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Cinge

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,278
2,304
Where's my MMO that has a build your own filter.

Elurin_sl said:
If you can't aggro a mob though, how in the hell do you defend anyone? Is it going to be like what someone said where you see the mob charging the ranged DPS and you jump in front? That sounds like it'll be super fun until about the 2nd time you have to do it.
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The only things I can see are things like intervene, bubbles, etc. Could do something like tera where if you are behind a "blocking" tank you take less damage. The issues comes in why the fuck bring that at all, just kite away and bring another dps(this is what gw2 is). If the AI is going to go after the squishes and the tank cant make it attack him, they are going to kite. I guess they could go super CC route too, tons of KDs, KBs, snares, stuns etc to keep it off squishes.
 
Caliane

Caliane

Avatar of War Slayer
15,345
11,643
Elurin_sl said:
If you can't aggro a mob though, how in the hell do you defend anyone? Is it going to be like what someone said where you see the mob charging the ranged DPS and you jump in front? That sounds like it'll be super fun until about the 2nd time you have to do it.
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Seriously? 2013 and we are still asking that question?

tanking via controls. slows, hard cc, collision, etc.

No taunts.. but there is still aggro. Aggro as a value of "threat of target" is fine. dealing damage, healing, using CC. its a value assigned to assign threat as you would vs a player. False aggro on skills that deal +aggro, or taunts is the problem here. If you as a player are fighting two mages, and one is hitting you for 2000 damage, and the other for 300. you will target the one hitting you for 2000. this is aggro.

Mod AI. target healer first. if healer out of range, move into range. if cc applied to self, check targets in range, target highest?/lowest hp or ac. etc.

Create an AI, that will go after healers, but choose to target melee if healers and "soft" targets are not currently viable to target. Turning back on priority targets if they are in range or viable targets, and also giving "low" targets priority. this is how you make an AI that acts more like a player and is deadly. Is it more fun?? eh.... sometimes people don't really want more deadly. they want predictable. controlling this as a tank works in the same way a "tank" does in pvp. one, hard CC like knockbacks, stuns etc. two. tanks are more bruiser dps, not true tanks.
 
Teekey

Teekey

Mr. Poopybutthole
3,644
-6,335
Elurin_sl said:
If you can't aggro a mob though, how in the hell do you defend anyone? Is it going to be like what someone said where you see the mob charging the ranged DPS and you jump in front? That sounds like it'll be super fun until about the 2nd time you have to do it.
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And just sitting stationary there spamming your rotation is much better?

I think required movement sounds quite a bit better to successfully play your class.
 
T

ThunderCougarFalconBird_sl

shitlord
547
1
Elurin_sl said:
If you can't aggro a mob though, how in the hell do you defend anyone? Is it going to be like what someone said where you see the mob charging the ranged DPS and you jump in front? That sounds like it'll be super fun until about the 2nd time you have to do it.
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Well what immediately comes to mind, simply because its what they already showed, was putting up an ice-wall, or destroying the bridge so they can't reach your casters. Using the constructible/destructable terrain. The AI will have some sort of aggro table just to determine who it is attacking, but the idea was its more complex than who is putting out the most dps or heals or if the tank is building threat with his rotation.

Storybricks would allow for a player to tank by using skills, weapons, or items NPC doesn't like. Mob hates fire? Have your casters use ice spells while you pull out your enchanted flaming shield.
 
rhinohelix

rhinohelix

Dental Dammer
<Gold Donor>
3,046
5,014
Was this what I expected for EQN? No, I expected something much closer to the original but I am actually encouraged by what they have portrayed so far. They really are swinging for the fences and even if the implementation isn't great, they look to advance the genre.
 
Teekey

Teekey

Mr. Poopybutthole
3,644
-6,335
cinge_sl said:
The only things I can see are things like intervene, bubbles, etc. Could do something like tera where if you are behind a "blocking" tank you take less damage. The issues comes in why the fuck bring that at all, just kite away and bring another dps(this is what gw2 is). If the AI is going to go after the squishes and the tank cant make it attack him, they are going to kite. I guess they could go super CC route too, tons of KDs, KBs, snares, stuns etc to keep it off squishes.
Click to expand...
Tanks are still going to deal damage and contribute, though. Look at current World of Warcraft. My Monk does an absolute shit-ton of damage, all while tanking. And that's because of the tanking mechanics like Vengeance, really.

EQNext could have similar mechanics. Taking damage 'enrages' the Warrior, causing him to do more damage. So it's in his best interest to defend his friends and take their damage instead. And this allows him to greater contribute to the group, as well.

You certainly don't HAVE to bring a Warrior. You could prevent the damage through CC as you suggested - but it's not detrimental to have one in any way. I think that's the type of system they're looking for.
 
