ZyyzYzzy
RIP USA
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Then Joe Schmoe, ie you, should just shut the fuck up because he doesn't even know what the fuck he is talking about.
Science!! Fucking magnets, how do they work?
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Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!
Go here and give us your nominations!Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
Sledge
Trakanon Raider
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But there's not a single shred of scientific evidence saying I'm wrong. You posted individual links to glyphosate and pelargonic acid. I clearly said those won't kill bees. Doesn't mean RoundUp Fast Acting ProMax won't because there are different chemicals mixed in with different blends.
You haven't posted any data when those are mixed together with oils, surfactants (especially this), and the other 'unknown' ingredients used in different RoundUp blends. To claim chemical X is safe by itself, and chemical Y is safe by itself, then assume chemical XY with 5 other ingredients mixed in will be just as safe is pretty strange. The surfactant and acid alone might be what does it, and the glyphosate has no roll at all. Doesn't matter though, because it's still a RoundUp blend.
The hundreds of wasps I've sprayed and killed didn't die from heart attacks.
..........Then posts government data on a single chemical used in a blend of 12 others.
hodj
Vox Populi Jihadi
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You are aware the FDA has approved these substances for commercial and residential use, yes?
And that the process for approval requires rigorous scientific inquiry as part and parcel of that process, yes?
Then scientific evidence does exist to refute you.
If you have a problem with that, take it up with the fda.
And that the process for approval requires rigorous scientific inquiry as part and parcel of that process, yes?
Then scientific evidence does exist to refute you.
If you have a problem with that, take it up with the fda.
Sledge
Trakanon Raider
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There was an article two pages ago about RoundUp killing something. People said no way glyphosate will kill that it's been tested over and over. I was simply pointing out that there are other mixtures of RoundUp that aren't just glyphosate. Simple as that. I've been a licensed sprayer for 20 years debating against some people that aren't grasping the core of the debate......some RoundUps aren't just glyphosate anymore and have many other chemicals mixed in that will kill insects.
I've got a lot of respect for you guys, and read most of your posts on the board. But I don't think some of you read mine. So it is what it is. No reason to debate something that the other person isn't reading.
Sledge
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What the heck does that have to do with anything at all? They approve all kinds of things that will kill both weeds and bugs, even at the same time. Go spray wasp killer on your shrubs. It will kill your roses.
Just because the FDA approves something for weed control doesn't mean it won't kill something else during use.
hodj
Vox Populi Jihadi
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I'm reading your posts.
It is just that you are engaging in a flawed line of reasoning that I have immense experience with and that is founded in a lack of understanding thr scientific method and how the approval for these substances occurs.
That isn't to say the process is perfect, no process is or can be, but when we have fda approval versus anecdote, the fda wins.
I'm really not trying to be a dick to you. I have nothing personal against yoh and generally find agreement withat least t primary point you seek to make.
My phone died and I'm typing on a kindle for the first time and this is the worst holy shit
It is just that you are engaging in a flawed line of reasoning that I have immense experience with and that is founded in a lack of understanding thr scientific method and how the approval for these substances occurs.
That isn't to say the process is perfect, no process is or can be, but when we have fda approval versus anecdote, the fda wins.
I'm really not trying to be a dick to you. I have nothing personal against yoh and generally find agreement withat least t primary point you seek to make.
My phone died and I'm typing on a kindle for the first time and this is the worst holy shit
Burnem Wizfyre
Log Wizard
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Lol did you buy a kindle when Amazon was selling them for $30? Or get gifted one from someone like I did? I agree though, kindle are awful.
Ukerric
Bearded Ape
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Mild derail: if you want an ebook reader, pick a Pocketbook Lux, and use Calibre (with the appropriate plugins) to strip DRM from your various ebooks and read them there. The advantage with that kind of setup is that basically you can read every ebook from every platform.
Except Orbit. Half of the Orbit books fail conversion from AZW, you need to completely strip formatting which dumps an ebook with no chapter splits on your reader. So I still buy Orbit in paper, the rest... on my Pocketbook.
End of derail. You may now resume discussing what exactly Roundup means.
hodj
Vox Populi Jihadi
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I just use kindle for all my books, tbh. I never pirate. Just a personal choice. Not something I hold anyone else to, or care if they do so.
Yes.
He's saying that the two compounds interact with other chemicals in the mix to result in an outcome that kills bees.
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Designed, tested, and approved to kill specieshomo sapiens.
May also be used to kill dogs, gorillas, iguanas, three toed sloths, polar bears, and dolphins. And if a particular round were to come out of itjust rightit could probably kill a bee or a wasp as well.
hodj
Vox Populi Jihadi
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Sledge
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There's no RoundUp sold to kill insects and I've never used any to specifically kill insects. The original plain RoundUp we used to use for very large parking lots didn't hurt any bugs as far as I could tell. There are much stronger RoundUp blends that have different ingredients in them in addition to glyphosate or even pelargonic acid. As mentioned, it's not those two ingredients killing the bugs, it's whatever the mixture becomes after they add in the surfactants, oils, whatever makes it rainfast, and the "other ingredients" listed on the bottle. And it's not like RAID giving a quick knock down and instant death. We're working, we see a nest and spray it, some fly away, some drop to the ground, walk around for a while, fall over dead.
Even though I've killed hundreds of bees/wasps/yellow jackets in 18 years by spraying them with this RoundUp blend, it can't be proven because no scientist or wasp coroner ruled the deaths to be caused by the spray itself. It could be hornet heart attacks when facing down the barrel of a 3 gallon sprayer. But for some reason we can't say it's what I just sprayed them with a few minutes earlier. So with that thought, we have to rule the deaths completely mysterious.
No reason for me to continue discussing the mystery any longer, the thread needs to get back on track.