Final Fantasy VII Remake

Quaid_sl said:

That's pretty fucking strange, dude. None of the Final Fantasy games are that good.

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Color me strange as well then because I also play through ff4, ff6, and chrono trigger every few years.

Yeah, some people even speedrun games they like.

I replayed it recently and FF6's combat system is not great, stop saying that it is. Replay these games to take off the rose tinted glasses.

In FF6 some characters have super abilities you get at the start of the game which make battles trival (auto-crossbow) and once you get Espers it just feels bad to have stats on level up you can't organise optimally without being tedious because you have a bunch of shitty magic to learn which often isn't as good as auto-crossbow, the thing it does have going for it is interesting gear. It's better than FF9 which didn't really have a customisation system. FF8's version of Espers was much better, it just had draw and limited gear on top of that which are controversial still.

The best combat system was in FF10. If anyone is playing Final Fantasy Record Keeper you'll notice the FF10 battles being more complex and strategic because of this. Fully customisable weapons, some freedom to develop skills and stats how you chose especially taking a second characters abilities, ATB queue to plan out attacks, all characters having a unique use so you level them all and can swap mid battle? It's the pinnacle of the series and I'm starting to consider the MMOs, Ivalice Alliance and Fabula Nova Crystallis not true Final Fantasy games. FF10 was the last real one we got not being involved with zany side projects.

Materia was pretty damned good in how fun it was to customise your characters, they NEED to have that in. Make everything else be an evolution of what we had in FF10. I'd add in positioning since standing in a line is silly nowadays, with inputting commands for all three at once so everyone is acting at the same time and not taking turns? Not doing the full/partial automation of FF12 and FF13 though.





Bravely Default is the best implementation of the job system but I think that is for the MMOs and Mobile Games being their own thing now. Why the fuck FF12 didn't have the job system I'll never understand, why did they even bother to set it in Ivalice if you don't use the mechanics, themes or locations?.

Eh, the equipment stuff from 10 was kind of crap, imo. Either it didn't matter for 99% of content, or you had to have specific stuff on it to survive an encounter, which wasn't really that open until post-game anyway. And the weapons were equally crap, as you either had crap with like +5%str on it or something for the vast majority of the game (Brotherhood, hi) or you had the borderline broken spirit weapons. Not really much middle ground, and with the spirit weapons negating armor/breaking the damage cap by default, the was no choice in the matter. Either it didn't matter or it was completely required which meant you were doing post-game stuff anyway.

I much prefer the tiered upgrade paths like Crono Trigger/FF6 etc. for gear, where each new area you get to has a set to save up and purchase and items that are usually an upgrade over gear from the previous area.

They could probably make a lot of people happy by keeping it the turn based 13 style, but have the default control scheme allowing full control of other characters. Then they can claim that combat is closer to original stuff while also allowing for the semi-automated stuff via gambits/whatever they want to call them for the rest of the playerbase. 12 could be played 100% manually, but I would gather that a very small percentage of the playerbase actually did that. The rest set up familiar RPG archetypes on the chars they weren't playing so they could run around comboing shit to death.

I would definitely assume that they are going to go with fewer mobs/more reward, and have them visible as you run around instead of the splash screen to combat mode. It fits the more cinematic bent that square has had recently for their games.

DoctorSpooge_sl said:

Square is gonna get blasted regardless of the outcome. If it's nothing more than a facelift it'll satiate the appetites of its rabid fanboys, but it'll be met with universal excoriation at worst and "hey, I loved this game 20 years ago and it's still pretty good" at best among critics.

If they infuse the same base material with modern innovations and create a game that could possibly make for an objectively better game, it'll more or less reverse the reception from the two parties.

Of the two, option 2 is the sounder play, because let's face it - the fanboys are gonna buy it regardless and a fresh rendition of a dated masterpiece is more likely to garner new fans than a fresh coat of paint.

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Yes. It's always the better option to piss off all your fans because "hey, they'll buy it anyways". Better if your plan is to shut your company down shortly thereafter and you just need one last payday, that is.

ZombieWizardhawk_sl said:

Yes. It's always the better option to piss off all your fans because "hey, they'll buy it anyways". Better if your plan is to shut your company down shortly thereafter and you just need one last payday, that is.

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Yeah, so they've been pissing off their fans for years now and counting on them buying their shit anyway. And they do. I'm not endorsing their rationale and I assume you're not under the impression that I am.

What I'm saying is that if they do it correctly - and I don't think it's within the realm of reasonable expectation that they'll be able to do it correctly - it'll turn out better than it would if they merely fashioned glittery next-gen garb and slapped it on their venerated old toad.

I adore FFVII - really, I do. But I'd rather them try to rejuvenate it -within strict and predetermined bounds that utterly preclude fucking with its story and its aesthetic- and worry over the (admittedly likely) prospect of spectacular failure than play a prettier version of the same fucking game I played decades ago.

ZombieWizardhawk_sl said:

Yes. It's always the better option to piss off all your fans because "hey, they'll buy it anyways". Better if your plan is to shut your company down shortly thereafter and you just need one last payday, that is.

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Plus, frothing FF7 fanboys != FF fans. For many FF fans, a dismal failure here won't amount to anything more significant than the litany of failures that preceded it like FF13. A shitty pill to swallow, to be sure, but one they've grown accustomed to swallowing. The only truly-sacred-will-probably-not-play-any-remake FF game for me is Tactics.

Chris_sl said:

FF8's version of Espers was much better, it just had draw and limited gear on top of that which are controversial still.

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I did like 8s system of developing your GFs and them learning new abilities, what ruined it was that you had to bind your magic that you needed to draw from enemies to equipment slots making the use of magic practically unusable in combat

Speaking of which, Games Done Quick is speedrunning Chronotrigger tonight to end their marathon.

8/1/2015 17:29:00 Super Mario 64 - 120 star race
8/1/2015 19:39:00 Super Metroid - Race!
8/1/2015 20:39:00 Chrono Trigger - Co-op run, incentive for 100%

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Um.

As long as the XII remaster is the zodiac international version

Noodlemod_sl said:

As long as the XII remaster is the zodiac international version

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Weirdly the international version with improved job system was not what we got for the actual international release! We just got the base game.

With FF10 we actually did get the different version with the expert sphere grid.

I'm assuming remaster and not remake because you can still play ff12 and it looks fine, ff7 just looks terrible.

I'd be quite happy with a remaster. I played 12 and really loved it but never beat it for some reason. I appreciated that a lot characters were random people that got swept up in events much larger and more significan than they themselves were. Or at least tha's how I remember it.

It also made it difficult to connect with most of the characters really, minus Balthier and Ashe to a degree. And the last chunk of the storyline that, paraphrased, is: "Oh cool, interdimensional creepy beings have been controlling the fate of Ivalice for a long time and we never knew it. But remember that one guy who didn't really do much but kill his own expansionist emperor father and kind of just -sort- of be a jerk a couple of times? HE IS THE REAL BAD GUY GET HIM. Forget the crazy space monster eyeball overlords completely." Completely dumb and didn't make for a compelling reason. Probably the best parts, imo, were the hunts and the combat/gambit system, as the storyline was pretty weak. Not FF13 retard-nonsense weak, but pretty weak.

At least in 9 you got to fight the evil interdimensional entity introduced at the end. In 12 you kind of go "Alright, keep up the good work!" and wander off.

I..uhhh.. don't think I made it that far.