The Paranormal, UFO's, and Mysteries of the Unknown

Void · Sep 17, 2021

I'm pretty sure I've rehashed this many times in this thread, but here we go again.

You're right, not even a clear picture or video is going to convince me these days, because it is STILL much more likely that said proof is either not really what it appears to be (Black Knight satellite being a fucking blanket, anyone?) or a straight up fake than it is that actual aliens are somehow here and enjoy buzzing aircraft but otherwise remaining unseen. Pick anywhere on the internet, and you'll find people that are more than willing to troll the shit out of people for even a little bit of attention. Combine that with another subset of the population that wants to believe so badly, and here we are.

What would it take to convince me? I'm honestly not sure anymore. Even seeing something with my own eyes would have to be so clear and incapable of being faked, because my first thought would be to wonder if I were on drugs somehow. I'd definitely need a substantial number of other people seeing the same thing. Obviously there is a point where I'd believe something right in front of me, but it would not be glimpsing something racing across the sky, no matter how clear. I suppose I would believe it if an actual alien ship appeared somewhere and literal aliens stepped out of it, and hundreds/thousands of cell phone videos caught it...but I'd need to see it coming down all the way, and close ups of the ship and aliens to ensure they weren't fakes as well. And even then I'd probably want to see it personally too. Give me Independence Day ships hovering over major cities, and I'll come back here and say how wrong I was.

Pretty extreme requirements for proof? Sure, but why shouldn't they be? You're essentially asking me to take other people's word for it, and making me assume that people aren't inherently flawed, make mistakes, and sometimes outright duplicitous. Remember, it would still be easier for you to find one specific grain of sand on this planet than it would be to find one particular planet in the known universe. By orders of magnitude. And that's not even taking into account how long it would take to search the universe vs. the fraction of time that life has been on this planet. You can handwave away impossibilities like that with "advanced tech we have no comprehension of" but if I try to handwave it away by saying people are stupid/shitty, I'm the one that is in a logic trap.

Yeah, ok.

Moogalak · Sep 17, 2021

There you go, that wasn't too hard! Nothing will convince the zealots.

Edit: as you stated void, these are all rehashed topics from earlier in the thread. How about we bring up one of the 100% bullshit eyewitness accounts then?

What are we to make of Mr. Salas' story? He is fabricating the whole thing? Start at 2 mins in and watch as much as you want. Story is pretty condensed, only about 8 mins if you don't want to waste a bunch of time on the rest of the video. Mr. Salas has spoken about his story in many places and videos, so you may have heard it before.

Chukzombi · Sep 17, 2021

Moogalak said:
There you go, that wasn't too hard! Nothing will convince the zealots.

Edit: as you stated void, these are all rehashed topics from earlier in the thread. How about we bring up one of the 100% bullshit eyewitness accounts then?

What are we to make of Mr. Salas' story? He is fabricating the whole thing? Start at 2 mins in and watch as much as you want. Story is pretty condensed, only about 8 mins if you don't want to waste a bunch of time on the rest of the video. Mr. Salas has spoken about his story in many places and videos, so you may have heard it before.

I'm not a skeptic, as the meme says, i want to believe. but there is nothing to believe. when i read that Jimmy Carter said he saw a space ship. i never had any reason to not believe him. i still believe him when he said he saw a space ship to this day. thats not the same as thinking he really did see a space ship.

Void · Sep 17, 2021

Moogalak said:
There you go, that wasn't too hard! Nothing will convince the zealots.

Edit: as you stated void, these are all rehashed topics from earlier in the thread. How about we bring up one of the 100% bullshit eyewitness accounts then?

What are we to make of Mr. Salas' story? He is fabricating the whole thing? Start at 2 mins in and watch as much as you want. Story is pretty condensed, only about 8 mins if you don't want to waste a bunch of time on the rest of the video. Mr. Salas has spoken about his story in many places and videos, so you may have heard it before.

I'm at work and can't listen to a video. I can watch it, but chances are I'm going to lose whatever it is that you want me to gain from hearing it.

