Wildstar Launch Thread - Server: Stormtalon | Faction: Dominion

Well, I cancelled today. Got Spellslinger to 41 and Stalker to 26. Just couldn't get up the energy to even log in and level to 50 anymore. I'm just not having any fun. I love the IP, the combat, the art style, and the idea, but it just feel flat. I prefer slow leveling games normally, but it needs to feel meaningful, not just a grind for the sake of grinding without any real rewards or goals in sight. At this point I don't feel ANY incentive to continue leveling except to finish the current zone so I can see the next one, which I will probably hate anyways (will probably be another fucking blue-green jungle). I also did not intend to do any raiding and don't really PvP. Maybe that is why I had no goals/objectives, but at least in other games I would look forward to gear sets or weapons or epic quests or new dungeons to tackle etc. Some sort of treadmill or objective to work for. This game just feels like there is nothing worth the grind of dull quests in dull zones. Like even when I see blue quest rewards or blue drops I don't even get an ounce of excitement. I couldn't tell you what half my gear slots are. I also got turned off by the whole "too fucking hardcore for school" approach they decided to take at the 11th hour. I like raiding, and I like challenges, but I do feel there should be systems in place for all types of subscribers and not just your elitist hardcore. It would be like if WoW cut out all raids except hardcore dungeons. Yes 5% of your most vocal population would scream for joy, but the silent majority that just plays without talking or ranting much will bail faster than the bitches on the titanic. And yes it is fun to call people who cannot raid 30+ hours a week filthy casuals to inflate epeens, but in the business sense, it is MMO suicide as Carbine is finding out now. And having super fucking long dungeons is gay as hell. It's one thing to have challenges, or hard modes etc, but I don't even queue for dungeons anymore because I know with the average players, it will probably take 3-4 hours to clear 1 fucking dungeon and I just cannot dedicate a chunk of time like that without pauses and hope that a healer/tank doesn't bail and waste my last 3 hours.

It also doesn't help I don't have a guild either, and maybe I am just getting too old for this shit, but I hate sitting on vent/mumble/ts and talking when my family is around me, and all the guilds on my server require that shit for general use even, not just raids. At least on my older games I was in mature but casual guilds that didn't dedicate tons of hours to raiding, but when they did raid once or twice a week they could get shit done, and didn't require vent unless we were raiding. Anyways, I just can't place my finger on it, but coming from a fairly skilled veteran gamer who just doesn't have the time to dedicate to scheduled raiding anymore, the game just has no real life or mini goals or anything to really aim for. I still have time in the evenings to get on and do shit and feel like I am accomplishing something, but this game does not provide that. And yes, maybe this game isn't for me, which it obviously isn't if I am cancelling, but Carbine is a good bunch of dudes, and I want them to succeed and unfortunately there are many other gamers out there like me who they are losing business from because they do not want to provide a service for us for the sake of The VisionT. Hence why servers are all low pop and they are giving out free trials like candy now. They will backtrack soon I am sure but it will be too little too late at that point. This is a good lesson on why you don't always give the players what they want or listen to your 5% vocal minority.

Hopefully one of these years maybe we will get an MMO that isn't about "raiding" but about the whole game being an equal RPG experience like EQ was. To me my best memories of EQ were leveling and shit that happened while I was leveling. I remember doing raids while leveling up even. Like fucking Vox and Naggy experiencing for the first time when no one knew shit about what to expect except that you gathered up 50 random scrubs and went to slay teh dragon and probably lost 3 levels in the process! And you had fucking player ran bazaars, dungeon camps for rare items that actually felt worthwhile, epic quests, etc etc. Yes I sound like the EQ neckbeards, but this themepark quest grind shit to get to raiding which is 90% of what your game is, isn't even RPG anymore, it is as someone said above, a raiding simulator. That said, I'm going back to FFXIV.

To sum it up, I may be a filthy casual but Wildstar is like a carrot on a stick and they forgot the carrot but they sure have a pretty stick with nice combat. And lots of ball smashing raids if thats all you want out of a game.

I got totally burn out couple weeks ago, and I have been raiding since January. So in my case, the experience as a whole was a bit different than most of you.

I don't disagree. I liked datacubes. The fact you found them in odd/interesting points and they told you a story with VO was very nice.

I mean the fact that there's not a huge backstory/books (in real life) for this stuff... yet. They released lore stories and comics and stuff, but not the historical base that FF or WoW had to work off of.

Voldeth_sl said:

Much to my anger. I will never forgive or forget the great Datacube dabacle of Stormtalon, Cinge.

