Breaking Bad

Chukzombi · Sep 16, 2013

Drtyrm_sl said:
Lot of focus on the earlier part of the series and not much said about Walt killing Mike and then ordering the murder of all the prisoners. Damn that Jesse!

Also, FYI, this thread was pretty calm and insult free before a_skeleton_03 showed up. Chuk has had great posts and commentary here.

thanks but you dont need to be a stinky pete and badger a brudda!

Burnem Wizfyre · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
That's where I get off the crazy8 train with you. They've taken pains to show how Walt's flaws and lust for power/something undefined go way back. Throughout this show we watched him comfortably settle in to the position of meth dealing badass, much more quickly than should be possible even for someone with his illness. He was able to handle himself well in situation where even Jesse, with actual experience dealing with these crackheads, was way out of his depth. Walt let people die, poisoned, murdered, did whatever he had to do, and he did it byhis own choice.

You are failing to realize that Jesse put him in those positions and Walt chose what he chose on his own making him the monster that he became, Walt had it in him, Jesse brought it out.

Lithose · Sep 16, 2013

BurnemWizfyre_sl said:
You are failing to realize that Jesse put him in those positions and Walt chose what he chose on his own making him the monster that he became, Walt had it in him, Jesse brought it out.

Bingo. People talk about it like Walt drug Jesse into depths he couldn't handle.....but therealitywas that it wasJesse'sconnections that pulled Walt into situations where he discovered he COULD handle (Again, Jesse's previous relationship with Krazy, brought Krazy to Walt's doorstep). The presence of some kind of ability to do evil doesnotmake one evil, Chaos--just because Walt had the ability, doesn't mean he is worse or better than Jesse, it just means he had the ability. Actions are what people are judged by. Walt's actions did make him evil,just as Jesse's actions did. Jesse used Walt as a shield to protect himself as he flew way to close to the sun, and then he blamed Walt for keeping them alive. It's the ultimate hypocrisy.

As burnem said, the difference is Walt accepted who he was. Jesse, despite his speech to the addicts, did not and just called Walt a monster (Again, even though he used that monster to keep himself alive.)

chaos · Sep 16, 2013

BurnemWizfyre_sl said:
You are failing to realize that Jesse put him in those positions and Walt chose what he chose on his own making him the monster that he became, Walt had it in him, Jesse brought it out.

Jesse didn't bring it out, being in the situations brought it out. Jesse didn't put him in those situations, he made a choice to be there. Fucked up as Jesse may be, he is not the cipher that solves Breaking Bad. They're all bad, not just Jesse.

Lithose · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
Jesse didn't put him in those situations, he made a choice to be there..

Zimmerman made a choice to pull dat trigger! Its murder!Christ. Context matters, Chaos.

Burnem Wizfyre · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
Jesse didn't bring it out, being in the situations brought it out. Jesse didn't put him in those situations, he made a choice to be there. Fucked up as Jesse may be, he is not the cipher that solves Breaking Bad. They're all bad, not just Jesse.

That is bullshit and you know it.

Cantatus · Sep 16, 2013

Just finished the episode... I think that's the best damn hour of television I've ever sat through.

Chukzombi · Sep 16, 2013

Can we just agree that jesse and walt are both normal people who turned into terrible people who have committed terrible acts and drop the argument?

Tuco · Sep 16, 2013

Yeah I don't even know what Chaos and Lithose are arguing. Do either of them think that Walt or Jesse are good people? They're both the tragic protagonists in the story, one is misled by his emotions and the other by his hubris.

This was a fucking great episode though.

Next academy awards:

list of people who underestimated Walt:

@DeanNorris: On the plus side, God has a mineral collection that is off the hook!
https://twitter.com/deanjnorris/stat...24682162757632

chaos · Sep 16, 2013

Tuco_sl said:
Yeah I don't even know what Chaos and Lithose are arguing. Do either of them think that Walt or Jesse are good people? They're both the tragic protagonists in the story, one is misled by his emotions and the other by his hubris.