Q

qwertyqweqwertwqert

<Banned>
1,678
149
Teekey_sl said:
Tanks are still going to deal damage and contribute, though. Look at current World of Warcraft. My Monk does an absolute shit-ton of damage, all while tanking. And that's because of the tanking mechanics like Vengeance, really.

EQNext could have similar mechanics. Taking damage 'enrages' the Warrior, causing him to do more damage. So it's in his best interest to defend his friends and take their damage instead. And this allows him to greater contribute to the group, as well.
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But there will be no tanking, DPS, or crowd control. You might be called a Warrior or a Wizard or whatever but it means nothing. All that matters is you hold mouse button one and you fly through the air, destroying mobs and the ground and everything in a 1 mile radius. All mobs die in explosions. Nobody needs to tank, or control, or do anything because there are essentially no enemies.... everything dies in a second. The only way to get hurt is to go afk or something.

Remember - mouse button 1 - everything dies. That is the modern way.
 
T

Tidbit Scaledclaw_sl

shitlord
1,015
1
http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08...ses-announced/

SOE Live 2013: Five of EverQuest Next's classes announcedSOE Live 2013 Announcing EverQuest Next's starting classes
While yesterday's big reveal showed us what races are confirmed as playable so far in EverQuest Next (Dwarf, Human, Ogre, Elf, Dark Elf, and Kerran), only two classes were highlighted during the demonstration. We also discovered that characters will be able to learn more classes -- and there are more than 40 of them -- as they adventure. But what are all the classes and which ones can players choose when they first embark on their next Norrathian exploits?

We cannot answer the latter, but we now have a partial answer to the former. Five of the classes that will be available in EQ Next are: Rogue, Warrior, Tempest, Blademaster, and Wizard. Any, all, or even none of these may be one of eight starting classes.

A few other tidbits about classes were also discussed during SOE panels, including how to distinguish what class a player or NPC is (answer: how s/he stands and holds his or her weapon) and character builds (items plus abilities will together constitute a build). Hungry for more info? Keep your eyes peeled for a more in-depth look at the philosophy and mechanics of classes coming soon!
 
C

Caliel

Bronze Knight of the Realm
186
0
Caliane_sl said:
Seriously? 2013 and we are still asking that question?

tanking via controls. slows, hard cc, collision, etc.

No taunts.. but there is still aggro. Aggro as a value of "threat of target" is fine. dealing damage, healing, using CC. its a value assigned to assign threat as you would vs a player. False aggro on skills that deal +aggro, or taunts is the problem here. If you as a player are fighting two mages, and one is hitting you for 2000 damage, and the other for 300. you will target the one hitting you for 2000. this is aggro.

Mod AI. target healer first. if healer out of range, move into range. if cc applied to self, check targets in range, target highest?/lowest hp or ac. etc.

Create an AI, that will go after healers, but choose to target melee if healers and "soft" targets are not currently viable to target. Turning back on priority targets if they are in range or viable targets, and also giving "low" targets priority. this is how you make an AI that acts more like a player and is deadly. Is it more fun?? eh.... sometimes people don't really want more deadly. they want predictable. controlling this as a tank works in the same way a "tank" does in pvp. one, hard CC like knockbacks, stuns etc. two. tanks are more bruiser dps, not true tanks.
Click to expand...
In the Q&A for the class panel, it sounded like there will be no healers because they did not want people having to look at other people's hp bars. If there are no healers and no tanks, that just means that they want everyone to be a dps. In fact, they said they wanted everyone to dps the mobs.
 
T

ThunderCougarFalconBird_sl

shitlord
547
1
qwerty_sl said:
But there will be no tanking, DPS, or crowd control. You might be called a Warrior or a Wizard or whatever but it means nothing. All that matters is you hold mouse button one and you fly through the air, destroying mobs and the ground and everything in a 1 mile radius. All mobs die in explosions. Nobody needs to tank, or control, or do anything because there are essentially no enemies.... everything dies in a second. The only way to get hurt is to go afk or something.

Remember - mouse button 1 - everything dies. That is the modern way.
Click to expand...
You're not really contributing honestly to the discussion anymore. We get it you don't like EQN but posts like this don't do you any favors.
 
C

Carl_sl

shitlord
634
0
Caliel_sl said:
In the Q&A for the class panel, it sounded like there will be no healers because they did not want people having to look at other people's hp bars. If there are no healers and no tanks, that just means that they want everyone to be a dps. In fact, they said they wanted everyone to dps the mobs.
Click to expand...
I'm hoping it's a situtation where if I play a cleric, i have my damaging abilities that im expected to use as well as maybe a few AoE heals to help the group. The combat would consist of everyone being responsible for avoiding all damage, but for the times they fail the cleric can lend a hand. That I could handle.
 
xzi

xzi

Mouthbreather
7,526
6,763
It's best if you just completely ignore qwerty as he has dicks in every orifice possible right now making him cranky.