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I require this story in embarassing detail. You owe it to the rest of us!

When I first started playing WoW in '04, I joined up with the original guild I was with on Fennin Ro that I hadnt been with since mid 2000. First raid I go on with them in BRD of all places, the guild leader is screaming like a little girl cause someone pulled a Leeroy. Left the guild later that night and went back to the forum guild. Id rather bust my balls raiding with people that are agreeable then be with a couple good friends and a guild leader that nerd rages. I cant believe I spent almost 2 years with that guild leader in EQ and never knew what kind of person he was till I joined Voice Chat with them for the first time. Ive been in couple games with different guilds where the guild leader/officers are condescending to every new member, but even that is rare. Most guilds Ive joined though, have been pretty tight.

Xevy_sl said:

I'll just cut through the fluff:

If you're casual
If you're bad
If you want lore
If you want a sandbox
If you ONLY do PVP

This isn't your game.

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I know thats not true on several points from first hand experience. The game doesnt offer a lot to do (there isnt any old content to dive into), but a casual can make good headway in this game. If the player is truly a casual, then they wouldnt have been 50 for very long. Even this late into the release. A bad player still has plenty to do and can still progress. I actually enjoyed the lore, as well as others apparently. Its been established its a theme park mmo. PVP has some major love coming from what I can tell, so there goes that. For you to compile a list like that seems very narrow minded, elitist and makes the game sound terrible.

Or... If its truly like that, and Im just full of shit, then I'll have to agree about the outlook of Wildstar.

Rogosh_sl said:

The game at 50 becomes everything that sucks about wow, daily rep grind and elder gem(valor) farm. I will say this about most themepark mmos, you need to make logging in and playing your game fun. Repeating the same dailies every day is not fun.

Give me a game with open dungeons, and items where rare drops for crafting come off rare spawns. In essence give me a sandbox that actually has content for pve intermixxed with its pvp.

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I haven't grinded a god damn thing in weeks. Not sure why you think you need to.

Unsubbed for a little while until more content is released. I had fun with the leveling game, but there is just something about daily quests that kill my motivation to log in. Thankfully I did stock up on some CREDD while it was still 2 platinum.

On a side note - Divinity Original Sin is stealing my soul the last few days. Such a great game.

aevry_sl said:

On a side note - Divinity Original Sin is stealing my soul the last few days. Such a great game.

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I can believe devs overlooked games like Divinity Original Sin. DOS must've made some money. It makes you wonder what else they are overlooking.

To get back on topic, what do you all think of Wildstar now? It's been a month or two since release. End game okay?

Stave_sl said:

Spoiler

Well, I cancelled today. Got Spellslinger to 41 and Stalker to 26. Just couldn't get up the energy to even log in and level to 50 anymore. I'm just not having any fun. I love the IP, the combat, the art style, and the idea, but it just feel flat. I prefer slow leveling games normally, but it needs to feel meaningful, not just a grind for the sake of grinding without any real rewards or goals in sight. At this point I don't feel ANY incentive to continue leveling except to finish the current zone so I can see the next one, which I will probably hate anyways (will probably be another fucking blue-green jungle). I also did not intend to do any raiding and don't really PvP. Maybe that is why I had no goals/objectives, but at least in other games I would look forward to gear sets or weapons or epic quests or new dungeons to tackle etc. Some sort of treadmill or objective to work for. This game just feels like there is nothing worth the grind of dull quests in dull zones. Like even when I see blue quest rewards or blue drops I don't even get an ounce of excitement. I couldn't tell you what half my gear slots are. I also got turned off by the whole "too fucking hardcore for school" approach they decided to take at the 11th hour. I like raiding, and I like challenges, but I do feel there should be systems in place for all types of subscribers and not just your elitist hardcore. It would be like if WoW cut out all raids except hardcore dungeons. Yes 5% of your most vocal population would scream for joy, but the silent majority that just plays without talking or ranting much will bail faster than the bitches on the titanic. And yes it is fun to call people who cannot raid 30+ hours a week filthy casuals to inflate epeens, but in the business sense, it is MMO suicide as Carbine is finding out now. And having super fucking long dungeons is gay as hell. It's one thing to have challenges, or hard modes etc, but I don't even queue for dungeons anymore because I know with the average players, it will probably take 3-4 hours to clear 1 fucking dungeon and I just cannot dedicate a chunk of time like that without pauses and hope that a healer/tank doesn't bail and waste my last 3 hours.

