Butthurt white guys, an Asian virgin and an angry lesbian walk into a bar...

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

Jive Turkey_sl said:
Someone that has demonstrated they know nothing about the side they're debating against. Know thy enemy and all that bullshit

Yes, but you don't know anything about EITHER side. Which makes this pointless.

Cad · Jul 25, 2014

Mist_sl said:
I have literally no incentive to teach a cliffnotes version of 200-600 level psych courses to get you guys up to speed enough for this to be a real discussion. I'm going to get trolled either way. It's just not something I feel like doing. I would literally rather mow my lawn.

Basically this thread has turned into a bunch of people who know nothing about psychology OR neurobiology besides what a quick glance at google can tell them, versus someone that actually knows a lot about behavioral psychology, developmental psychology and educational psychology.

Mist, if you know so much about your subject, you ought to be able to express it. I may disagree with you from time to time but I do believe you think you know what you're talking about, I don't think you're trolling. Honestly you just suck ass at expressing your opinion or position in a coherent way so that we can understand it and process it. If you're so obviously right, it ought to be a slam dunk for your evidence.

Jive Turkey · Jul 25, 2014

Mist_sl said:
Yes, but you don't know anything about EITHER side. Which makes this pointless.

chimpanzees

iannis · Jul 25, 2014

Mist, when people say that they are full of shit.

This is an irrefutable conclusion drawn from behavioral science.

iannis · Jul 25, 2014

Trust me, it says it in the bible. It's somewhere in one of Pauls letters.

Trust me, I've seen the study. The math holds up.

iannis · Jul 25, 2014

The disturbing thing is that youactuallythink that's how it'ssupposedto work. That is way, way more disturbing than any particular thing you've actually claimed. Most of these absurd claims I could be persuaded to believe given moderately strong evidence.

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

Cad_sl said:
Mist, if you know so much about your subject, you ought to be able to express it. I may disagree with you from time to time but I do believe you think you know what you're talking about, I don't think you're trolling. Honestly you just suck ass at expressing your opinion or position in a coherent way so that we can understand it and process it. If you're so obviously right, it ought to be a slam dunk for your evidence.

It would make plenty of sense to anyone that had a basic understanding of modern psychology. I'm not going to explain the differences and intersections of 7 different major disciplines of psychology AND then go into how they interact with neurobiology.

Unlike physics or math, psychology doesn't really have first principles that you can build off of. It's got 5-7 different major frameworks all trying to compete to BE the first principles but. People within psychology don't agree on which of these frameworks is best as far as explanatory scope, but they do agree that behaviorism is the most testable and reproducible. The arguments against behaviorism frequently boil down to the fact that it's too testable, and too reductionist (which is exactly what you'd want if you were looking for a first principle.)

Heriotze · Jul 25, 2014

Cad_sl said:
Mist, if you know so much about your subject, you ought to be able to express it. I may disagree with you from time to time but I do believe you think you know what you're talking about, I don't think you're trolling. Honestly you just suck ass at expressing your opinion or position in a coherent way so that we can understand it and process it. If you're so obviously right, it ought to be a slam dunk for your evidence.

I think that she almost immediately said that she was trolling a few hundred pages ago. She did about twenty pages of no true scotsman.

Quaid · Jul 25, 2014

The real travesty here is that somehow we are all talking about psychology like it's a science at all.

iannis · Jul 25, 2014

Argument is not evidence.

Pretending that it is is actually not how clinical psychology works. That's how popular psychology works.

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

None of this argument even hasanythingto do with clinical psychology. Clinical psychology is the treatment of disorder. This is all academic psychology.

Lendarios · Jul 25, 2014

Jive Turkey_sl said:
I'm getting trolled, aren't I?

Just ask tanootard what a sexual taste is. Just ask him, it is inception levels of trolling.

Lendarios · Jul 25, 2014

Mist_sl said:
but they do agree that behaviorism is the most testable and reproducible. The arguments against behaviorism frequently boil down to the fact that it's too testable, and too reductionist (which is exactly what you'd want if you were looking for a first principle.)

The problem why we think is bullshit your argument, is because there has been evidence, arbitrary linked it, of it failing miserably, the kid with the botched penis. And also the empirical evidence and results done in 22 studies that showed a clear difference in high level cognitive functions, that fell along gender lines.
If we follow your position, is that as a society we have consistently trained our females to be dumb and not able to get to point A to point B.

Phazael · Jul 25, 2014

@lendarios-
That's exactly what she wants to be true because then she can go on playing the victim card and sucking the fun out of the rest of the world.

Famm · Jul 25, 2014

Quaid_sl said:
The real travesty here is that somehow we are all talking about psychology like it's a science at all.

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

Yeah, I have that on my office door, because I have a degree in stats.

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

lendarios_sl said:
The problem why we think is bullshit your argument, is because there has been evidence, arbitrary linked it, of it failing miserably, the kid with the botched penis. And also the empirical evidence and results done in 22 studies that showed a clear difference in high level cognitive functions, that fell along gender lines.
If we follow your position, is that as a society we have consistently trained our females to be dumb and not able to get to point A to point B.

I'm not following how one random outlier with a botched penis is proof or refutation of anything. The plural of anecdote is not data, and a singular anecdote is definitely not data.

As for your second point, not so much trained them to be dumb but certainly not incentivized them for acquiring practical, technical skills, while heavily incentivizing them for developing skills at emotional manipulation. Females have been manipulating males into protecting them for tens of thousnads of years most likely, so yeah, a little of it is probably biological, but most of it is social. If you ask me, society is, at its core, an inherently female construct. Men would have been perfectly happy hanging out in the jungle killing shit all day if women hadn't manipulated them into building a civilization to better protect the women and the offspring.

I have some cynical views.

Mist · Jul 25, 2014

Phazael_sl said:
@lendarios-
That's exactly what she wants to be true because then she can go on playing the victim card and sucking the fun out of the rest of the world.

It's not a victim card at all. Society is slightly more than half female, and they get more than half the blame. If mothers would stop teaching their daughters that the most important skill they can acquire in life is manipulating a man to give you what you want, then maybe they would start developing other useful skills instead.

Jais · Jul 25, 2014

...Ironing?

Arbitrary · Jul 25, 2014

Mist_sl said:
I'm not following how one random outlier with a botched penis is proof or refutation of anything. The plural of anecdote is not data, and a singular anecdote is definitely not data.

Do you think that if we took a bunch of 6 month old babies and reassigned their sexes using surgery and hormone therapy and raised them as that gender they would self-identify as that gender?

Butthurt white guys, an Asian virgin and an angry lesbian walk into a bar...

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