Dark Souls 2

Lithose · Feb 22, 2014

Hekotat_sl said:
I guess I'm a bad, I keep getting my shit pushed in by the giant knight in undead burg.

He's tough, later you can block him without a full stam drain and they are easy, or when you get really good at parries they are simple. But at the start they are hard because one fuck up and you're done, and you haven't got a "good feel" for parry times yet (Once you do, parrying because pretty simple.)

But, don't fight him. Just agro him with a bow, run up to the ladder leading up to the skeletons that throw the bombs and he will come stand like a dip shit below you (Knights can't climb). Then just kill him with fire bombs and arrows. On my first play through I actually got his sword, was awesome.

Quineloe · Feb 22, 2014

Vorph_sl said:
I think I'd rather just play offline and not waste my effigies on that.

Quineloe: Heater shield from the undead merchant for 1k souls is one of the best shields in the game. And I'd say the exact opposite about the eagle shield. It was great when it was 100% PDef, but after being nerfed to 95% it's garbage.

Why is it so bad to be hit for 5% (which is basically nothing) every time you block an attack? I used it until I had the tower shield and it worked great on Quelaag for example. Straight up tanked that ho.

Gecko_sl · Feb 22, 2014

Lithose_sl said:
He's tough, later you can block him without a full stam drain and they are easy, or when you get really good at parries they are simple. But at the start they are hard because one fuck up and you're done, and you haven't got a "good feel" for parry times yet (Once you do, parrying because pretty simple.)

Parry is one of those things I missed in my first play through. After I finished the game and actually did some research, and learned how to parry, the game became far, far simpler.

The allure of the game really is the surprize of the encounters and figuring out how to fight and play. Once I figured out the mechanics, the game went from brutal to trivial.

Vorph · Feb 22, 2014

Quineloe_sl said:
Why is it so bad to be hit for 5% (which is basically nothing) every time you block an attack? I used it until I had the tower shield and it worked great on Quelaag for example. Straight up tanked that ho.

Heh, Quelaag only has one attack that does a significant amount of physical damage, and only a couple of her attacks are even blockable at all. That's a fight where you throw the grass crest shield on your back and just go two-hand style because there's no point in trying to defend. Regardless, whatever you did to survive tanking her straight up had nothing to do with the eagle shield.

Eagle shield used to be great for killing titanite demons before they nerfed it. Even at 5% the damage still adds up annoyingly fast though, and the difference between 76 stability (silver knight shield) and 84 is practically nothing. Hell, even a 68 stability heater shield can block every attack without having its guard broken as long as you're not retarded about it.

Quineloe · Feb 22, 2014

Vorph_sl said:
Heh, Quelaag only has one attack that does a significant amount of physical damage, and only a couple of her attacks are even blockable at all. That's a fight where you throw the grass crest shield on your back and just go two-hand style because there's no point in trying to defend. Regardless, whatever you did to survive tanking her straight up had nothing to do with the eagle shield.

Eagle shield used to be great for killing titanite demons before they nerfed it. Even at 5% the damage still adds up annoyingly fast though, and the difference between 76 stability (silver knight shield) and 84 is practically nothing. Hell, even a 68 stability heater shield can block every attack without having its guard broken as long as you're not retarded about it.

The thing with that fight was, with me dancing in front of her face with a shield up all day, she only meleed.
Titanite demons also worked very well with eagle shield, maybe because I was also sporting full steel armor at +7 each the 5% wasn't enough to hurt me.

I know going 95% equip load super heavy is somehow looked down upon as being noob or what not, but don't say it doesn't work.

Vorph · Feb 22, 2014

Sure, it works.

I'm just saying that eagle shield is junk compared to any medium shield with 100% pdef and 68+ stability. Doesn't matter if you're not wearing any armor at all or if you're noobing it up in full Havel's, eagle shield shouldn't even be considered.

One of the best things about the heater shield is that you can stop at +14 and not miss out on a point of stability. One less titanite slab to worry about.

Hekotat · Feb 22, 2014

The last time I faced the black kniggit we battled for quite a long time and I got him to about half health, what kept fucking me is I still have that MMO mindset where I need to spam an attack so it will go off as soon as the first attack lands. If you click attack twice it actually attacks twice rather than it picking up my key press after the animation for the first attack is finished, so what end's up happening is I meant to just swing once and block but now I'm completely fucked and swinging for the fences when I want to be blocking. Once I can stop doing this I think the game will be much easier.

Raes · Feb 22, 2014

Lock on. Hold shield up. Circle. Get behind him. Lower shield. Attack. Do massive damage. Repeat.

Or this:

Dark Souls - Experts Guide to Parrying - YouTube

Gecko_sl · Feb 23, 2014

Hekotat_sl said:
The last time I faced the black kniggit we battled for quite a long time and I got him to about half health, what kept fucking me is I still have that MMO mindset where I need to spam an attack so it will go off as soon as the first attack lands. If you click attack twice it actually attacks twice rather than it picking up my key press after the animation for the first attack is finished, so what end's up happening is I meant to just swing once and block but now I'm completely fucked and swinging for the fences when I want to be blocking. Once I can stop doing this I think the game will be much easier.

The game rewards patience, but that was my biggest problem with Dark Souls. You can't interrupt an action. Once you start a swing, you can't suddenly block or roll. It's really one of the reasons the game is so frustrating.

On the flip side, now that I can parry pretty much anything on demand, I can rape the Black Knight with a level 1 character with no gear. It's also why I grew bored of the game. Well, that and I don't enjoy doing the same encounters over and over, and the PVP setup is just awful.

I really will be disappointed if Dark Souls 2 uses exactly the same mechanics as DS1.

