The Elder Scrolls Online

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Creslin

Trakanon Raider
2,503
1,151
Darkfall is fun in alot of ways, the combat is solid atleast, the game overall is just too hardcore to ever hit big numbers. Atleast the pvp has real rewards and motivations instead of the retarded fight for the glory of the blue team by grinding points bullshit in most games.

It often amazes me that its been 10+ years since EVEs release and we don't have a single other game try to come out and capitalize on a similar formula from even a medium sized studio. Prolly cause of how incestuous mmo studios are now, its been the same 10 retards bouncing between failed projects getting all the money for a decade. Gotta give them credit tho, it cant be easy to convince so many people that all the terrible decisions you make arent your fault and are either your underlings being incompetent or nameless suits forcing you to do things.
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
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Muligan_sl said:
So, what is the best PvP game out right now? I've played them all, except ESO, because they all end up leaving me pretty unfulfilled. Getting the itch now the H1Z1 could be postponed and was my hopeful PvP fix.
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Depends on what kind of PvP you want. PvP is just a game where you fight other players. There's massive differences in the kind of gameplay in a moba, rts, fps, structured MMO, realm vs realm MMO, warfare MMO and open world MMO pvp.

As an individual player there is no question that large-scale PvP in MMOs is the bottom of the barrel. If you're an individual agent following the zerg or even hunting solo/duo players there's just not a lot of interesting things to do. ESO is particularly bad not just because of the number of bugs and lag but also because at the high end the skill rotation is simple to execute. Whether it's sorcs streaking into hordes, dropping annul/atronach/pulsar and streaking out or DKs jumping into hordes and dropping talons/banner (who cares what NB/templar do!) it's pretty basic gameplay.

However as a large scale guild there is nothing more interesting than building a war machine in an MMO, strategizing how to use it, working with server politics and conquering your enemy. This is true for both raid leading (Of which I do a lot of but am far from the best) and out of combat. I've competed in FPS, RTS, done the cutting edge PVE raiding, structured PVP etc and while I still play a huge breadth of games the moments of victory you find in large scale PVP are just on another level.

This is one of my favorite pictures taken in ESO (quality is shit because I put graphics to minimum to maximize the amount of time I could player without running out of memory from a memory leak, eat shit Zenimax).
1802611.jpg


This is a pretty routine moment for us during our raids. The tightness of our formation and the excitement we had when we were charging an unsuspecting force of enemies that were attacking our raid is great and something unique to these games. Sure in structured PVP you can jump someone but it's on such a small scale and is so predictable that it's dissimilar.

Another good shot is
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There is nothing like having your back to a keep you worked hard for and seeing a massive enemy force attacking it. In ESO this is pretty muted because, well, you don't work hard for your keep and one can literally cap a keep in 4m. But this kind of siege defense is unique to these games.

Our next game is Archeage, and in that game you do work hard for your keep and I expect a lot of defenses for it. We're pretty excited for ArcheAge in general. After GW2 and ESO I'm genuinely tired of instanced realm vs realm games. It has a lot of what makes warfare PVP fun but lacks the soul.
 
Utnayan

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,525
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(quality is shit because I put graphics to minimum to maximize the amount of time I could player without running out of memory from a memory leak, eat shit Zenimax).
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200 players on screen at once!
 
G

Gecko_sl

shitlord
1,482
0
bayr_sl said:
I've never understood the appeal of realm vs realm pvp. I understand conceptually being part of a huge battle is a cool idea, but in practice it's always been the most awful, boring shit. I mean Tarren Mill was the best battle in an MMO I've personally been apart of, the more you design your game for it the more awful it seems to be.
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As far as fun, I've had plenty in PVP. The bridge battles in early Planetside were simply amazing, and on par with the best raids I've done in WOW or EQ. The group versus group combat in DAOC were amazingly fun, even with class imbalances. Even early WOW and SWG were amusing.

