Planetside 2

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Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,277
2,301
If you are out in the open, you deserve to get locked on.

So easy to just LoS lock on and of course if you are that worried get smoke.

Not to mention they do far less damage then regular dumb fire Missiles.

Trollface_sl said:
how does platoon thing work? do we need to manually request reinvite every time we log out?
If you log out, it removes you. Can always join through squad/platoon screen and iirc you can put a platoon to outfit only.
 

Regime

LOADING, PLEASE WAIT...
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
16,860
40,075
We are TR!!!!!
I think 1 guy is vanu on Jaeger while the rest is in ARGO FoH TR. Just having fun with the TR bros on Jaeger while we slowly are turning into a nice little unit. When I feel like I want to play with/against the best outfits in PS I login to Matherson and play with my NC outfit (as do some of the Azure/ST/SG/TE guys with alts on Jaegar do) and engage in large scale ops that last from early afternoon until early morning. I like playing both ways and lately just relaxing and having a blast with the laid back dudes from rerolled.
 

Ninen

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
2,261
7,961
FYI it takes about 5 seconds for an invisible burster MAX to kill an ESF, they do around 15-20% health per second damage to you....
I fully admit that there's definitely some bad-player/pubby logic in there on my side. But both of us suffer from a bit of time dilation on the subject. 5 second TTK (using your numbers) is quite long in this game. And the "eternity" it takes for pods to do their work is really only 1-2 seconds of hits. Sure, there's travel delay. But you, the firer, is the only one that sees that. Target does not. For the target, the world erupts and they die. Note: there's time delay for the burster too, since flak shells fly so damn slow. But unlike inbound rockets, you CAN afterburner in any of 4 directions out of the pain, while splash damage dooms the infantry pretty regardless of where they try to move.

Bringing real world into this is a bad move. While explosives certainly are more effective, they would also be quite more expensive to fire. Every noob and their brother burning full ammo loadouts of rockets and cannon shots on infantry spawn choke points would bankrupt all 3 sides in very short order :p

Your thoughts on balance through exp have merit and reach much the same end goal. Disparities in TTK still leave the guys on AA duty fucked, but...
 

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
11,217
2,364
It's nowhere close to 5secs, that's a gross exageration from someone who probably pilots ESF a lot and never used a dual burster. It might take 5secs if there's 5 dual burster MAXes sure, but solo it takes way longer. I went and spawned a Mosquito with no upgrade and then shot at it with Dual Burster, side shots(assume like tanks side is more armor than back but less than front so it's good for average dmg value), 100%accuracy obviously. It takes 24seconds to blow up the ESF, 2magazines and a bit more(but it's burning so you could just let it explode anyway).

Now might be that it does less dmg on friendlies as I believe it used to take less than 2 magazines to blow one up but could be from random other people's dmg. Still you don't kill them in one magazine and each magazine takes 10secs to empty then reload. Even assuming you get full back hits, you'd still need at least more than 10secs to destroy an ESF, not factoring flak armor and more importantly not factoring the fact you can't have 100%accuracy unless the ESF is being a really dumbfuck and doing stationary bombing for 10secs while you're firing at him. Also unlike tanks, you can't flank ESF, getting back shots is purely random and mostly happen when the ESF flies away so you can't finish him.

Unless the ESF is flying direct trajectories, your accuracy goes down dramatically because of the travel time of flak. Literally all you have to do is zigzag and flak can't really hit you reliably because you have to compensate a lot when firing at an ESF so if he's not going the same direction for more than 2secs you're not hitting(maybe on the turns a few shots here and there). If you fly straight though it's fairly easy to land almost 100% accuracy(first few shots to adjust and then everything will land until the ESF turns).

Yes the render issues suck dicks and yes a bunch of AA MAXes will force any ESF to get the fuck out before they can even fire especially if they use a direct approach, but the whole 5secs kill? Pure bullshit. You will kill an AA MAX 1vs1 with stationary rocket spam before you even lose half your health.
 

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,277
2,301
Yeah not sure what bursters he's fighting. The ones I use , to kill a solo single ESF by myself is a miracle or a dumb pilot or the plane is literally almost dead already. But to do 100% of the damage ? No way. The ESF would have to literally just float there or fly at straight at me moving slow, because I would have to reload at least twice. It takes longer then 5 seconds to empty a single magazine and you cannot kill any full health aircraft with 1 magazine.
 