Quineloe · Feb 23, 2014

Gecko_sl said:
The game rewards patience, but that was my biggest problem with Dark Souls. You can't interrupt an action. Once you start a swing, you can't suddenly block or roll. It's really one of the reasons the game is so frustrating.

On the flip side, now that I can parry pretty much anything on demand, I can rape the Black Knight with a level 1 character with no gear. It's also why I grew bored of the game. Well, that and I don't enjoy doing the same encounters over and over, and the PVP setup is just awful.

I really will be disappointed if Dark Souls 2 uses exactly the same mechanics as DS1.

That's why you fight click.....click.....click in Dark Souls.

clickclickclickclickclickclickclickclickclickclick clickclickclickclickclickclickclickclickclickclick is for boosting APM in Starcraft 2.

If the DS2 enemies have a few more moves available, that would help a lot. Most DS enemies just have attack once, twice, three times and four times, all of which is blocked by shield up.

Raes · Feb 24, 2014

Gecko_sl said:
I really will be disappointed if Dark Souls 2 uses exactly the same mechanics as DS1.

Well, it does. It's pretty much exactly the same game with slightly updated graphics. As far as combat, pretty much the same except parrying is slightly harder and the backstab animation is now retarded. Supposedly enemy AI is slightly improved, but I wouldn't expect too much from that.

Needless · Feb 24, 2014

You don't like the fact that if you swing a 200 pound sword you cut off the tail of a dragon that you can't stop the momentum mid swing?
come on man haha

So many nit picky complaints its hilarious. The souls series is fine, go play a different series if you don't enjoy it lol

supertouch_sl · Feb 24, 2014

Shortly after Dark Souls came out, some detractors claimed that a lot of the deaths in the game were "cheap" and cited examples like the Archers perched on that building in Anor Londo. First of all, am I the only person who didn't struggle on that part? Secondly, a cheap death is caused by a glitch or a random boulder falling from the sky just for the sake of impeding progress.

Needless · Feb 24, 2014

Those archers are there only for the sake of impeding progress though, I personally don't care as its expected in those games in my eyes heh
I'm surprised there aren't more of those situations to be honest

Quineloe · Feb 24, 2014

the archers were definitely pretty cheap. But that is the only example I can think of.

Everything else that feels cheap actually has a counter. people also claim they're easy, but most "walkthroughs" for archers do exactly what I do, they just get a bit luckier. Plus, their video already has a soul puddle somewhere on the ledge, so their method isn't 100% either.

Elerion · Feb 24, 2014

The archers are just deceptively hard. If you know what to do, or you're lucky and do it instinctively, it's not difficult at all. It appears to be nearly impossible because it looks like the archers will pincer attack you when you get onto the ledge. Instead, one archer has his LoS blocked, so it's just a silver knight fight where you can't move. Once you realize that, it's just a matter of running up there and either putting on heavy armor to win a slugfest, killing him straight up with heavy weapons, or parrying him.

It's deceptive because it challenges the way you've been taught to play up to that point. The first few hours teach you a habit of advancing slowly to avoid fighting groups, then using movement to avoid damage. That will get you killed against the knights. Instead, you should advance quickly to reach the "safe" spot, then fight a static battle.

Tuco · Feb 24, 2014

Elerion_sl said:
The archers are just deceptively hard. If you know what to do, or you're lucky and do it instinctively, it's not difficult at all. It appears to be nearly impossible because it looks like the archers will pincer attack you when you get onto the ledge. Instead, one archer has his LoS blocked, so it's just a silver knight fight where you can't move. Once you realize that, it's just a matter of running up there and either putting on heavy armor to win a slugfest, killing him straight up with heavy weapons, or parrying him.

It's deceptive because it challenges the way you've been taught to play up to that point. The first few hours teach you a habit of advancing slowly to avoid fighting groups, then using movement to avoid damage. That will get you killed against the knights. Instead, you should advance quickly to reach the "safe" spot, then fight a static battle.

Good description of why people have so much trouble with it. In addition if you haven't spent the effort to really learn how to fight those knights it's non-trivial to beat them, especially since attempts are separated by 5-10minutes of fighting and one wrong move can send you off the ledge. Once you spend the time learning them it's cake. Just like pretty much all the enemies in dark souls.

Raes · Feb 24, 2014

Those archers can be easily cheezed with a bow and some poison arrows. You can arc your arrows to hit them while being out of their range. Takes 2 or 3 shots each, then you get to go make a snack. There's a lot of fights that a bow will trivialize, especially with a bow of pharis and the hawk ring.

Vorph · Feb 24, 2014

Needless_sl said:
You don't like the fact that if you swing a 200 pound sword you cut off the tail of a dragon that you can't stop the momentum mid swing?
come on man haha

So many nit picky complaints its hilarious. The souls series is fine, go play a different series if you don't enjoy it lol

Personally, I think any combat engine that allows animation cancelling has poor design, and something is fundamentally broken either with the animations themselves or the overall combat system and they were too lazy to fix it properly, so instead they just let people cancel at will.

That said, From tries hard to not allow cancelling, but there were a few cases in both Demon's and Dark Souls where certain unintended actions allowed it. Hopefully they've gotten rid of all of them by now (and don't introduce more with new items).

Pyros · Feb 24, 2014

I liked how it was done in Dragon's Dogma, where animation cancelling was actually a skill. You had to learn it, only certain classes could use it and you had to slot it(and you had very limited slot options for your skills) so it was a choice. The higher version would also cancel staggers and stuff from getting hit, making it very valuable in some situations, but ultimately being a skill that did nothing if you were playing well enough.

Otherwise yeah don't really like animation cancelling unless it kinda makes sense or is only on specific stuff(and by that I mean specific things being cancellable, not specific things cancelling everything).

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