Diablo 4 / IV / IIII / Fore / Cope / Seethe

Mizake · Jun 7, 2023

Voldeth said:
There is absolutely nothing wrong with this and I don't believe anyone is saying that there is, albeit the thread has been going quicker than I've been following. It sounds like you're having a great time and it was well worth the cost associated for the game as a result. The leveling experience & itemization in D4 is fantastic and for those who are talking it especially slow, they are undoubtedly enjoying themselves quite a bit. That doesn't mean that the perspective of people who play hardcore relating to the lack of long-term viability of the game are wrong though. Our concerns have absolutely nothing to do with what you're talking about.

You (and those going slow) will eventually hit WT3/4 and start doing the content designed to satisfy everyone at that point. We just hit it earlier because this is traditionally the part of the game that hardcore players enjoy the most. You're likely almost there even at your casual pace and the game hasn't even been out a week. You (and your girlfriend) are going to then hit the wall of frustration that I hit a few days ago, which to provide some examples;

1) You''re going to die in a nightmare dungeon key at the end. It happens. Unfortunately however you're going to be teleported back to the very beginning of the instance since the checkpoints aren't consistent. Now you're going to spend a few minutes running back. This may happen more than once in the same instance and effectively you'll have spent more time running back than playing the game. This is probably going to be even more frustrating for you than it is for me, as I have more time to devout to video games and you'll have used the limited time you can allocate running back because this is apperently 1999 and Blizzard can't figure out check points properly.

2) You're going to start seeing a lot more loot dropping. Your girlfriend needs to run back 3 times right now? It'll probably be 25 in WT4 if she's looting everything. It's all going to be junk stuff though and the good items that are limited and feel good to equip are going to become more and more sparse. At that point, you're going to question (as we are) why there isn't a loot filtering option.

3) You're going to run into affixes/mechanics that are just plain un-fun. Your girlfriend that doesn't normally play games? She's going to be playing what is effectively some of the worse Mythic+ designs from WoW. That means she's going to get one shot every time she makes a mistake, which will likely be because there's too much shit on the screen that paying attention to the charger, poison mob, etc is going to become progressively more difficult to see. Add in the fact that the objectives will already feel repetitive by this point and I'm not sure either you or her will be enjoying yourselves very much.

4) You're going to want to try some of the other specs out. Maybe your leveling build was based around what was effective while leveling. Maybe now you want more crit.

...but the game punishes you for this and doesn't allow multiple specs to be saved. This isn't a hardcore vs casual issue. This is a "Multi specs are common place in today's game and no one likes to feel punished for wanting to try a new build out" issue, which is shared across all gamers.

5) You're going to start collecting shit and doing the casual stuff that the hardcores finished days ago by going through the world map and collecting all statues/dungeons/etc. Only the in game map was designed by a retard and there is no overlay option. So you're going to need to use a third party interactive map like we've been doing and working around that. At some point, you may think to yourself what we've been thinking which is, "hasn't a transparent map that I can keep open at all times something that was available in Diablo 1? Why the fuck don't I have it in D4".

6) You're going to travel from point A to point B on the map quite a bit. It's a good thing you have a trusty horse that's designed to make this quicker since you've now done the run a few times and there's nothing that you want to check out anymore. Let me know how that goes for you when you hit the 50th obstacle that was put there just to frustrate you.

7) You're going to want to group with a guildie at some point perhaps? Enjoy wasting a few minutes finding them in the guild roster since there is no filtering options in your friends list or guild tab. Let me repeat that: I cannot filter my friends list.

I can list a lot more examples like this. Again, I agree that someone who is casually playing and going through the leveling process is having fun. It's a fun experience. I watched the cutscenes and read some quest text, something I rarely do. That doesn't mean that I give the game a pass because the shit they set up to do once the MSQ is over is dogshit, especially by virtue of the fact that the portion of the game after the MSQ is where you're intended to spend 99.9% of your playtime. The game is simply ripe full of annoying shit that impacts EVERYONE -- hardcore players simply got there a few days earlier and have started moaning that it's tedious.