It also doesn't help I don't have a guild either, and maybe I am just getting too old for this shit, but I hate sitting on vent/mumble/ts and talking when my family is around me, and all the guilds on my server require that shit for general use even, not just raids. At least on my older games I was in mature but casual guilds that didn't dedicate tons of hours to raiding, but when they did raid once or twice a week they could get shit done, and didn't require vent unless we were raiding. Anyways, I just can't place my finger on it, but coming from a fairly skilled veteran gamer who just doesn't have the time to dedicate to scheduled raiding anymore, the game just has no real life or mini goals or anything to really aim for. I still have time in the evenings to get on and do shit and feel like I am accomplishing something, but this game does not provide that. And yes, maybe this game isn't for me, which it obviously isn't if I am cancelling, but Carbine is a good bunch of dudes, and I want them to succeed and unfortunately there are many other gamers out there like me who they are losing business from because they do not want to provide a service for us for the sake of The Vision?. Hence why servers are all low pop and they are giving out free trials like candy now. They will backtrack soon I am sure but it will be too little too late at that point. This is a good lesson on why you don't always give the players what they want or listen to your 5% vocal minority.

Hopefully one of these years maybe we will get an MMO that isn't about "raiding" but about the whole game being an equal RPG experience like EQ was. To me my best memories of EQ were leveling and shit that happened while I was leveling. I remember doing raids while leveling up even. Like fucking Vox and Naggy experiencing for the first time when no one knew shit about what to expect except that you gathered up 50 random scrubs and went to slay teh dragon and probably lost 3 levels in the process! And you had fucking player ran bazaars, dungeon camps for rare items that actually felt worthwhile, epic quests, etc etc. Yes I sound like the EQ neckbeards, but this themepark quest grind shit to get to raiding which is 90% of what your game is, isn't even RPG anymore, it is as someone said above, a raiding simulator. That said, I'm going back to FFXIV.

To sum it up, I may be a filthy casual but Wildstar is like a carrot on a stick and they forgot the carrot but they sure have a pretty stick with nice combat. And lots of ball smashing raids if thats all you want out of a game.

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I could have written that, word for word. Agree 100%. As much as I enjoyed the combat system, the rest of the game is bizarre: quests bloat was the major turnoff, especially since zero fucks are given about 99% of the quests, while for example in SWtoR, the filler ones are few and the main ones on each planet are entertaining and interesting (and the class story is amazing) and the game is far from perfect.
I wouldn't mind playing a little bit of Wildstar every now and then, but since it competes for my monthly sub with other games, it doesn't win and stays where it is: unused and unplayed.

Stave_sl said:

Anyways, I just can't place my finger on it, but coming from a fairly skilled veteran gamer who just doesn't have the time to dedicate to scheduled raiding anymore, the game just has no real life or mini goals or anything to really aim for. I still have time in the evenings to get on and do shit and feel like I am accomplishing something, but this game does not provide that.

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Yep.

I enjoyed the game but did not enjoy the sensation of no forward progress. Tradeskill wise it was waiting around for daily chits in order to open up recipes to open up recipes to maybe get what I wanted in a month or two. I'm okay with daily quests for faction, but I was not okay with logging on to do daily quest and then sitting around waiting for the daily quest to be ready for me. The randomness in spawn times for the bird plus no one actually trying to win the tower defense event meant usually an hour a day just sitting around waiting for content. While I thankfully got all the items I needed from Adventures prior to the Gold loot change, I was stuck in a perpetual loop with Dungeons as group finder groups simply failed them constantly and there was no loot that could help turn that around from the bosses themselves.

In other games players collectively managed to outgear problems and thus make slow but steady progress until PUGs could reasonably clear the dungeon content. Not so in Wildstar as people who were coordinated or organized enough to clear the content did so pretty quickly and then never went back. Making it completely about execution is a bold statement from a gaming perspective, but this also means that you can easily halt all forward progression. If I had made it through the silver dungeons I would probably still be playing and making sure to do daily things and stay ready for raiding even if I did not have enough free time to be guaranteed a raid slot. Instead I just stopped playing and unsubbed.

Im kinda wondering if this isn't going to bite them in the ass as hardcore players continue forward with CREDD based accounts acquired from more casual players who then leave the game. If I were Carbine I would look very carefully at the sales of new CREDD as a precursor metric for subscription retention

Tearofsoul_sl said:

I got totally burn out couple weeks ago, and I have been raiding since January. So in my case, the experience as a whole was a bit different than most of you.

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DnT did good my chinese Wakandan, tell Phrenetik and your people I said hi. I hope we are all reuinted one day maybe in the next EQ, young Szeth included.