Apart from that...sure, I can watch it when I get home. I've literally done that dozens of times previously though. Just go back through this thread and count the number of videos MFF has asked me to watch, because THIS ONE will be the one that finally gets through to me! Yet none of them do. The one all about Bob Lazar, I watched over an hour on that I believe, and all it did for me was think that Bob Lazar (and whomever it was that made the video) are some of the biggest liars ever. He supposedly has a piece of that element hidden away that would prove everything. He says he can't reveal it for fear of getting disappeared. Yet he can go around telling everyone he has it? If he really did have it, and "they" were so ready to imprison or murder people over it, why isn't he dead just for saying he has it? I've watched several episodes of that shitty TV show that he put on his google drive for people, and came back and laughed at how absurd the whole thing was.

So you tell me. Is this video going to finally be the one that convinces me? Or is it, as I suspect from chuk's response, simply someone's eyewitness account that there is no way I can verify anything about it, other than that the guy is saying it happened? Like chuk said, I don't doubt that millions of people truly believe they have seen an alien spacecraft; I doubt that that's actually what they saw.

MusicForFish · Sep 17, 2021

San Marino Could Become the U.N.'s New "Geneva" For UFOs - The Debrief

San Marino Could Become the United Nations' New "Geneva" For UFOs, as the Discussion of "Unidentified Aerial Phenomena" Goes Global.

thedebrief.org

Chukzombi · Sep 17, 2021

Void said:
I'm at work and can't listen to a video. I can watch it, but chances are I'm going to lose whatever it is that you want me to gain from hearing it.

Apart from that...sure, I can watch it when I get home. I've literally done that dozens of times previously though. Just go back through this thread and count the number of videos MFF has asked me to watch, because THIS ONE will be the one that finally gets through to me! Yet none of them do. The one all about Bob Lazar, I watched over an hour on that I believe, and all it did for me was think that Bob Lazar (and whomever it was that made the video) are some of the biggest liars ever. He supposedly has a piece of that element hidden away that would prove everything. He says he can't reveal it for fear of getting disappeared. Yet he can go around telling everyone he has it? If he really did have it, and "they" were so ready to imprison or murder people over it, why isn't he dead just for saying he has it? I've watched several episodes of that shitty TV show that he put on his google drive for people, and came back and laughed at how absurd the whole thing was.

So you tell me. Is this video going to finally be the one that convinces me? Or is it, as I suspect from chuk's response, simply someone's eyewitness account that there is no way I can verify anything about it, other than that the guy is saying it happened? Like chuk said, I don't doubt that millions of people truly believe they have seen an alien spacecraft; I doubt that that's actually what they saw.

i'm not even calling anyone a nutcase or a retard. these things were spotted thousands of years ago. they didnt know about space ships or little green men. all that stuff started with Jules Verne's novels or HG Wells. before that, people were callig this shit, "wheels in wheels" or "bronze shields" or "angels/gods". what we call space ships and Greys or whatever is just pop culture nonsense describing a possible rare phenomena we havent classified yet. it doesnt help that we have this notion of space ships and such clouding people's judgment into believing what they are seeing is something when it could be something else. like the moon or satellites or a jumbo jet or a Goodyear blimp or even just birds.

MusicForFish · Sep 17, 2021

Tripamang · Sep 18, 2021

The very nature of the crafts may negate ever getting clear photos. Plasma might be a part of their propulsion systems so whole its moving it would always be tad bit blurry. Or if it creates a field that bends space time those disturbances would also inhibit clear videos. It's not that surprising that we don't have clearer photos these are typically small craft 30 to 40 feet l across taken at thousands of feet to kilometers away. I don't think the conditions are right to create lots of opportunities for clear photos.

For me just the photos isn't enough it's the multiple sensors that all report something physical being there doing things we can't explain. What they are, where they come from or what they want is a total unknown but there is definitely something there.

Lue elizondo is working on an app that uses ai to validate photos and video so I have high hopes that we might have a great filter for fake garbage sooner than later. Avi Loeb's Galileo project has a lot of potential too so in either case the next decade is going to add a lot of solid data points that will be available to the public.

Chukzombi · Sep 19, 2021

Tripamang said:
The very nature of the crafts may negate ever getting clear photos. Plasma might be a part of their propulsion systems so whole its moving it would always be tad bit blurry. Or if it creates a field that bends space time those disturbances would also inhibit clear videos. It's not that surprising that we don't have clearer photos these are typically small craft 30 to 40 feet l across taken at thousands of feet to kilometers away. I don't think the conditions are right to create lots of opportunities for clear photos.

For me just the photos isn't enough it's the multiple sensors that all report something physical being there doing things we can't explain. What they are, where they come from or what they want is a total unknown but there is definitely something there.