I don' think the level of patience is the same between casuals and hardcore. The things that bug you won't bug me as much. I don't get frustrated easily, I'm like a saint so far. Let me preface this by saying there is some pleasure to be taken to see a newbie like my gf play a game like this, with the wide-eyed innocence that no longer is available to someone jaded like me. To see her get excited about stuff that means little/nothing to me, but I remember being excited similarly when playing original Diablo decades ago. So I already put up with a lot of stuff to let her enjoy it. I don't quarterback her, I don't tell her which talents to get, which equipment to wear.....she plays a sorceress. She has a bit of frost, lightning, and fire spells. She likes the "pretty" spells like Blizzard and Meteor, so sure, why not both? I'm fucking white knighting her during the game, she will be in her inventory screen and I'll be attacking mobs trying to keep them off of her. She burns through potions and dies frequently, but the saving grace is 1) dmg doesn't interrupt revives, and 2) when I rez her she has all her potions back.

You think dying in WT3 is gonna turn me off? Bruh, I've been dealing with it since Act 1. It takes us 30 minutes to do a side quest because she has to pick flowers, mine nodes, open chests, etc. I have no false hope that we will even survive in WT3, especially since I do like 80% of the dps.

With that being said, I'll see when we get there if she's still having fun. I think she will. A lot of the things you mentioned are QoL issues that veteran gamers realize are missing, but novice gamers don't even think about. Overlay map? That's awesome for you and I who have experienced it before, for my gf she has no idea such a thing even existed, how would she miss it? This is literally her first ARPG she there is nothing for her to compare it to. Grouping with guildies? What's a guildie?

Eventually, when we hit that wall, she's going to either get frustrated and quit like you said, or she's going to have to start learning the systems, just like we all did when we first played this type of game. Right now, she wears any gear that has the highest ilvl......doesn't matter it only has dex or str on it. She puts her points randomly in her talent tree as she sees fit. However, I see how she's improving in the game, and by the time we reach end game, she's gonna have to learn how to be more choosy in her gear and in her talents. But for now, everything is new and fresh, it's an age of discovery for her, and I'd like to keep it that way as long as possible.

As for myself, as a solo player, I hope a lot of the QoL things you mentioned get patched in, but it's not gonna make or break the game for me either way. Like most games, they tend to improve with patches over time, so whereas those who rush through the game hit the wall and wait until a patch comes out to fix things, I notice that at a slower pace, I tend to get the benefit of the patches before I'm even ready for them.

Chris · Jun 7, 2023

zombiewizardhawk said:
Why the fuck are you still in this thread posting stupid shit? Haven't been able to muster up the stomach to put another 80 hours into that amazing Zelda game?

Yesterday I spent hours making a heavily armed hovercraft with 6 lazers and 2 cannons, annihilated a bunch of bokoblin camps from the air but then a camp fucking stood up. It was on the back of a stone talus.

Got it down to 90% and killed the bokoblins on it's back but then it threw a bolder and wrecked my hovercraft. Tried throwing bombs at it but my aim was off, so I ascended up it's asshole, balanced on it's head and finished it off with a mechanical hammer.

Then I found a bunch of hidden wells and caves while looking for giant Hinoxes, I need their guts to upgrade the Fierce Deity Armor. Also looking out for chinese dragons to skydive onto, I can harvest scales from their back to fuse to the master sword for elemental damage and if I shoot thier teeth with a bow I get the other item I need for my armor upgrade.

I was also able to find another 6 shrines (some in those caves) and do their varied puzzles for hearts, since their location correspond to light roots in the inverted Hyrule in the depths.

That's just one day play. Note the lack of repetitive tasks. I didn't even do any depths, sky islands, quests, snowboarding or accidental korok euthanasia.

You guys are one shotting trash in duplicate brown corridors.

Seananigans · Jun 7, 2023

Mizake said:
I don' think the level of patience is the same between casuals and hardcore. The things that bug you won't bug me as much. I don't get frustrated easily, I'm like a saint so far. Let me preface this by saying there is some pleasure to be taken to see a newbie like my gf play a game like this, with the wide-eyed innocence that no longer is available to someone jaded like me. To see her get excited about stuff that means little/nothing to me, but I remember being excited similarly when playing original Diablo decades ago. So I already put up with a lot of stuff to let her enjoy it. I don't quarterback her, I don't tell her which talents to get, which equipment to wear.....she plays a sorceress. She has a bit of frost, lightning, and fire spells. She likes the "pretty" spells like Blizzard and Meteor, so sure, why not both? I'm fucking white knighting her during the game, she will be in her inventory screen and I'll be attacking mobs trying to keep them off of her. She burns through potions and dies frequently, but the saving grace is 1) dmg doesn't interrupt revives, and 2) when I rez her she has all her potions back.

