Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

"old school" EQ on Sullon Zek and "old school" UO on Siege Perilous are tied, with a slight edge going to EQ.

Fish1_sl said:

insane amounts of time to do anything.

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Taking a year to finish a character is a good thing in my book.

Separated PvP and PvE servers are a good thing too.

Nirgon_sl said:

Taking a year to finish a character is a good thing in my book.

Separated PvP and PvE servers are a good thing too.

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This.

Nirgon_sl said:

Taking a year to finish a character is a good thing in my book.

Separated PvP and PvE servers are a good thing too.

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Agreed on both counts. For me ideally you wouldnt ever "finish" a character. The game should have some kind of diminishing returns AA for stuff to advance your character even while you help some strangers complete a quest or dungeon. If your character is only advanced by top-tier loot, doing the other stuff feels entirely pointless, while with some kind of AA system you might go "hell why not, xp is xp" when someone asks you to run a dungeon you dont really need anymore.

Dahkoht_sl said:

Quote Originally Posted by Nirgon
Taking a year to finish a character is a good thing in my book.

Separated PvP and PvE servers are a good thing too.

This.

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Yes and Yes... i would also add no PVP minigame ( no arena or BGs, let all pvp be about resources in the world and control of those i.e. raid mobs, other contested mobs etc ).

Sithro_sl said:

I think more variation and options are better tbh. There shouldn't really be one "best in slot" item, there should be multiple depending on the situation. I think elemental resists should be brought back. Having people make different sets for different situations is always cool, and gives them something else to do other then just try to attain that "one" best item.

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Yes.

There's a lot that could be done in MMOs, to be honest. Why can't I go to a pub in the game world, and play a round of chess, or poker, or something, with another player? Just me and a few people sitting around playing other games while we don't feel like grouping or doing quests. You can even add prizes and what not, Grandmaster title for the highest ranked Chess player in game? That would be cool as hell.

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No. No world destruction. No playable Go. No ability to swap fifty different classes. The problem with games since VG is that people have gone so far off the reservation with what they're trying to deliver. VG was buggy as shit but at least it was trying to deliver an MMORPG. I don't hate the idea of being able to play Checkers or Chess but it's unlikely Brad can deliver an MMORPG as-is, don't go filling his heads with ideas like linking Bradquest to GnuGo.

But, but, but, being able to play card/board games in a tavern is as important to immersion as being able to open every door you see! And sitting!

shabushabu_sl said:

Yes and Yes... i would also add no PVP minigame ( no arena or BGs, let all pvp be about resources in the world and control of those i.e. raid mobs, other contested mobs etc ).

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Blee-dat! I'm so sick of so-called pvp in every game these days. It's no more pvp than calling your local Taebo class a world class kickboxing tourney.

I wish more developers would realize good pvp is heavily dependent on good pve. It gives people something to fight over more than pointless epeen points on a leader-board. You know what a real leader-board is? Kicking your enemies ass so hard they log for the night without gaining any exp. And the beauty of a good pvp environment is it doesn't require a constant zerg or hourly fighting to matter. Got an awesome raid drop? That's essentially pvp. Found a hidden place to exp for the night? That's essentially pvp. In a game with good pve, everything you do is essentially pvp, because it allows you to gain strength or survivability.

There's nothing more beautiful in a mmorpg than your raid force trying to down a mob as your security force fights off a bunch of the enemy come to take their share or ruin your night.

Whether a developer has the balls to even have a few servers like this, though, remains to be seen.

Mr Creed_sl said:

Agreed on both counts. For me ideally you wouldnt ever "finish" a character. The game should have some kind of diminishing returns AA for stuff to advance your character even while you help some strangers complete a quest or dungeon. If your character is only advanced by top-tier loot, doing the other stuff feels entirely pointless, while with some kind of AA system you might go "hell why not, xp is xp" when someone asks you to run a dungeon you dont really need anymore.

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bingo.

i know a lot of people love alts, but some don't. I create one character and stick with that one character until i'm done playing the game, which means that i need a way to keep advancing my one character over the long haul be it through an AA system or whatever. To this day i think EQ had the best model for character advancement: looooong exp. curve (and when you leveled...it actually meant something) and AAs to keep you advancing past the level cap (and even below the cap) etc. I need a game where it takes well over a year to get to max level...otherwise it's not really worth playing.