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,385
277
I havent used aircraft much so I cant comment on that side, but what Pyros says is spot on. A single dual Burster MAX is no threat to any aircraft, merely a deterrence. If 3 or 4 coordinate their fire and single your ESF out you probably die before you can flee, but is a situation where 4 players work together to reliably take out one enemy a problem? I think thats perfectly fine.

A couple of people loading into dual burster tends to clear the skies within a few minutes, but even if you fire at everything you dont get that many kills/assists. I just assume the enemy has a clue and went elsewhere because of the heavy flak fire. The lackluster clip size of the burster costs alot of kills, but mine arent upgraded so maybe that will get better in a couple of months when I can spend certs on situational stuff like that. Right now Infantery and vehicle upgrades have priority.
 

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,277
2,301
And that's a reason you don't see alot of burster maxes(unless its coordinated groups/orders). Being the only one or 1 of 2, means for that entire time you literally get no exp, because all you are doing is making them go repair. Pray a lib doesn't come, because you better hide or it will 2 shot you in a split second.

Also you are complete shit if any kind of ground enemy comes, even a single infantry will kill you easily(with avg skill).
 

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
11,217
2,364
Also you are complete shit if any kind of ground enemy comes, even a single infantry will kill you easily(with avg skill).
Yeah I wish flak did a bit more dmg to infantry, shit half the time you can't even hit people even with the reticule dead on them because of the way the projectiles fire from your arm and have low accuracy to begin with. Best bet is to charge them and melee them, but the fucking MAX charge can't be cancelled for whatever fucked up reason(at least I haven't figured out but admit I haven't tried that often) so if they're close you charge but then run past them have to run in circle until charge is off and hope you're in melee range or try to driveby smack them which is near impossible with the melee shitty range/arc. And even when you punch them, it doesn't one shot, it does the same dmg as normal infantry melee so you need 2hits. Even if you manage to kill them generally you lost most of your health fighting ONE guy who didn't even use AV stuff, just normal guns. Oh and tanks rape you and you literally don't do any dmg to MBTs(maybe on backhits but it's more or less like firing a rifle at them).

It's very unrewarding to play AA unless you play lock on launchers and even then a good deal of your missiles get flared/avoided and you need at least 2 or dmg from other people. At the same time, a few AAs and you don't see a single ESF around at all because it's fairly easy to deny airspace due to rendering issues.
 

Sancus

Trakanon Raider
20
4
Yeah I retract my statement about the 5 seconds kill time, I'm now trying to figure out how I've experienced being nearly killed in the time it takes to fire one barrage of rockets by one burster MAX when there didn't appear to be anyone else around and firing. Hackers maybe? I don't know, it's happened 2-3 times, but I guess something is wrong there because I performed the same test with friendly fire damage and it definitely takes more like 20 seconds to kill an ESF.

The rest of what I said I stand behind though, it's dumb to just nerf everything to the lowest common denominator level of "one guy in a MAX can 1v1 any vehicle" when the real problem is XP.

Your thoughts on balance through exp have merit and reach much the same end goal. Disparities in TTK still leave the guys on AA duty fucked, but...
Yeah, I think something should be done to help people out who force repairs but rarely get kills. Like, maybe you should get partial XP for damaging vehicles if you don't make a kill. The game could count up the damage you've done and dump you some XP. So, 50% of an ESF gives you 50% of the value of an ESF kill. That seems pretty reasonable. I've always felt that purely kill-based rewards were pretty stupid anyway, tbqh.

Pyros_sl said:
Yeah I wish flak did a bit more dmg to infantry, shit half the time you can't even hit people even with the reticule dead on them because of the way the projectiles fire from your arm and have low accuracy to begin with.
It used to do more damage vs infantry, to the point where an AA max could easily kill any infantryman in a straight gun battle, and then they nerfed it very hard for some reason which I still don't understand.
 

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
11,217
2,364
Yeah totally agree that the xp rewards aren't well done, infantry shouldn't give that much especially when you're in a HE tank or a Zephyr Lib, vehicles should give a fuckton more considering how annoying it is to take them out as infantry or even in other vehicles and partial dmg should be rewarded as AA sucks otherwise. But render should also be fixed so air can actually see what's firing at them.