My problem is I have no desire to play the same design for PVP that's been around forever. The boring arenas or instanced battlegrounds or even static world/keep/landscapes with one or three groups fighting over it.. blah.
 
Cinge

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,277
2,302
Gecko_sl said:
As far as fun, I've had plenty in PVP. The bridge battles in early Planetside were simply amazing, and on par with the best raids I've done in WOW or EQ. The group versus group combat in DAOC were amazingly fun, even with class imbalances. Even early WOW and SWG were amusing.

My problem is I have no desire to play the same design for PVP that's been around forever. The boring arenas or instanced battlegrounds or even static world/keep/landscapes with one or three groups fighting over it.. blah.
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Oh man ps1 bridge battles. Literally last all weekend and so much fun.
 
R

Rescorla_sl

shitlord
2,233
0
Gecko_sl said:
As far as fun, I've had plenty in PVP. The bridge battles in early Planetside were simply amazing, and on par with the best raids I've done in WOW or EQ. The group versus group combat in DAOC were amazingly fun, even with class imbalances. Even early WOW and SWG were amusing.

My problem is I have no desire to play the same design for PVP that's been around forever. The boring arenas or instanced battlegrounds or even static world/keep/landscapes with one or three groups fighting over it.. blah.
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Do you want a fair fight where each side has the same number of people or do you prefer no population constraint and the side with most people can have an advantage?
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
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Utnayan_sl said:
200 players on screen at once!
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Hey now, ESO is legit best in the world for having 200 players on screen at once. Now, if more than one campaigns have a 200+ person fight going on the server goes to shit, but the underlying engine handles it no problem.

I always avoid fighting between red/blue for strategic reasons but there's been a few times where we've had to take bleakers/chalman/aleswell (the objectives between red / blue) and some of the three way battles were incredible.
 
J

Jackdaddio_sl

shitlord
727
0
Creslin_sl said:
Darkfall is fun in alot of ways, the combat is solid atleast, the game overall is just too hardcore to ever hit big numbers. Atleast the pvp has real rewards and motivations instead of the retarded fight for the glory of the blue team by grinding points bullshit in most games.
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I sucked at Darkfall. I only lasted about two months because I'm not really a huge PvP person but I must say, I loved how they did PvP. Didn't care for the game overall with little PvE at launch.

But in PvP, when you got blinded, youreallygot blinded. Your screen went all hazy and you couldn't see anyone but barely for a few seconds. Other spells affected other things as well. It's one reason I never get into these large scale battles that much by the more casual PvP companies. It doesn't seem that challenging, it always just ends up like 'our zerg vs your zerg'. If someone freezes you or blinds, you can still see everything that's happening in wide view mode anyways so leaders can still issue orders.



If I were a PvPer, I'd be playing Darkfall, not all these casual games where it really doesn't matter what you do.
 
Bondurant

Bondurant

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
3,845
4,792
V2 only Tuco ? What have you become
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Jackdaddio_sl said:
if I were a PvPer, I'd be playing Darkfall, not all these casual games where it really doesn't matter what you do.
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I consider myself a PvPer and I like cruel, harsh and challenging PvP. I bought Darkfall Unholy Wars. It was fucking awful. Combat gameplay is painful it's like riding a porcupine naked, as elaborated as Pong's and there's a lot of amateur game design decisions involved in game mechanics because it's quite obvious their ideas don't fit a small team studio at all. They take ages to fix / patch stuff and they seem quite clueless about anything. UI is so unresponsive you'll feel the servers are heberged on Pluton. Of course full loot PvP is fun, but in Darkfall game balance is so bad you'll spend your time wandering around in rags, because you don't want to lose your armor just because some faggot will spam its today's broken spell. Also safe zones everywhere. So much for hardcore, I guess. Only hardcore thing about Darkfall because you need to be a shaolin monk to force yourself playing it more than 1 hour.
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
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Bondurant_sl said:
V2 only Tuco ? What have you become
frown.png
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Playing a ton, getting burnt out and quitting isn't an option for me.