(and this is coming from a guy who is lucky if i have a couple hours in a week to play. i'm as far from hard core as you can possibly get in terms of available play time)

Nirgon_sl said:

Taking a year to finish a character is a good thing in my book.

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I'm down with the long time thing, but for me they just have to be a be careful with it or it goes too far. Like I loved the 1-50 in original old world EQ, that took me about a year to reach 50 and got involved in the Naggy/Vox/early planes stuff. But the progress wasn't really THAT slow. It took a year but it was 50 whole levels in that time, and every 4 levels you got a whole new bunch of spells that were really big upgrades, and with so many zones, you could go to a whole new dungeon or zone every 4 levels or so and still not do everything.

But then I enjoyed the 50-60 in kunark a lot less. It seemed like I got half the content to do in the same amount of time. And 60-65 more or less finished me off. The AA grind too, I wasn't interested in that. Planes of Power is when I quit EQ for good because I was basically stuck in 1 or 2 zones the entire time. And even after 10 years, going back to EQ Mac felt the same way. 1-50 was super fun, loved every minute of it, got to go to all my favourite zones and loved the progression. But then at 50 it's like hitting a brick wall and I lost interest right away. I would spend an entire evening in Plane of Justice killing stuff and leave with about 4 blue bubbles of exp. You would need 5 blue bubbles to get 1 yellow bubble and 5 yellow bubbles to get a single level. Fuck dat.

But that's the insanity of the MMO world. You have 1 game that busts your balls like that, and then 1000 games that give you an entire level every 20 minutes and you complete the entire game in a month. Such a strange genre of game.

POP was fucking awsome. I loved it. Man it felt fucking awsome to get flagged and move on to the next level of progression and the raids.....shit the raids were a fucking blast. Backflagging can suck a dick but for me, POP was as good as it got. There was an actual coherent story line, the progression was smooth, every raid was fun and followed the story line, the zones were a blast, the gear was great....I loved it.

I joined <Vintage> during my stay in EQMac. I hated Luclin and PoP gear, it also brought the shitty character models. Luclin and PoP are too out there for me. In fact, I quit and sold my guy right before PoP. The word on the street was that planes of power was a great expansion compared to Luclin. It is also around the time that the RMT character auctions crash dived.

Yeah, some people loved PoP, others not. I hoped to experience all of the PoP raid progression in EQ Mac I had just got to 51 and was working my way through PoN and PoJ for exp. I intended to join a guild at 65 and try to do all the raid content I could get in on. But... RIP EQ Mac

But my issue with PoP the first time around is that I just never really liked raiding all that much and PoP was so raid focused. The little guild I was in was also not good enough to do any of the trials or flags or even older raid content, so they all fell apart joining when people started bailing and joining the big raid guilds. Game got lonely pretty fast. I ended up quitting and then starting on an EQ Emu which ironically turned out to be mostly focused on raiding, but I really enjoyed it. But I didn't stay long, the guilds all had 4 nights a week as a requirement and it got too much for me. For me the perfect era of EQ was EQ Mac, because you had all the content up to PoP, and if you wanted to be involved in PoP you at least had forever to do it because it was locked. Again... RIP EQ Mac :/

I personally like the long "journey". I enjoyed leveling my Wizard up. I think part of it was because as I leveled and gained abilities/gear I also gained the ability to kill things in a different way. Quading for instance. The game should offer those pivotal points(for me anyway) in your progression.

Convo_sl said:

I personally like the long "journey". I enjoyed leveling my Wizard up. I think part of it was because as I leveled and gained abilities/gear I also gained the ability to kill things in a different way. Quading for instance. The game should offer those pivotal points(for me anyway) in your progression.

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I give it major bonus points if it does that! Most games don't seem to change much. EQ was cool because the early days with my necro was all about sharing tanking duty with your pet and trying to lifetap to keep yourself alive. Then you get snare and fear and fear kiting becomes a possibility. But then at higher levels you could charm and root/dot which worked well, especially in dungeons.

Didn't Elidroth mention to watch Kickstarter and that something would come up in like four weeks, four weeks ago? Keep your eyes peeled gentlemen.

Big Flex_sl said:

Didn't Elidroth mention to watch Kickstarter and that something would come up in like four weeks, four weeks ago? Keep your eyes peeled gentlemen.

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Four weeks ago using Verant/SOE/Sigil "soon" (tm) time frames.