As for your issues, don't know if it's purely a MAX it shouldn't be able to kill your ESF quickly even if he's firing AV rounds instead of Flak or something. Could be a hacker even though I don't know about hacks increasing damage, but maybe there's some. Maybe someone who didn't render fired a rocket at you(not a lock on) or maybe a tank hit you with a shell? I know I got lucky once and hit an ESF from like 500m with a tank shot and it blew up in one hit even though it had like 80% health. I guess death log would tell you that though so yeah don't know. Definitely can't win 1vs1 against an ESF though, best case you charge into a building when he's firing rockets and then unload more flak into him and force him to run, most likely can't finish him though and then he repairs his ESF while you can't repair yourself and get fucked 1min later ^^.

Current system for AA vs ESF kinda sucks though, for both sides. AA don't get xp for the air dominance they assure and ESF are force dot fuck off as soon as some AA come because they can't do shit about it due to render issues. So both sides lose and it's unfun for everyone.
 

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,277
2,301
I dunno about a fuckton more. Ground vehicles die pretty quickly unless they are way off firing into a base, even then 1 ESF can swoop in and take it out, not to mention a lib can take out a MBT in 1 magazine, less if they hit the rear.

I'd say maybe triple what a infantry kill gives. I think atm it just gives you the player kills + destroying the vehicle and the latter is actually pretty low. Something like 300-400 for killing a MBT/Sundy, 300ish for a lightning, 150 for flash + exp from any drivers/passengers. I know atm with boost + sub + double I get something like 370ish for killing a tank with no passengers(mostly from them jumping out) and infantry kills are at like 400.
 

Sancus

Trakanon Raider
20
4
The biggest problem with the vast majority of a vehicle kill XP award being the player kills is that around 75% of the time, everyone bails out before the vehicle dies. I only actually die in a vehicle when I just get totally raped by running into a zerg(ohai suddenly rendering tank/aa platoon). People will often bail out of aircraft just to deny you the XP, even if they're basically suiciding. Anyway, the best thing that could happen right now is if they make it a fuckton more and all of a sudden hunting vehicles is better XP than hunting infantry. That would be a huge step up from the disaster that exists atm. At least then, you'd be doing something useful because vehicles cost resources. And it would self-balance air because ESFs would start hunting other air units and maybe tanks instead of just infantry.
 

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,385
277
No argument against some xp rebalancing from me, as long as it is about improving the things you mention and doesnt come with nerfs to the usually hated roles of repair/resupply.

I think bursters could be a bit better actually, considering the 20+ seconds we agree on here is an eternity in actual gameplay. As it is now, one burster is a joke and dual burster are a deterrence to ESF. If I gimp myself against any target except aircraft with dual bursters instead of taking advantage of the MAX flexibility with mixed arms, I at least want to be a credible threat to aircraft. I realize that makes a group of 3 MAX with dual burster very deadly vs ESF, but as I said above coordinated players efficiently eliminating threats doesnt seem like a problem to me. Ideally to me using a single burster arm is the deterrence, while you use two if you actually want to kill them instead of driving them off.
 

jrbuddha

Silver Knight of the Realm
57
17
So who do I talk to to join TR on Waterson?
biggrin.png
 

Regime

LOADING, PLEASE WAIT...
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
16,860
40,075
Lol I have zero problems wrecking Esf with my max unless its a rare sitatution im the only aa max and were being camped at a watchtower by 3+ libs and 3+ esf.
 
1,880
0
^This.
I joined up with them for the first time last night and had the best time I've had playing this game so far. Very organized, friendly, and incredibly helpful. Trying to run solo or in disorganized pugs is not at all fun. Soon as you get some coordination going the fun level jumps immensely.
After you learn the game there are some fun things you can do solo such as ninja taking checkpoints, flying support (bomber or fighter pilot assassin), solo sniper behind enemy lines, laying mines behind enemy lines, etc, however, for starting make sure you run with a platoon or squad.
 

xzi

Mouthbreather
7,526
6,763
I think I'm the only AA tank I've seen and I still have yet to unlock my top-armor.. it's so fucking sexy though.

Not currently playing but gonna hop on later. Vanu pilots seem to suck shit on Jaeger at nighttime, so there's always free air kills for me on the ground. lmao.
 

Hekotat

FoH nuclear response team
12,244
11,892
I think I'm the only AA tank I've seen and I still have yet to unlock my top-armor.. it's so fucking sexy though.

Not currently playing but gonna hop on later. Vanu pilots seem to suck shit on Jaeger at nighttime, so there's always free air kills for me on the ground. lmao.
I'm pretty sure Vanu on Jaeger is nothing but oceanics, those fuckers come out of the woodwork at night.