You think dying in WT3 is gonna turn me off? Bruh, I've been dealing with it since Act 1. It takes us 30 minutes to do a side quest because she has to pick flowers, mine nodes, open chests, etc. I have no false hope that we will even survive in WT3, especially since I do like 80% of the dps.

With that being said, I'll see when we get there if she's still having fun. I think she will. A lot of the things you mentioned are QoL issues that veteran gamers realize are missing, but novice gamers don't even think about. Overlay map? That's awesome for you and I who have experienced it before, for my gf she has no idea such a thing even existed, how would she miss it? This is literally her first ARPG she there is nothing for her to compare it to. Grouping with guildies? What's a guildie?

Eventually, when we hit that wall, she's going to either get frustrated and quit like you said, or she's going to have to start learning the systems, just like we all did when we first played this type of game. Right now, she wears any gear that has the highest ilvl......doesn't matter it only has dex or str on it. She puts her points randomly in her talent tree as she sees fit. However, I see how she's improving in the game, and by the time we reach end game, she's gonna have to learn how to be more choosy in her gear and in her talents. But for now, everything is new and fresh, it's an age of discovery for her, and I'd like to keep it that way as long as possible.

As for myself, as a solo player, I hope a lot of the QoL things you mentioned get patched in, but it's not gonna make or break the game for me either way. Like most games, they tend to improve with patches over time, so whereas those who rush through the game hit the wall and wait until a patch comes out to fix things, I notice that at a slower pace, I tend to get the benefit of the patches before I'm even ready for them.

Re-assuring for me, 95% of the reason I'm going to play it is to play couch co-op with my wife. Looking forward to it based on this! I'm one of those rare guys, like you, who actually enjoys playing things with his wife/gf.

Palum · Jun 7, 2023

Here's my thing, I just don't want it to feel annoying. Give me +good, new effects, cool synergies and new skills, whatever. But resource starvation in an ARPG with all these stupid trapeze artist mobs is just annoying. Grinding for random drops to fix core combat isn't fun and there's a lot of specs in that category.

mkopec · Jun 7, 2023

Palum said:
Here's my thing, I just don't want it to feel annoying. Give me +good, new effects, cool synergies and new skills, whatever. But resource starvation in an ARPG with all these stupid trapeze artist mobs is just annoying. Grinding for random drops to fix core combat isn't fun and there's a lot of specs in that category.

Now this I will agree with. Again, combat in this game feels like a chore, moreso than in any other ARPG I played. If this is how they balance your power vs mobs well then they did the game a disservice.

Derkon · Jun 7, 2023

Where the fuck do you get crushed beast bones? I can't upgrade my potion past 30 without them lol

meStevo · Jun 7, 2023

Derkon said:
Where the fuck do you get crushed beast bones? I can't upgrade my potion past 30 without them lol

Gaspar Stillbain can be found near a dungeon called the Whispering Pines, located in Scosglen. The Whispering Pines can be found in the Eastern corner of the Highland Wilds. Once there, simply head North-West and you'll come across an area called The Scar. On arrival, stick to the Northern wall and you'll bump into Gaspar in no time.

Gaspar won't put up much of a fight and will drop five Crushed Beast Bones every time you kill him. He respawns every few minutes or so, too, so spawn-camping him is a great way to farm the Crushed Beast Bones. He'll also drop a rare set of gloves called the Outcast's Handwraps which give the wearer extra ranks in Incinerate – a real boon for Sorceresses who specialize in Fire magic.

MSN

www.msn.com

GuardianX · Jun 7, 2023

zombiewizardhawk said:
Eh, I started skipping everything when I decided to leave fractured peaks and go through the story. It's all just the same super cringe nonsense we've had for so many years now. White people bad, anything religious bad except for voodoo and witchcraft shit, colored people and white females good even if they do fucked up shit because justice.