Basically yeah. I think we all agree on that, the only place I depart with Lithose is giving Walt a pass because of Jesse's stupidity.

Burnem Wizfyre · Sep 16, 2013

Tuco_sl said:
Yeah I don't even know what Chaos and Lithose are arguing. Do either of them think that Walt or Jesse are good people? They're both the tragic protagonists in the story, one is misled by his emotions and the other by his hubris.

This was a fucking great episode though.

Next academy awards:

list of people who underestimated Walt:

@DeanNorris: On the plus side, God has a mineral collection that is off the hook!
https://twitter.com/deanjnorris/stat...24682162757632

Chaos doesn't seem to be able to understand that Jesse has been at the center of all the evil Walt has committed, it has been Jesse's actions that has put Walt into the situation to do what he has done, it doesn't excuse Walt's actions. Walt's problems could have been solved by letting Jesse be killed instead of constantly saving his ass. On the flip side Jesse wouldn't have become the monster he became had Walt never approached him in regards to cooking meth, Jesse has always been a fuck up and his responses to Walt's saving them led him into a downward spiral causing even more problems for Walt and himself.

Burnem Wizfyre · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
Basically yeah. I think we all agree on that, the only place I depart with Lithose is giving Walt a pass because of Jesse's stupidity.

Wait does he? I don't think Lithose has given Walt a pass, he openly admits Walt is evil just as I do, but without Jesse, Walt doesn't do the shit we consider makes him a monster.

TrollfaceDeux · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
Basically yeah. I think we all agree on that, the only place I depart with Lithose is giving Walt a pass because of Jesse's stupidity.

Walt gets a pass cuz he mans up to the killings. Jesse doesn't and blames Walt for everything.

JESSE IS A PUSSY FAGGOt.

chaos · Sep 16, 2013

BurnemWizfyre_sl said:
Wait does he? I don't think Lithose has given Walt a pass, he openly admits Walt is evil just as I do, but without Jesse, Walt doesn't do the shit we consider makes him a monster.

One of the main things he did, letting Jane die, had nothing to do with Jesse. He did that. There's a lot of sht like that, but that comes to mind most often because of how cold it was, how detached Walt is as a person. Saying that just the existence of Jesse is the root of Walt's evil is fucking retarded. That shit was already there.

Tuco · Sep 16, 2013

chaos_sl said:
Basically yeah. I think we all agree on that, the only place I depart with Lithose is giving Walt a pass because of Jesse's stupidity.

Here's how I see it:

Chaos: "Walt is prideful to the point of being evil"
Chaos' strawman that Lithose built: "Jesse gets a pass because walt is evil."
Lithose: "Jesse is stupid to the point of being evil"
Lithose's strawman that Chaos built: "Walt gets a pass because Jesse is evil."

also:

Tuco · Sep 16, 2013

writer of this episode cameo:

walt and his pants from season one

chaos · Sep 16, 2013

I totally missed the pants and feel stupid for that.

Tuco · Sep 17, 2013

So who thinks what about the dog crossing the road at the end of the episode?

Is it an homage to the good the bad the ugly?
Is it a symbol for Walt being the rabid dog that is set free and becoming the lone wolf, able to now... jaywalk?
Did a mutt just run on the set?

Burnem Wizfyre · Sep 17, 2013

chaos_sl said:
One of the main things he did, letting Jane die, had nothing to do with Jesse. He did that. There's a lot of sht like that, but that comes to mind most often because of how cold it was, how detached Walt is as a person. Saying that just the existence of Jesse is the root of Walt's evil is fucking retarded. That shit was already there.

Think about that for a second, letting Jesse's girlfriend die had nothing to do with Jesse.

Alex · Sep 17, 2013

I feel like chaos misses how the story arrives to certain situations. Isn't it in that exact same episode that Jane blackmails Walter?

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