Girls who broke your heart thread

Ancalagon said:

Have a question on an extremely common situation which I guess I simply haven"t had to deal with to this point. You"re friends with a girl, and that friendship seems to be getting increasingly warm. You have romantic feelings for said girl, but you can"t be sure whether or not she feels similarly about you. You might just play it slow and hope things fall into place naturally, but it"s quite possible that if you don"t really overtly put yourself out there and proposition the girl outright, nothing will ever materialize, regardless of feelings on her end. (Truthfully speaking I think it would probably get to the point where it was so blatant I liked her that her refusal to acknowledge would be a very obvious show of disinterest, but anyways...) So the only course of action seems to be to go out on that limb and straight-up proposition the girl. The question then: generally speaking, is the friendship salvageable if you get denied? I realize there"s no one-size-fits-all answer to this and it largely depends on the emotional maturities of the parties in question (me and the girl), but what have your experiences been?

I realize this is a Dating 101 question, but hey, I"m relatively young and the only two major relationships I"ve had fell into place differently than this is shaping to (or not, as the case may be).

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As others have already said, any advice is going to be totally dependent upon the nature of your previous relationship and the personalities of those involved. In terms of whether or not it will ruin the friendship, again, really depends on those involved. Some girls might turn you down gently, but appreciate the honesty and provided you don"t turn in to a puppy dog or otherwise sabotage the friendship through changed behavior, they"ll be fine with it. You might even get the occasional booty call. Some girls, even if you"re very careful to not creep them out, will get creeped out anyways and shun you. Operating from the assumption that it WILL wreck the friendship is the best bet though. Good friends are every bit as hard to come by as girlfriends are, and tend to last a lot longer.

I have had a couple girls I"ve had long term friendships with where things turned romantic, or one side or the other expressed such feelings while the other was not interested or otherwise unavailable, and in all cases it"s worked out great in terms of our continued friendships (not so much in the relationship department). But that tends to be how things go with me, I normally end up if not friends with exes, at least on decent speaking terms where neither side is left with a lot of bad feelings.

Just over this past weekend I may have re-started something with a girl I"ve been friends with since we were 13. We"ve never even kissed, however over the years we"ve both at one or more points expressed to the other our interest, but for a multitude of reasons things just never worked out. She"s an extremely direct kind of girl, and I"m pretty direct as well.

I was in Calgary/Banff over the weekend, and while driving back to Calgary Saturday afternoon I sent her a text asking if she was in town, as the two buds I was with (they actually went to elementary school with her) and I were going to go out and grab a bite and a few drinks that evening. I sent it 98% because we"re friends and I haven"t seen her in awhile, but in the back of my mind I knew she"d recently broken up with her on again, off again boyfriend over the past 5+ years and even if there was nothing happening relationship wise, she"s very overtly sexual and has said in the past that at some point the two of his should have sex (also that if we"re both not married at 35 we"ll have to get hitched). At worst I have a few drinks with a long time friend, at best I either get a fun non-attachments lay or possibly start something more.

She said she was in town, but that a friend was having a going away thing that night and she wouldn"t be able to make dinner, but might come out for a drink later. I texted back that I"d let her know where we ended up. Later I sent her this text, fully intending the double meaning and expecting her to pick up on it:

"Looks like we are just gonna have a few more drinks at Dan"s and pass out, long day. We will have to hook up next time."

Her response: "Yes, next time you need to come visit just me."

I sent her another text back letting her know I"d be through town several times in the next couple weeks as I"m flying from there to Peru, and then coming back to take an avvy course the following week, and left it at that. It"ll probably end up being yet another chapter in our long history of not hooking up, but who knows right?

Dabamf said:

Heh, I feel like if I post any more details about the situation to justify my position I"m gonna be accused of being delusional, so I"m just gonna not bother arguing about it until I find out the real reason.

But anyway, thanks for the feedback. I really just wanted another perspective to see if I was making a big deal out of nothing or not.

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Welcome to the TGWBYHT thread where everyone knows everything about you based upon a few hundred (or in my case, thousand) words that you"ve posted that might represent 5% of the dynamics of your situation. Keep that in mind next time you"re lecturing someone else about how blind or delusional they are, because the shoe is absolutely on the other foot here.

I agree with the consensus. Without bothering to theorize fucked up scenarios of what the real reasoning is, it absolutely raises a huge flapping red flag. Relationships are built on trust and honesty and all that shit, right? How you handle it I would say depends mostly on what you"re wanting out of the relationship. If this is just "dating" and it"s most likely not going to be a long term thing, roll with it and continue gently prodding. If you are going for something more (sorry, I haven"t followed your posts overly close), then I would absolutely force the issue and deal with the consequences.

"Ultimatum" may not be the right word, but I wouldn"t tolerate the present situation much longer without making some headway.

Brad said:

Anyways, how did you guys know? Was it something discussed or was it something that just happened?

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Typically in my experience it"s fairly obvious, whether you have an actual conversation about being "exclusive" or just through each other"s actions. I would feel like I"m back in junior high asking a girl to be my "girlfriend", though.

TheCutlery said:

You can know what you"re talking about all you fucking want, but when you"re IN the relationship, you absolutely cannot have the same objectivity if it was your friend. If Eomer posted the same shit you have over the last few weeks, you"d be riding him hard, and don"t even say you wouldn"t.

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My point exactly.

ToeMissile said:

The culture gap in Dabamf"s situation makes a shit done of difference in the way things need to be addressed and pursued. The majority of you commenting are looking at it from a western perspective.