This isn't a dig solely at blizzard/d4 either, it's everything for the past 10+ years whether its movies, video games, tv shows, anything. Story isn't why I play arpgs tho and I wasn't expecting anything better to begin with.

I mean I get it's annoying joining a thread about a game to see people on the fence about buying the game and actively shitting on the team that created it, but god damn you basically just proved most peoples worries to be accurate or to have some foundation.

Seananigans · Jun 7, 2023

meStevo said:
Gaspar Stillbain can be found near a dungeon called the Whispering Pines, located in Scosglen. The Whispering Pines can be found in the Eastern corner of the Highland Wilds. Once there, simply head North-West and you'll come across an area called The Scar. On arrival, stick to the Northern wall and you'll bump into Gaspar in no time.

Gaspar won't put up much of a fight and will drop five Crushed Beast Bones every time you kill him. He respawns every few minutes or so, too, so spawn-camping him is a great way to farm the Crushed Beast Bones. He'll also drop a rare set of gloves called the Outcast's Handwraps which give the wearer extra ranks in Incinerate – a real boon for Sorceresses who specialize in Fire magic.

MSN

www.msn.com

Respawning mobs/npcs triggers me timbers. I really dislike all of the MMO-ization they've done to the series.

zombiewizardhawk · Jun 7, 2023

Kirun said:
Do NOT let this man play PoE under any circumstances. He'll uninstall after 20 minutes of mapping.

He hardcore poopsocks Lost Ark which is exactly the same, anyways. 5000000 identical chaos dungeons per week, 5000000 identical dungeons per week, etc. It's just as comical as aladain saying PoE maps aren't repetitive because they all have unique layouts, lol.

Chris said:
Yesterday I spent hours making a heavily armed hovercraft with 6 lazers and 2 cannons, annihilated a bunch of bokoblin camps from the air but then a camp fucking stood up. It was on the back of a stone talus.

Got it down to 90% and killed the bokoblins on it's back but then it threw a bolder and wrecked my hovercraft. Tried throwing bombs at it but my aim was off, so I ascended up it's asshole, balanced on it's head and finished it off with a mechanical hammer.

Then I found a bunch of hidden wells and caves while looking for giant Hinoxes, I need their guts to upgrade the Fierce Deity Armor. Also looking out for chinese dragons to skydive onto, I can harvest scales from their back to fuse to the master sword for elemental damage and if I shoot thier teeth with a bow I get the other item I need for my armor upgrade.

I was also able to find another 6 shrines (some in those caves) and do their varied puzzles for hearts, since their location correspond to light roots in the inverted Hyrule in the depths.

That's just one day play. Note the lack of repetitive tasks. I didn't even do any depths, sky islands, quests, snowboarding or accidental korok euthanasia.

You guys are one shotting trash in duplicate brown corridors.

Chris · Jun 7, 2023

GuardianX said:
I mean I get it's annoying joining a thread about a game to see people on the fence about buying the game and actively shitting on the team that created it, but god damn you basically just proved most peoples worries to be accurate or to have some foundation.

It's only safe to buy games from East Asia now, where they find European history and culture exotic and they respect and honour it.

Cinge · Jun 7, 2023

Palum said:
Here's my thing, I just don't want it to feel annoying. Give me +good, new effects, cool synergies and new skills, whatever. But resource starvation in an ARPG with all these stupid trapeze artist mobs is just annoying. Grinding for random drops to fix core combat isn't fun and there's a lot of specs in that category.

I am 50/50. I get it, build and spend, classic. But I would like to see more odd ball stuff. Things like aura builds etc. Maybe for early levels add a resource potion. And then later when builds come on line and basically ignore resource , you just dont need it anymore, or to fill gaps. Like for me , in packs resource isnt an issue, since I have the things that replenish. On single target(bosses) it can be an issue, since less mobs to hit to return it and less mobs to hit for Lucky hits to trigger the refill. D3 had the same thing for most builds, had to get certain items or stats to replenish resource, so you could just spam your main attack.

I cant understand as the devs, not wanting players to just ignore resource and go all core skill spamming in the early game. But as a player I feel the annoyance of having to get the right stats/powers to make it mostly a non concern.

Ritley · Jun 7, 2023

meStevo said:
Kinda cool, didn't realize non-sacred affixes will become sacred when applied to sacred items.