Lue elizondo is working on an app that uses ai to validate photos and video so I have high hopes that we might have a great filter for fake garbage sooner than later. Avi Loeb's Galileo project has a lot of potential too so in either case the next decade is going to add a lot of solid data points that will be available to the public.

you're still working under the premise that these are sentient beings in physical crafts just looping around the planet in nonsensical fashion. a hyper sentient being in a hyper technological spacecraft wouldnt just joyride for the 6 or more thousand years of recorded human history in order to fuck with the locals. ok. as i said, the concept of spacecraft and ETs is just some recent notion people latched onto with the advent of science fiction. lets dismiss that for now. lets look at it from the standpoint as a natural phenomena. are there known spherical electrical phenomena floating around in the air causing mayhem? the answer to that is YES. its called Ball Lightning.

Ball lightning - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Ball lightning is an unexplained phenomenon described as luminescent, spherical objects that vary from pea-sized to several meters in diameter. Though usually associated with thunderstorms, ball lightnings are said to last considerably longer than the split-second flash of a lightning bolt, and are a distinct phenomenon from St. Elmo's fire.

Some 19th-century reports[1][2] describe balls that eventually explode and leave behind an odor of sulfur. Descriptions of ball lightning appear in a variety of accounts over the centuries and have received attention from scientists.[3] An optical spectrum of what appears to have been a ball-lightning event was published in January 2014 and included a video at high frame rate.[4][5] Laboratory experiments have produced effects that are visually similar to reports of ball lightning, but how these relate to the supposed phenomenon remains unclear.[6][7]

Scientists have proposed a number of hypotheses to explain reports of ball lightning over the centuries, but scientific data on ball lightning remains scarce. The presumption of its existence has depended on reported public sightings, which have produced inconsistent findings. Owing to the lack of reproducible data, the existence of ball lightning as a physical phenomenon remains unproven.[8][needs update]
XXXXXX

Ball lightning does what a lot of these UFO sightings do. its not proven because its not something that can be reproduced in a lab. some ancient reports of UFOs talk about these floating orbs in the sky right before or during battles. then as the battle progresses it starts to rain. modern warfare talks about Foo Fighters.

Foo fighter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Sightings occurred in November 1944, when pilots flying over Western Europe by night reported seeing fast-moving round glowing objects following their aircraft. The objects were variously described as fiery, and glowing red, white, or orange. Some pilots described them as resembling Christmas-tree lights and reported that they seemed to toy with the aircraft, making wild turns before simply vanishing. Pilots and aircrew reported that the objects flew together in formation with their aircraft and behaved as if they were under intelligent control, but never displayed hostile behavior. However, they could not be outmaneuvered or shot down. The phenomenon was so widespread that the lights earned a name – in the European Theater of Operations they were often called "Kraut fireballs", but for the most part called "foo fighters". The military took the sightings seriously, suspecting that the mysterious sightings might be secret German weapons, but further investigation revealed that German and Japanese pilots had reported similar sightings.[9]
XXXXXX
so we have a pattern here. does the pattern mean these balls of light are triggered by some kind of electromagnetism due to the planes flying around in the sky?
did the masses of roman soldiers also create some similar field of electricity from their numbers and metal weapons?

List of reported UFO sightings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

According to Plutarch, a Roman army commanded by Lucullus was about to begin a battle with Mithridates VI of Pontus when "all on a sudden, the sky burst asunder, and a huge, flame-like body was seen to fall between the two armies. In shape, it was most like a wine-jar, and in colour, like molten silver." Plutarch reports the shape of the object as like a wine-jar (pithos). The apparently silvery object was reported by both armies.
XXXXX
this isnt a well thought out theory, but its something i suspect is closer to the truth of this than metal saucers in the sky.

Chukzombi · Sep 19, 2021

Chukzombi · Sep 19, 2021

Chukzombi said:
you're still working under the premise that these are sentient beings in physical crafts just looping around the planet in nonsensical fashion. a hyper sentient being in a hyper technological spacecraft wouldnt just joyride for the 6 or more thousand years of recorded human history in order to fuck with the locals. ok. as i said, the concept of spacecraft and ETs is just some recent notion people latched onto with the advent of science fiction. lets dismiss that for now. lets look at it from the standpoint as a natural phenomena. are there known spherical electrical phenomena floating around in the air causing mayhem? the answer to that is YES. its called Ball Lightning.

