed by MS. Currently Brad company is backed by $125 donations from fanboys.
 

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,525
12,565
I don't see your point? Sigil was backed by MS. Currently Brad company is backed by $125 donations from fanboys.
I'll agree with you if it's a self published title. I don't see that happening.
 

Draegan_sl

2 Minutes Hate
10,034
3
Why people give credit to Hartsman for Rift is beyond my comprehension. Talk about a mediocre piece of junk of a game ( RIFT ) that could have been so much more. If your goals are shoot for the WoW experience with little to no innovation and give them maybe 1/4 the experience of WoW, hats off to Hartsman !!! woohoo thats one hell of a success right there.
I'm sure his number one goal was to take a game from shit to profitable in a single year. That's really, really hard to do, and he was very successful at that. There is a reason why Trion asked him back after he quit. You don't have to like the game, and there is plenty of shit to say about the game (there was a lot wrong with how the game became developed), but from a business point of view, he wins and you look like an idiot.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
47,358
80,737
If Pantheon gets 800k funding and works with just that it probably won't be considered a AAA game. If they attract more funding and get 7million from various sources then yeah, it's reasonable to expect a AAA game. Not sure where the disagreement is here.


Re: Instanced vs non-instanced raiding. I'll reiterate my opinion that most raids should be instanced and almost all grouping should be noninstanced. And non-instanced raid mobs should be on set, known timers.
 

Anomander Rake

Golden Knight of the Realm
704
14
One one hand I think this censorship is averyslippery slope that this forum is headed towards. It is starting to feel like if you don't just complain or argue once about an issue with this KS (to counter any one of the feverish zealots hyping this "game"over and over and overagain), then you run the risk of having your arguments neatly sanitized into a rickshaw thread that 98% of non RR people will never look into. There is an ignore feature on this forum, and people can use it.

I think that someone can be a fanboy for Brad and Co., and for Pantheon, without the over the top, absolute evangelical praise for everything and anything he does. Frankly all of those posts should go into their own rickshaw thread.

On the other hand, this isn't a democracy, and I don't directly pay for the upkeep of this site. So what I think doesn't mean shit.
 

popsicledeath

Potato del Grande
7,547
11,831
To be fair dude, we really should wait for details of how they go about it. popsiciedeath made a pretty good post on how they could handle it. You're just assuming it will be that way.. Was VG even that way? I didn't raid in VG..
Vanguard was full of compromises that ended up not necessary due to the population, but were a good start. You had 'open' dungeons, that had multiple versions. You had overland, contested raid content that was on lockout timers so if your guild killed it, they couldn't for a week, giving other people the chance to compete for it. So, there was always competition, just not to the point you could really, severely, absolutely cock block another guild if you were assholes. There was no reason to be an asshole, and yeah the population was better than most because it was so small, but you'd literally have guilds letting other guilds 'try' a raid target before they engaged the same target that was farm status for them. I think a lot of it was a smaller population, but also the cooperative competition sort of feeling. You didn't absolutely HATE the other guilds like you did in early EQ, who when they got to a target before you pretty much ruined your entire day, and sometimes your entire week. Or where you'd have a schedule, and some guild would say fuck it and go rogue and completely ruin and piss off everyone on the schedule.

When you didn't get to a mob in Vanguard it was like 'that sucks, but that's okay.' Whereas in EQ a lot of competing guilds had a seething hatred for each other (at least in my experience) to the point if you saw a guild massing for a raid or something popped, you'd rush to it even knowing you didn't have the numbers just to get there first and cockblock them.

And it worked well for the dick swingers in Vanguard too, because when the best raiding guild let you have a target, you knew they were better and letting you. Generosity was a part of epeening? I dunno, it was weird due to lower populations, but Pantheon will probably have lower pops too.

Other can probably go in more depth who raided more. There are plenty of ways to compromise. My problem is current games being design don't compromise. Compromise is bad. It's just all the way swung over to everyone gets everything at all times, which I don't like.

Cooperative competition. New buzz word?