Falstaff
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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World of Warcraft: Season of Discovery
- Thread starter Jasker
- Start date
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Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!
Go here and give us your nominations!Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
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I gotta admit it almost sounds fun to dick around with how OP you could get with this stuff. Warrior especially, if all those enrage effects stack. Anyone remember 40% enrage instead of the limpdick 25%? Well that was considered too OP by a lot, and therefor nerfed (around the end of BWL iirc?) But if this shit stacks we're talking 75%, or 95% if it stacks with death wish.
Granted they're also talking about dicking around with itemization? Correct me if I'm wrong on that one. They'd need to, or everyone's getting wrekt by Arc Reaper warriors without about 50% more stamina on items. I'm not sure even Hunters or Rogues got anything like a damage boost like that.
That said, it's tempting... until I remember it's yet another run through Vanilla, and MC, and BWL, and the AQ gates event.... UUUUGGGGGH.
Lemme dig up the post I made about 4 years ago about what Blizz should do if they wanted to get people hyped.
Granted they're also talking about dicking around with itemization? Correct me if I'm wrong on that one. They'd need to, or everyone's getting wrekt by Arc Reaper warriors without about 50% more stamina on items. I'm not sure even Hunters or Rogues got anything like a damage boost like that.
That said, it's tempting... until I remember it's yet another run through Vanilla, and MC, and BWL, and the AQ gates event.... UUUUGGGGGH.
Lemme dig up the post I made about 4 years ago about what Blizz should do if they wanted to get people hyped.
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No need to go through all that shit.. Enjoy it for a month or so on each phase and bounce. If I hop in that will be my plan.
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Cinge
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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This. No reason to take it so serious or let it become your only game/life. Log in , mess around, have some fun if there is fun to be had, log out. Everyone always trying to make the next game/idea a multi year commitment that you have to log into every day for hours. Exert some self control.
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Here's the post I made back when: World of Warcraft: Classic
Idea still holds up IMO. I doubt Blizz would be even able to do it these days though, no talent left at that company from all outward appearances.
Idea still holds up IMO. I doubt Blizz would be even able to do it these days though, no talent left at that company from all outward appearances.
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Masakari
Which way, western man?
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Man that Faction/Server split in the poll doesn't look convincing lol.
PVP should be most desirable since dicking around each phase will be boring just running limited PVE content.
Might roll a disc priest since I love killing people with Penance.
Kind of gay they aren't giving druids Starfall right now though.
PVP should be most desirable since dicking around each phase will be boring just running limited PVE content.
Might roll a disc priest since I love killing people with Penance.
Kind of gay they aren't giving druids Starfall right now though.
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are we sure starsurge isn't just a reworked/renamed starfall? It's hard to tell exactly how all the rune abilities will actually work until we see it in game.
Lambourne
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Yeah, I think we're talking about different things. You're right in that class balance is skewed towards dps warriors. I don't think that type of class balance issue is a critical problem because nothing in classic is tuned tight enough that you need to stack warriors in order to beat the encounter.
I think that players largely have themselves to blame for it too, because many dps players only chase higher numbers on warcraftlogs and gravitate towards whichever spec gives them that. If they buff ret paladins too much, all of those players will be playing ret in a month or two. Beat the boss, get the loot should be the standard of success, not whether you did it 10 seconds faster than some random guild you never heard of on a server you don't play on, but that is exactly what the warcraftlogs meta makes players do. They're obsessed with having every single world buff for the same reason.
I was more referring to not being able to find a tank for your dungeon, which will actually prevent you from doing the dungeon (instead of just doing it 10% slower with non-optimal dps classes). To fix that, what you need is a tank class that is fun to play, classic lacks those. If shamans can now tank but are just as frustrating to play as a prot warrior, then it solves nothing because people still won't want to do it. Same argument can be made for healers, although I think that if you make tanks better, you help healers too because they won't have to constantly juggle heals as mobs ping-pong all over.
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Szeth
Trakanon Raider
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I only did it for a few fights (four horseman etc) in classic, but when I was fury tanking stuff like ZG it was very fun. That is definitely when outgearing the content though. Mousewheeling cleave I’m ZG and being top dps and tank was great fun.