Ball lightning - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Ball lightning is an unexplained phenomenon described as luminescent, spherical objects that vary from pea-sized to several meters in diameter. Though usually associated with thunderstorms, ball lightnings are said to last considerably longer than the split-second flash of a lightning bolt, and are a distinct phenomenon from St. Elmo's fire.

Some 19th-century reports[1][2] describe balls that eventually explode and leave behind an odor of sulfur. Descriptions of ball lightning appear in a variety of accounts over the centuries and have received attention from scientists.[3] An optical spectrum of what appears to have been a ball-lightning event was published in January 2014 and included a video at high frame rate.[4][5] Laboratory experiments have produced effects that are visually similar to reports of ball lightning, but how these relate to the supposed phenomenon remains unclear.[6][7]

Scientists have proposed a number of hypotheses to explain reports of ball lightning over the centuries, but scientific data on ball lightning remains scarce. The presumption of its existence has depended on reported public sightings, which have produced inconsistent findings. Owing to the lack of reproducible data, the existence of ball lightning as a physical phenomenon remains unproven.[8][needs update]
XXXXXX

Ball lightning does what a lot of these UFO sightings do. its not proven because its not something that can be reproduced in a lab. some ancient reports of UFOs talk about these floating orbs in the sky right before or during battles. then as the battle progresses it starts to rain. modern warfare talks about Foo Fighters.

Foo fighter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Sightings occurred in November 1944, when pilots flying over Western Europe by night reported seeing fast-moving round glowing objects following their aircraft. The objects were variously described as fiery, and glowing red, white, or orange. Some pilots described them as resembling Christmas-tree lights and reported that they seemed to toy with the aircraft, making wild turns before simply vanishing. Pilots and aircrew reported that the objects flew together in formation with their aircraft and behaved as if they were under intelligent control, but never displayed hostile behavior. However, they could not be outmaneuvered or shot down. The phenomenon was so widespread that the lights earned a name – in the European Theater of Operations they were often called "Kraut fireballs", but for the most part called "foo fighters". The military took the sightings seriously, suspecting that the mysterious sightings might be secret German weapons, but further investigation revealed that German and Japanese pilots had reported similar sightings.[9]
XXXXXX
so we have a pattern here. does the pattern mean these balls of light are triggered by some kind of electromagnetism due to the planes flying around in the sky?
did the masses of roman soldiers also create some similar field of electricity from their numbers and metal weapons?

List of reported UFO sightings - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

According to Plutarch, a Roman army commanded by Lucullus was about to begin a battle with Mithridates VI of Pontus when "all on a sudden, the sky burst asunder, and a huge, flame-like body was seen to fall between the two armies. In shape, it was most like a wine-jar, and in colour, like molten silver." Plutarch reports the shape of the object as like a wine-jar (pithos). The apparently silvery object was reported by both armies.
XXXXX
this isnt a well thought out theory, but its something i suspect is closer to the truth of this than metal saucers in the sky.

lets continue with this natural phenomena idea. there is also a thing called Earthquake Lights.
strange lights start appearing in the sky before, during or after earthquakes. science is still out on what the fuck is causing it. but it has been documented a number of times.

Earthquake light - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

An earthquake light is a luminous aerial phenomenon that reportedly appears in the sky at or near areas of tectonic stress, seismic activity, or volcanic eruptions.[1] There is no consensus what the phenomenon causes are, or even whether it is a single phenomenon or several.

MusicForFish · Sep 19, 2021

Chukzombi said:
lets continue with this natural phenomena idea. there is also a thing called Earthquake Lights.
strange lights start appearing in the sky before, during or after earthquakes. science is still out on what the fuck is causing it. but it has been documented a number of times.

Earthquake light - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

An earthquake light is a luminous aerial phenomenon that reportedly appears in the sky at or near areas of tectonic stress, seismic activity, or volcanic eruptions.[1] There is no consensus what the phenomenon causes are, or even whether it is a single phenomenon or several.

Yes of course but there are also craft flying in our atmosphere, traveling in our oceans, and around our moon that aren't ours.

