Star Trek: Discovery

Shirtless Sulu would like a word with you!

Some of TOS were ok. The rock monster which spawned the, "Dammit Jim, I'm a doctor not a ..." was actually decent. I remember an episode where they encounter a Dyson Sphere. They just fly right up to the damn thing and are like "lolwut?" and then Scotty calls them all idiots. Two kirk episodes were even decent! Evil Kirk and then the one where Kirk was trapped outside in a spacesuit. And of course, The Trouble with Tribbles.

They don't show the really decent ones that much. Dunno why. Whenever I catch it on a rerun it's ALWAYS the one with Kirk punching the lizard costume.

Jefferson_sl said:

One of the (many) things I hated about Voyager was the neutering of the Borg. Borg are space zombies, their power lies in their ability to adapt and corrupt anything they come into contact with.
By they end of Voyager they weren't the least bit scary and they somehow failed to assimilate any of the more advanced tech they encountered leaving them stagnant as Voyagers crew advanced.

What would have been really cool is if as Janeway made her way back to the Alpha Quadrant she encountered refugees who no longer had a planet to call home and collected them into a massive flotilla the Voyager being the focal point because of the replicators (no planet no crops).

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I believe TNG neutered the borg first, there was that episode where they found Hugh (?) and he basically became a borg hippie. By the time of the second TNG movie it was pretty ridiculous, with a Borg Queen (that is COMPLETELY AGAINST THE BORG IDEA) who also is horny for data or some shit. But yeah Voyager was pretty uneven with the Borg, there were some good stuff like the teamup against the "new" Borg (species 4xxx) or some of the 7of9 episodes, but by the end the Borg were pretty dumb.

The flotilla idea you propose I think was something a few of the writers were pushing for, but it was deemed too un-Star Trek like. Moore went on to pitch BSG anyways, so probably a good idea that Voyager didn't turn into a lame version of BSG which would have killed any chance of BSG being made.

I hope in my lifetime we see someone make a Culture, Ringworld, or Dreaming Void series. Those are all great galactic soap opera book series.

Its hard watching TOS, as a scifi nerd I feel its my duty to watch but man those special effects... and this is the re-mastered edition, but still looking at cardboard screens or the hilariously bad "ship shaking" is tough. I think in 2 years I've made it through 5 episodes

spronk_sl said:

Its hard watching TOS, as a scifi nerd I feel its my duty to watch but man those special effects... and this is the re-mastered edition, but still looking at cardboard screens or the hilariously bad "ship shaking" is tough. I think in 2 years I've made it through 5 episodes

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I actually watched the first two episodes last night because I have never seen TOS. It isn't as bad as I thought it would be, honestly, but it certainly isn't exciting.

Araysar_sl said:

during season 3 of TNG you were genuinely afraid of the Borg

by season 3 of Voyager you were like "haha, a borg episode, fucking ghey..."

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I think one problem they encountered in voyager is one of scale. In TNG you had 1 borg cube destroying 30 federation ships. Even when we knew the main characters weren't really in danger, we knew the borg were gonna fuck some shit up! In Voyager, however, there was only one ship filled with main characters. The Borg never got to do any mass slaughters and actually were on the receiving end for those couple episodes with 8472.

i had a discussion with another nerd like myself about all these "faceless" races. The Tyranid from wh40k, the early zerg in starcraft, even (to a lesser extend) the Cylons in BSG

they all were enemies you could not comunicate with. they is no understanding, now dialogue. They are mindless, indifferent waves of destructions. The Borg, just like the zerg, have lost that characteristic the moment they have been characterized. They are now powerful enemies, but enemies you can at least understand to some extend. An this understanding, even if little, makes them way less scary

Hive mind, flying insects, queen. I guess.

Talk about phoning it in. Just about anything they did that wasn't "lol, borgqueen" would have been better. I'm having trouble thinking of something that would have been worse... but there probably is something.