As to DFO, we never really got into it for the reasons Bondurant stated. It had a lot of the hardcore PVP stuff we like, but without a good game behind the ruleset it's not enjoyable.
 
Hatorade

Hatorade

A nice asshole.
8,460
7,204
Jackdaddio_sl said:
I sucked at Darkfall. I only lasted about two months because I'm not really a huge PvP person but I must say, I loved how they did PvP. Didn't care for the game overall with little PvE at launch.

But in PvP, when you got blinded, youreallygot blinded. Your screen went all hazy and you couldn't see anyone but barely for a few seconds. Other spells affected other things as well. It's one reason I never get into these large scale battles that much by the more casual PvP companies. It doesn't seem that challenging, it always just ends up like 'our zerg vs your zerg'. If someone freezes you or blinds, you can still see everything that's happening in wide view mode anyways so leaders can still issue orders.



If I were a PvPer, I'd be playing Darkfall, not all these casual games where it really doesn't matter what you do.
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Forgot about this game, played it at launch and it was pretty terrible, may check it out again.
 
Daidraco

Daidraco

Avatar of War Slayer
10,053
10,372
Hatorade_sl said:
Forgot about this game, played it at launch and it was pretty terrible, may check it out again.
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It was relaunched with better graphics and some changes ~ The reviews Ive seen of the relaunch say its gotten better. Though, I have yet to hear about any of my friends playing it.

As for the bots ~ If they are that blatant, then Zenimax has shit all for punishment and/or detection. If people did that in WoW, they would be banned within hours.
 
Dr Neir

Dr Neir

Trakanon Raider
832
1,505
They could just make the PC phase on successful kill. They could also add phasing to item collection quests too. Sick of having to fight for a limited respawn quest item with 20 other players at the same time. Nothing like bottlenecking for no reason!
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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Tonight we had a 30 man raid during an all call. First we went to AB and ran siege weapon and synergy drills. We then went to Wabbajack which had a full population for all three factions. We started the evening on the defensive, not holding Alessia keep. We leapfrogged into enemy territory and took Sejanus, then moved to BRK. Blue was pushing Red hard in the west and soon Red only had one keep left that was holding on to their emperorship: Chalman. We were actively fighting the emperor group at Chalman for over an hour, hitting them from all sides and being repeatedly flanked by a blue group that seemed to be coordinating with Red. This was probably the most intense 3 sided battle I've fought in the game so far. We were able to wipe the emperor group several times, but always took enough losses that we couldn't push through and cap the keep. We even got far enough to take the third floor of Chalman, but the blue enemy was hitting one set of stairs while the Red force hit the other set and wiped us.

UZTTP5f.jpg


Eventually the blue side gave up trying to take Chalman and attacked us in our home territory. The enemy took blackboot and was moving to the scroll of Altadoon and we had to give up trying to dethrone the emperor. We ported back to our homebase and met the Blue side as they were sitting on the altadoon scroll trying to get out of combat to take it. With our combined forces we were able to boot them out of our temple all the way to Black Boot.

PRX left the militia to take Black Boot and lept to Faregyl. As we began hitting it the enemy took Bloodmayne, opening the gate to Mmem. We pushed as hard as we could on Faregyl, capping it closed the Mmem gate and allowed the Aldmeri Militia to easily wipe the blue raid.

As we began moving from Faregyl to Roebeck a stealth blue group cowardly snatched the scroll of Altadoon behind us and began running it to their territory. We formed up and moved together and caught up to them and Kuridin took the scroll to safety. We then rallied and went back to Roebeck, capping it to end the night.
 
D

DMK_sl

shitlord
1,600
0
Due to the fact mmos can't emulate the fast twitch high quality game play of an FPS they have to offer PVP that plays to their strength and no one else can emulate. And that is having permanent consequences to PVP that strongly effect the world.

Developers forgot the strength that an MMO has and that was a living world that the players made the stories.

Devs should give the players the canvas and let us paint or the foundation and let us build. The backdrop to create a story.
 
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