Also, I really hope if they do want everyone to DPS the mobs, that there are classes that shoot out heals and buffs for DPSing, like some kind of lifesteal. Only selfheals and selfbuffs are pretty lame. I don't have that much of an interest in playing any DPS classes.
 
S

supertouch_sl

shitlord
1,858
3
the more i look at it, the more i like the art style. i just wish the kerran looked more like this:

rrr_img_38956.jpg
 
Q

qwertyqweqwertwqert

<Banned>
1,678
149
Caliel_sl said:
In the Q&A for the class panel, it sounded like there will be no healers because they did not want people having to look at other people's hp bars. If there are no healers and no tanks, that just means that they want everyone to be a dps. In fact, they said they wanted everyone to dps the mobs.
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BINGO, fucking finally some truth comes out. Everyone is a dps - all mobs die in 2 seconds. It's the guild wars way. The solution to the "holy trinity".

ThunderCougarFalconBird_sl said:
You're not really contributing honestly to the discussion anymore. We get it you don't like EQN but posts like this don't do you any favors.
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They are more or less the only posts in this entire thread that are actually correct. I know you don't get it now. That's ok.
 
B

Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
I apologize if it has already been stated, but it is really hard to read 5 pages per hour when you are listening to panels/drinking/gambling. On of the panels it was stated that NPC druids will kite you. I thought that was pretty cool. The rallying cries and the tiered minecraft world seem like great concepts. If they can pull those two off well enough, I could probably get past any shitty combat system they implement.
 
Teekey

Teekey

Mr. Poopybutthole
3,644
-6,335
Caliel_sl said:
In the Q&A for the class panel, it sounded like there will be no healers because they did not want people having to look at other people's hp bars. If there are no healers and no tanks, that just means that they want everyone to be a dps. In fact, they said they wanted everyone to dps the mobs.
Click to expand...
They said they don't want a dedicated healer role. So there won't be a person who doesn't do anything but heal.

I think that's fine. Right now my Monk in WoW wears mostly DPS gear. There's some survivability increases by doing damage, but it's also becoming increasingly important for even tanks to put out maximum damage.

Why can't a Cleric smite an enemy with Holy Fire, while fortifying their groups armor, and healing up damage taken? I kind of like the idea of everyone being involved in fighting.
 
T

Tidbit Scaledclaw_sl

shitlord
1,015
1
Menion_sl said:
/Cheetos?
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Sorta of I can see Smed SOE and crew having cartoon character models holding all types of items on posters, screenshots on gaming sites and vidoes to advertise.

Basically just like the last Bond Movie Skyfall had the most advertiseing ever for a Bond movie within the movie like there were many products from Heiken Beer to etc.
 
Cinge

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,278
2,304
Carl_sl said:
I'm hoping it's a situtation where if I play a cleric, i have my damaging abilities that im expected to use as well as maybe a few AoE heals to help the group. The combat would consist of everyone being responsible for avoiding all damage, but for the times they fail the cleric can lend a hand. That I could handle.
Click to expand...
Hope they don't follow GW2's route then. Because while classes could build a healing setup, it was pointless. The same with a damage sponge build. There was just no point.

I do not think the answer to no trinity is to just make everyone dps as the only viable option.
 
Q

qwertyqweqwertwqert

<Banned>
1,678
149
Bellringer_sl said:
I apologize if it has already been stated, but it is really hard to read 5 pages per hour when you are listening to panels/drinking/gambling. On of the panels it was stated that NPC druids will kite you. I thought that was pretty cool. The rallying cries and the tiered minecraft world seem like great concepts. If they can pull those two off well enough, I could probably get past any shitty combat system they implement.
Click to expand...
NPC druids kite you = mob casts snare on you, you slowly run after it for a few seconds before you can press your "kill everything" button.
 
T

Tidbit Scaledclaw_sl

shitlord
1,015
1
Teekey_sl said:
They said they don't want a dedicated healer role. So there won't be a person who doesn't do anything but heal.

I think that's fine. Right now my Monk in WoW wears mostly DPS gear. There's some survivability increases by doing damage, but it's also becoming increasingly important for even tanks to put out maximum damage.

Why can't a Cleric smite an enemy with Holy Fire, while fortifying their groups armor, and healing up damage taken? I kind of like the idea of everyone being involved in fighting.
Click to expand...
Lol we all dps in and dungeon or raid how the fuck are they going to balance the dungeon or raid or classes then?

Oh wait they use the Faqish GW2 way they just wont have raids or dungeons carry on!
 
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