I disagree with Hugh and the Borg Queen being a bad thing. The queen was poorly executed but it does stand to reason that the hive mind would have a singular dictator who enjoys the fruits of her done labor while denying them and everyone they encounter the same right to individuality. Had they written her as an Empress whose empire has grown in such a way that it requires such a vast and continuous supply of raw materials that it would collapse upon itself if the flow of goods ever stopped it would have given an underlying motivation to the Borg's consumption of everything and would have much better defined the Queens own motivations. The genisis of the drone could have been derived from this, The society would collapse without resources but her subjects were too compassionate to destroy another world to save their own and so she began the conversion of her army into one without compassion or free will out of necessity and the process propagated itself as the Borg Society was still unable to self-sustain until it became the unstoppable juggernaut we saw in TOS. This would be analogous of the British empire and the conditions leading up to the American Revolution but with zombie cyborgs.

The story of Hugh being severed from the hive mind and adapting by developing free will was one of morality in the face of war. The crew saw the Borg as one unrelenting and dangerous not because they were evil but because they had no compassion or empathy. Once they determined that the Borg are potentially dominated individuals and not a singular entity their utter destruction would have severe moral implications. This I believe was directed at the threat that communism implied.

iirc, the plan of unleashing Hugh's independence upon the Borg worked in a limited fashion but as the newly freed Borg tried to understand their purpose as individuals they were easily dominated by a smooth talking Lore, representing the threat a cult of personality can have on an unguarded and well meaning populace. They had found freedom only to give it away.

Iannis_sl said:

Hive mind, flying insects, queen. I guess.

Talk about phoning it in. Just about anything they did that wasn't "lol, borgqueen" would have been better. I'm having trouble thinking of something that would have been worse... but there probably is something.

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Well, the Borg were originally designed to be an insectoid race until they found out they didn't have the budget for it.

Janeway had a way to stop the Borg once and for all from ever attacking the majority of the Universe and she let decided not to use it, or didn't even see the option that presented itself.

If the Borg names "One" had allowed himself to be captured by the collective it would have nullified the Borg's need to seek advanced technology which is their primary reason for attacking other cultures. The Borg tend to ignore that which they consider of no value or threat and once they had assimilated the future tech that would most likely include the majority of species excepting maybe the Q.

Jefferson_sl said:

I disagree with Hugh and the Borg Queen being a bad thing. The queen was poorly executed but it does stand to reason that the hive mind would have a singular dictator who enjoys the fruits of her done labor while denying them and everyone they encounter the same right to individuality. Had they written her as an Empress whose empire has grown in such a way that it requires such a vast and continuous supply of raw materials that it would collapse upon itself if the flow of goods ever stopped it would have given an underlying motivation to the Borg's consumption of everything and would have much better defined the Queens own motivations. The genisis of the drone could have been derived from this, The society would collapse without resources but her subjects were too compassionate to destroy another world to save their own and so she began the conversion of her army into one without compassion or free will out of necessity and the process propagated itself as the Borg Society was still unable to self-sustain until it became the unstoppable juggernaut we saw in TOS. This would be analogous of the British empire and the conditions leading up to the American Revolution but with zombie cyborgs.

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That would have been a better story than what we got. But I'm with Ara when it comes to the borg. An intractable, faceless evil that is beyond your ability to salvage or divert and simply must be resisted and destroyed-- that would have been an even better story to see how our mildly self-righteous federation officers coped with the moral implications of THAT.

But I guess DS9 did that episode, and it wouldn't have really been "Star Trek". Gene Rodenberry did not believe in intractable evils.

Species 8472 and everything to do with Special 8472 was the dumbest shit in Voyager, and that's saying something cause there was a lot of dumb shit in voyger.

I just experienced the theme song for Enterprise for the first time. Good god that is some terrible shit.

It's 100% awesome.

redneck country music motherfuckers, my ears bleed just embedding this


compare that shit to this