View attachment 477005

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View attachment 477006

Aspects applied to 2h weapons get a 100% bonus

zombiewizardhawk · Jun 7, 2023

GuardianX said:
I mean I get it's annoying joining a thread about a game to see people on the fence about buying the game and actively shitting on the team that created it, but god damn you basically just proved most peoples worries to be accurate or to have some foundation.

That the story would be shit? Were people really on the fence about D4 because they weren't sure if the story was going to be some top-tier rpg story? If it makes you feel any better, like I said, the story is equally as shit to me as are 99.9% of movies/television shows/books/etc. that come out these days so if you're not in the same camp as me on all that then maybe you'll love the story in D4. Daidraco already said he likes the story/world, i'm sure a bunch of others are enjoying it too. It just doesn't do it for me, but I play these games to kill a bunch of mobs and get loot, and i'm having fun doing that so far, even tho I picked Druid to start.

I did decide to transmog all my armor to unequipped a few minutes ago so now i'm running around in a loincloth with a dinosaur looking skull helmet, once the servers let me log back in anyways. Got disconnected right as I was going to fight the boss in an aspect dungeon, kinda jimmy rustling.

Mizake · Jun 7, 2023

Seananigans said:
Re-assuring for me, 95% of the reason I'm going to play it is to play couch co-op with my wife. Looking forward to it based on this! I'm one of those rare guys, like you, who actually enjoys playing things with his wife/gf.

As a couch-coop this game has been a revelation. The last couch coop game I remember enjoying as much as this one was Champions of Norrath on the PS2.

Please be aware that unlike Champions of Norrath, you will need 2 copies of the game to play D4, even when sharing a screen. The accounts are tied to your Blizzard account and need to be registered separately, so be sure not to buy both games on one account.

Kiki · Jun 7, 2023

Chris said:
That's just one day play. Note the lack of repetitive tasks. I didn't even do any depths, sky islands, quests, snowboarding or accidental korok euthanasia.

You guys are one shotting trash in duplicate brown corridors.

But are the maps procedually generated?

mkopec · Jun 7, 2023

zombiewizardhawk said:
He hardcore poopsocks Lost Ark which is exactly the same, anyways. 5000000 identical chaos dungeons per week, 5000000 identical dungeons per week, etc. It's just as comical as aladain saying PoE maps aren't repetitive because they all have unique layouts, lol.

I mean if youre hooked on a game like obv he is with lost ark, he could play the second coming of greatness and still think its shit.

Seananigans · Jun 7, 2023

Mizake said:
As a couch-coop this game has been a revelation. The last couch coop game I remember enjoying as much as this one was Champions of Norrath on the PS2.

Please be aware that unlike Champions of Norrath, you will need 2 copies of the game to play D4, even when sharing a screen. The accounts are tied to your Blizzard account and need to be registered separately, so be sure not to buy both games on one account.

Wait what? I knew she'd have to log into her battle net account to play, but you're saying it won't let her log into bnet in my D4 until she has her own D4 registered on her bnet?

zombiewizardhawk · Jun 7, 2023

Speaking of lucky hit, am I missing something about it? Every piece of gear i've seen linked in here has effects and stuff on their lucky hit mods but every item I find with it just says "chance to get lucky hit x%" with no actual effects?

mkopec · Jun 7, 2023

zombiewizardhawk said:
Speaking of lucky hit, am I missing something about it? Every piece of gear i've seen linked in here has effects and stuff on their lucky hit mods but every item I find with it just says "chance to get lucky hit x%" with no actual effects?

Because theire is items with lucky hit effects, and in order to get the lucky hit to begin with, you have to up your lucky hit chance. think of it as a trigger for other shit if you have it. For instance my barb had some items that did chance of execute trash with lucky hit.

Diablo 4 / IV / IIII / Fore / Cope / Seethe

Trakanon Raider

Potato del Grande

Honorary Shit-PhD

what Suineg set it to

Blackwing Lair Raider

I think your wife's a bigfoot gus.

Perpetually Pessimistic

Honorary Shit-PhD

Potato del Grande

Potato del Grande

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Karazhan Raider

Potato del Grande

Trakanon Raider

Log Wizard

Honorary Shit-PhD

Potato del Grande