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To your second point, you are crazy. Prot Warrior was very fun to play. Fury Prot (which is what was required to raid tank horde side due to dps/threat) was also fun but for a different type of play. The class being fun was never the problem. Now the role of tanking is not something everyone enjoys doing, but there's nothing you can do about that while maintaining a compelling game experience. There's other games that just use a "tank" button, you turn on an ability and you are tanking, just sitting there doing your DPS rotation. no thought or effort required. Those games are boring AF.
Tanks were hard to find for dungeons the same reason healers were: You only had 1 spec, and to be viable at it you had to spec in to it. Nobody levels as fucking prot because you level dogshit slow compared to leveling as DPS. same as pure heals. Every single dungeon experience sub-30 was done with an off tank and/or off heal, that is a dps war equipping a shield and a dps healing. After 30 or so it became more difficult (but not impossible) to run content with off specs so you sat around waiting for someone who was actually a Tank or actually a healer and that's why there was lack of tanks and healers.
Making respecing cheap/free is a nice start, but since you can only do that in towns it is somewhat limited. They discussed giving us dual spec as well, but again that only helps the existing tank (warrior) and heal classes (priest/druid/shm/pal). Giving more classes tank/heal "runes" that are instantly swappable in the field without having to also worry about talents allows you to level as a DPS class but when needed, swap in a few OP tank/heal runes and become a tank/healer. now 5 DPS can run content and aren't sitting around twittling their thumbs for hours outside uldaman waiting for the right class to show up.
To your first point. Partly right, you didn't absolutely need to stack warriors, but once again you are trying to fight human nature, people are always going to see effectiveness/efficiency/etc its the path of least resistance. But on the other hand, you are waaaaaay off, like an order of magnitude, on the differences in effectiveness. It wasn't just some -2 seconds on warcraft logs clear speed.
top end rogues did 75% of the damage of warriors and had none of the utility, you know, the ability to swap gear and be a tank on shit like 4 horsemen? Average rogue more like 50% of the damage of a warrior.
Mages; in the later content after everything stopped being immune to fire, there were some fights where mechanics allowed mages to shine and you could get away with bringing more than 1 mage.
All other DPS classes did 20-25% of the damage of a warrior. We're talking #1 world ranked doing 700-800 dps vs the 2400 dps of a warrior.
You weren't saving just 10 seconds, 10 seconds per trash pack maybe. You were saving minutes/hours.
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Tholan
Blackwing Lair Raider
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People like me who liked to tank in classic would have loved more incentive to run dungeons more than once. More quests, better loot, more than a chance to get maybe 1 useful item would have been nice. Also, travelling to the places was a pain in the ass cause travel sucked ass.
But i do agree that tank were half assed. I do remember that on this very board (well, original foh), someone pointed out to furor that the more block chance you stack, the less rage you generate, actually punishing you for getting better gear. They added rage generation when you block after that.
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Jasker
something
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Raiding is one of the main reasons why I play.
I get the take of not wanting to do certain raids or raiding it for the 10th time though
Lightning Lord Rule
BoozeCube
. And certain things like BWL trash and AQ trash can get a bit tedious?
Lightning Lord Rule
Appreciate you contributing to this thread! IMO if warriors are too busted beyond their already busted status in Classic+ they will likely get patched out as I'm sure balancing will be at the forefront for what /appears/ to be a more caring development team.
(Likely backfiring into warriors sucking but not sure how possible that is with cleave and HS off global)
There is a post on some other forum which shall not be named that has a comprehensive list of interviews, breakdowns, and dev contributions and it at least appears they moderately care about this new product...hic!
I get the take of not wanting to do certain raids or raiding it for the 10th time though
Lightning Lord Rule
BoozeCube
. And certain things like BWL trash and AQ trash can get a bit tedious?
Lightning Lord Rule
Appreciate you contributing to this thread! IMO if warriors are too busted beyond their already busted status in Classic+ they will likely get patched out as I'm sure balancing will be at the forefront for what /appears/ to be a more caring development team.(Likely backfiring into warriors sucking but not sure how possible that is with cleave and HS off global)
There is a post on some other forum which shall not be named that has a comprehensive list of interviews, breakdowns, and dev contributions and it at least appears they moderately care about this new product...hic!