Qhue_sl said:

I enjoyed the game but did not enjoy the sensation of no forward progress. Tradeskill wise it was waiting around for daily chits in order to open up recipes to open up recipes to maybe get what I wanted in a month or two. I'm okay with daily quests for faction, but I was not okay with logging on to do daily quest and then sitting around waiting for the daily quest to be ready for me. The randomness in spawn times for the bird plus no one actually trying to win the tower defense event meant usually an hour a day just sitting around waiting for content. While I thankfully got all the items I needed from Adventures prior to the Gold loot change, I was stuck in a perpetual loop with Dungeons as group finder groups simply failed them constantly and there was no loot that could help turn that around from the bosses themselves.

In other games players collectively managed to outgear problems and thus make slow but steady progress until PUGs could reasonably clear the dungeon content. Not so in Wildstar as people who were coordinated or organized enough to clear the content did so pretty quickly and then never went back. Making it completely about execution is a bold statement from a gaming perspective, but this also means that you can easily halt all forward progression. If I had made it through the silver dungeons I would probably still be playing and making sure to do daily things and stay ready for raiding even if I did not have enough free time to be guaranteed a raid slot. Instead I just stopped playing and unsubbed.

Im kinda wondering if this isn't going to bite them in the ass as hardcore players continue forward with CREDD based accounts acquired from more casual players who then leave the game. If I were Carbine I would look very carefully at the sales of new CREDD as a precursor metric for subscription retention

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Something that WoW had that very few games since haven't is how willing are you to create alts. If the initial go round feels like a grind or if you don't feel you are progressing enough on your main character, then what motivation is there to run through the leveling content again on an alt. I think the only way you can continue to keep leveling content (dungeons/etc) relevant is either have a stead stream of new players entering the game or have your current players get to end game that reroll through the content that's already there.

Vandyn_sl said:

Everyone constantly brings up Dark Souls as proof there is a sizeable amount of people who will play this type of game but that all goes out the window when the difficulty of content is not based on your skill level, but the skill level of 5 other (more than likely) strangers.

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Thing is, the comparison is not even apt. Wildstar is balls easy for 50 levels and then hits a 'wall'. The wall is not even that massive, but it definitely is a different flavor from playing a single player ez mode questing game to being thrown into group content with very little upgrades or sense of progress. Dark Souls was satisfying because the skill curve was reversed, it was hard and you 'got better' and then felt like a bad ass.

Anyone playing 1-50 and then starting 50 attunement is right to feel like it's two separate games. The fact that there aren't meaningful things to do at 50 other than try to attune to raid (dungeon sets, world rares, etc) is kind of shitty. 0 commitment 'LFD' style grouping tools also take a huge stinking shit right on top of the community and just further push WoW's 'my guild are the only people on the server' anti-social mentality. I feel like any game with that stupid mechanic needs to spend as much time developing social tools to not only find people guilds, but help them to 'alliance' their shitty 5 friend guilds with other guilds so they can actually do something.

aevry_sl said:

Unsubbed for a little while until more content is released. I had fun with the leveling game, but there is just something about daily quests that kill my motivation to log in. Thankfully I did stock up on some CREDD while it was still 2 platinum.

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Friendly tip: Credds expire after a couple of months or so.

Itzena_sl said:

Friendly tip: Credds expire after a couple of months or so.

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LOL. So they do, 3 months without an active subscription and your CREDD are gone. Kind of a crock of shit but hell, I guess they need to make money somehow.

Krassus_sl said:

DnT did good my chinese Wakandan, tell Phrenetik and your people I said hi. I hope we are all reuinted one day maybe in the next EQ, young Szeth included.

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Only a good MMO could united old players nowadays. I am on the same boat with you, I need something special god damn it.

I have so very little hope for anything breathtaking from the MMOsphere these days.

Tearofsoul_sl said:

Only a good MMO could united old players nowadays. I am on the same boat with you, I need something special god damn it.

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You just sell all your credd for plat and then buy more credd when you return, sure it costs ya 15 bucks but hey its probably worth it if you are coming back anyways.

Tearofsoul_sl said:

Only a good MMO could united old players nowadays. I am on the same boat with you, I need something special god damn it.

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Szeth_sl said:

I have so very little hope for anything breathtaking from the MMOsphere these days.

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Dakim & some of us were saying the same thing last night, we're all just spread out playing random shit once again. Every MMO now we've become part of the one month crowd we used to despise. We'll see with the EQN Alpha but who the hell knows, Wildstar was the coming of jesus during raid testing.