War with Syria

Nimchammund_sl

shitlord
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Amir Mizroch, Israeli Journalist withIsrael Hayomhas a twitter message suggesting strikes to begin Saturday as soon as U.N. Inspectors leave so Assad cannot use them as human shields. Also, that the strikes to end on Wednesday when Obama meets with Putin. Lastly, that Israel has warned Syria that if Syria strikes Israel, Israel will topple the Assad regime.
 

Tuco

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reason 1.) 93,000 people died to conventional weapons but ~500-3,000 total people in all the gas attacks combined dead, yeah they are really WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION.
I feel like this fact needs to be said more. It reminds me of the gun control fights that involve assault weapon bans.
 

khalid

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It comes from the belief that military and other punitive action enhances security across the board and therefore enhances the wider interests of a given nation or nations.
Sure, but how does that coincide with people that were against the Iraq war but for this? People that were for both of them make sense to me. The arguments are close to the same, though the arguments if anything were STRONGER in the case of the Iraq war.
 

Numbers_sl

shitlord
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I don't think anyone is worried about how easy it would be to topple the Assad regime. It's what comes after that that concerns people.
 

khalid

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This shit in Syria is being marketed a zillion times worse. We weren't attacked, there isn't any concern about an imminent threat to the United States, it's a civil war and our involvement is going to require the direct or indirect aiding of Al-Qaeda allied forces, and the region really is chained together in a fashion not entirely dissimilar to pre-WW1 Europe. I don't see any short term gains. The long term gains are an oil pipeline for European interests, weakening an enemy of Israel, and weakening Iran for a possible future conflict. Obama is doing a right shitty job of selling this war. I need to hear more than this is about helping people.

Sell me on this. Make me believe.
Yeah, pretty much this.
 

Numbers_sl

shitlord
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Sure, but how does that coincide with people that were against the Iraq war but for this? People that were for both of them make sense to me. The arguments are close to the same, though the arguments if anything were STRONGER in the case of the Iraq war.
Maybe you're hung up on the time difference between use and intervention in both scenarios.
 

khalid

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Maybe you're hung up on the time difference between use and intervention in both scenarios.
Maybe. Or maybe I'm hung on up the idiocy of a president who campaigned constantly on how bad the Iraq war was trying to use the very same arguments to get us into another conflict.
 
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Comparing Syria to Iraq at this point is a little premature. It seems pretty unlikely that the US response will be anything beyond a missile strike. Personally I lean towards the side of those who want the US to keep out of this, but if Obama wants to lob a cruise missile through Maher Assad's bedroom window I'm not going to lose much sleep over it.
 

Beef Supreme_sl

shitlord
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Syria was a foregone conclusion after 9/11. All this is leading to is war with Iran, which is the real prize. Our friendly Sunni oil mongers want nothing more than to spread the gulf flavor of Islam and need the Shia Iranians to be gone.

What I am really hoping for is that those S-300 SAM Russian techs are legit and knock out some significant US/GB/FR assets. The US military power is a paper tiger. Russia needs only to return serve after the initial salvo(s) from The Good Guys.
 

Numbers_sl

shitlord
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Maybe. Or maybe I'm hung on up the idiocy of a president who campaigned constantly on how bad the Iraq war was trying to use the very same arguments to get us into another conflict.
I thought it was talk of nuclear material that got people riled up after the presentation on mobile chemical weapons factories at the UN wasn't the smoking gun.
 

Gravel

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I don't think anyone is worried about how easy it would be to topple the Assad regime. It's what comes after that that concerns people.
Pretty much. Not even really that concerned about Russia. Mostly about what some retarded small player does which gets everyone dragged into a shit show. It has the potential to spiral out of control very fast the second we get involved. And it doesn't present any positives to the United States. Maybe our interests (Israel, which I'm getting fucking tired of), but nothing for us directly.

Syria was a foregone conclusion after 9/11. All this is leading to is war with Iran, which is the real prize. Our friendly Sunni oil mongers want nothing more than to spread the gulf flavor of Islam and need the Shia Iranians to be gone.

What I am really hoping for is that those S-300 SAM Russian techs are legit and knock out some significant US/GB/FR assets. The US military power is a paper tiger. Russia needs only to return serve after the initial salvo(s) from The Good Guys.
You trolling? Or just an asshole?
 

Tuco

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What I am really hoping for is that those S-300 SAM Russian techs are legit and knock out some significant US/GB/FR assets. The US military power is a paper tiger. Russia needs only to return serve after the initial salvo(s) from The Good Guys.
I'd feel confident in betting on the US military's ability to destroy those missile systems if they were present. I don't know what significant assets you expect SAMs to knock out.
 

W4RH34D_sl

shitlord
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If the US ever learned to do shit without talking about it, we could just carpet bomb the fuck out of them with a total media blackout. Dirty job done.
 

Eomer

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The US could steamroll the Syrian missile defenses in a couple days. But it's modern enough that there might be a few losses. And yeah, I don't really see what SAMs are going to do about Tomahawks. I don't think that Syria has any defense against those.
 

fanaskin

Well known agitator
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Vietnamese article ( have Google translate) on the S-300 capabilities in wartime, specifically looking at if it could down a tomahawk missile, the AA missile is faster than all known fighter jets so it should be able to strike them if it can get a lock.

If S-300, Syria enough to cope with Tomahawk?

"Earlier this month 8/2013, the company producing S-300 to Syria has announced plans postponed delivery systems for Syria to May 6/2014 although production has finished."
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update: apparently the S-300's weakness is low flying missiles like the tomahawk, but the Pantsir-S1 can fill the role of low flying missile killer and Syria has those.

There aren't THAT many targets in Syria, so setting up a defense grid shouldn't that hard because the country basically exists as a half circle around the edges of the borders following the rivers, while the whole south east of the country is desert.