Chukzombi · Sep 19, 2021

MusicForFish said:
Yes of course but there are also craft flying in our atmosphere, traveling in our oceans, and around our moon that aren't ours.

well lets just say i completely disagree that these are craft of any kind. there is nothing to suggest these things are being piloted or controlled by anyone.

quick thought exercise

what do you see in these drawings?

was your first reaction that these are representations of spacemen?
thats right, you see spacemen because you are alive in the age of space exploration. they look like spacemen but drawn thousands of years ago by people who have no idea what a spaceman even is. back when these were drawn, they looked like something completely different to those people, they are not spacemen of course. even if there were space aliens that came out to chill with the ancient locals, they wouldnt be dressed like NASA astronauts. its only a thing to us because thats what we associate with spacemen. its like the phenomenon of people reading into Nostradamus's writings and believed he could predict the future. of course he couldnt, his "predictions" only mean something because they fit similarly to events that later people were experiencing in their timeline. in Nostradamus's timeine, they were a bunch of faggot poems he wrote to pay the bills and entertain the royals

the concept of spacecraft and spacemen was never a thing until writers invented the concept in the 1800s. before that a lot of this stuff was attributed to religion and omens of doom or good fortune.

MusicForFish · Sep 19, 2021

Chukzombi said:
well lets just say i completely disagree that these are craft of any kind. there is nothing to suggest these things are being piloted or controlled by anyone.

quick thought exercise

what do you see in these drawings?

was your first reaction that these are representations of spacemen?
thats right, you see spacemen because you are alive in the age of space exploration. they look like spacemen but drawn thousands of years ago by people who have no idea what a spaceman even is. back when these were drawn, they looked like something completely different to those people, they are not spacemen of course. even if there were space aliens that came out to chill with the ancient locals, they wouldnt be dressed like NASA astronauts. its only a thing to us because thats what we associate with spacemen. its like the phenomenon of people reading into Nostradamus's writings and believed he could predict the future. of course he couldnt, his "predictions" only mean something because they fit similarly to events that later people were experiencing in their timeline. in Nostradamus's timeine, they were a bunch of faggot poems he wrote to pay the bills and entertain the royals

the concept of spacecraft and spacemen was never a thing until writers invented the concept in the 1800s. before that a lot of this stuff was attributed to religion and omens of doom or good fortune.

I see warriors in war paint dancing a jig wearing thier always needed face masks to keep the viruses of the heathens away from them so they could hunt and gather whilst remaining stronk. They had some real barn burners back in the day too. Example:

Masakari · Sep 19, 2021

Hello, I haven't participated in this thread before but have been following the topic of UFOs my entire life. It's a long, and arduous rabbit hole to go down, filled with misinformation, fantasies, radical conspiracy theories, and so much more. There are gems to behold however.

For instance, the 1952 Washington DC UFO Flap:

A recently release video of a UAP from the USS Omaha courtesy of their IR cam:

Or the recent ones released from the Congressional Report on UAPs:

Moogalak · Sep 19, 2021

Mylar balloons, ball lightning. All cases closed.

Chukzombi · Sep 19, 2021

Moogalak said:
Mylar balloons, ball lightning. All cases closed.

birds, other planes. satellites, space debris and hoaxes. those are all possibilities as well. if you wish to discuss what stuff could be, please continue to do so, everyone's opinion is welcome here.

Masakari · Sep 19, 2021

Moogalak said:
Mylar balloons, ball lightning. All cases closed.

Did you know that in the 90s, the Air Force attributed the "bodies recovered" at the Roswell (1947) site to Project High Dive, which didn't start until 1953?

Kiroy · Sep 19, 2021

Chukzombi said:
lets continue with this natural phenomena idea. there is also a thing called Earthquake Lights.
strange lights start appearing in the sky before, during or after earthquakes. science is still out on what the fuck is causing it. but it has been documented a number of times.

Earthquake light - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

An earthquake light is a luminous aerial phenomenon that reportedly appears in the sky at or near areas of tectonic stress, seismic activity, or volcanic eruptions.[1] There is no consensus what the phenomenon causes are, or even whether it is a single phenomenon or several.

I don't know about the before earthquake stuff but everything else looks like transformers blowing all over the grid, which would be expected

Hosix · Sep 19, 2021

Masakari said:
Did you know that in the 90s, the Air Force attributed the "bodies recovered" at the Roswell (1947) site to Project High Dive, which didn't start until 1953?

Annie Jacobsen has a good take on this. I am trying to find it. It had to do with Russia dropping a craft loaded with retarded midgets. Serious.

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