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That"s a pretty good point as well. I mean shit, even cultural differences aside, the language barrier is a pretty major issue. That definitely tempers what I said above, somewhat.

Tarrant220 said:

Spent almost all day with Michele, I"m really digging her so far...not much new to report that I haven"t said already...she said a lot more things today to really confirm she"s just as much into me as I am into her. We"ve planned to spend Thanksgiving together and we"re probably spending most of next weekend together for her birthday...she"s all excited that I took the weekend off and frankly, I am too it should be a good time.

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I wouldn"t want to bias your situation with my experiences, but I thought and said many of the same things you have been lately about Anne, and we all know how that turned out. Just make sure you don"t get ahead of her, and in fact stay a couple steps behind.

Yeah I"m kinda nervous about the holiday stuff. I"m going out with her and her friends on Friday for her birthday, we have her Thanksgiving stuff that Saturday, a concert on Sunday, my Thanksgiving stuff Thursday and Friday. Just strikes me as waaaaaaay too much time together. I"d consider dropping the concert but I really want to go. Obviously I won"t see her at all until Friday.

Dabamf said:

Whyme is absolutely right. In addition to having great advice, the point about things not being cut and dry that when there"s an issue at all its time to say "ok you"re in column B of lying bitches and we"re breaking up" is right on. Coming out with "it"s time to dump her" is a pretty good sign you have no idea how to handle not only women, but people in general, and your experiences are extremely limited.

I had to reread my original post to make sure I said it accurately because the response here is honestly really confusing. I expected a mixture of "yea that"s a little strange," and "why are you picking a fight about something you said you don"t even care about that much?" The post is quite strongly my side of the story, but it is all truth so I"m still confused at the response.

Anyway...she came over last night and we talked about it. I would say everyone is fucking insane in this thread and it turns out there is no issue or secret, but since I haven"t actually seen the apartment and the Mexican family hiding inside, I"m just blind and hopelessly dumb. Which is ironic since if you"ve read this thread for a while it"s quite obvious I know what the fuck I"m talkin about and anyone who actually knows me knows I"m one of the last guys on theplanetthat would ever be told "dude she"s lying to you and you are hopelessly oblivious."

Aaannyyway, we talked about it and resolved it. I didn"t give her an ultimatum because I"m not a 12 year old and if someone gave me an ultimatum about anything I"d likely give them the middle finger instead. She started off with the whole "no reason" line again. But, and here is where actually being there holds water over speculating from 2nd hand info, it was quite obvious she was wholly convinced there was no reason for it. As opposed to trying to hide something, I can easilly tell a different between the two especially when it"s talked about twice now. (And that"s not some special power I"m claiming to have by the way. When you get that uneasy dreadful feeling, that"s your lie detection going off. That"s when self-delusions usually kick in). So, I decided I"d have to find a roundabout way to convince her that she had a reason even if she didn"t know it, without jamming it down her throat. I explained, if the situations were reversed, if it ended up causing a fight like it did I would have gaven in and agreed to see my apartment if I truly had no special reason for denying her, regardless of my desire. I used a few other subtle techniques to make herwantto discover the reason and explain it to me and finally she did.

What I gathered was, and again there"s a language barrier, is her apartment is sorta her only private area. She said she has a hard time letting anyone into her apartment, and especially so since it"s packed to the gills with supplies from her work. I took that, and restated what I thought she was trying to say (again her English comprehension > my Korean comprehension) and she said that was it exactly.

The resistance on Saturday I"m guessing was a couple things. One, me being kinda pushy and demanding with her about it as if I had a right to go to her apartment whenever I please was probably a bad way to go about it. But also I think that since she wasn"t aware of the actual reasons she was apprehensive about taking me there, she couldn"t logically override them. Like, if all you know is you don"t want something, no amount of reason can probably pursuade you. But if you know the reason, you can be rationally convinced if it turns out that reason isn"t that important.

Anyway that is my conclusion. She gave me a lot of shit for frustratingly joking about her having a kid or another boyfriend on Saturday. Now you can say that after 3 months we should be completely open or something is wrong, but the language barrier makes our intimacy level probably not much beyond 1 month. She has been apprehensive about me seeing her apartment...well on the other hand I told her "I played a few video games and just hung out" when she asked me about my weekend (since I had to stay in and nurse my knee that is potentially seriously injured), when in fact I played EQ project 1999 literally ALL day Fri-Sun. So, I can understand wanting to keep something private and having a difficult time sharing absolutely everything.

And...she said after the conversation that I can come over any time I want.

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Lol you"re so delusional and naive.

Her "private area"? LOL? You"re blind. Wednesdays used to be my private days also; aka weekly playdates with Chris and John.

Again, after our talk she said I can come over any time I want. So, the mexican family, 2 black dudes and Korean boyfriend that she plans on marrying while she fucks me on the side have all moved out. And I"m guessing they"ll be strategically replaced with dunkin donuts boxes to be more consitent with what she told me. Or maybe they"ll all just be hiding inside the boxes when I"m over. Better come talking about deck work I need done, some fried chicken, and Russian prostitutes to lure them out of their hiding.

If you recall, I am frequently quick to point out that a chick just isn"t into you, you"re handling x,y,z wrong, etc. But I have also on multiple occasions came here trying to chill the naysayers the fuck out and offer a positive outlook. Because this thread has grown from too many disastrous posts and too few people giving feedback enough to be convincing, to a smaller number of posts and a baseball stadium full of doomsday predictors.

Anyway, I"m resisting the urge to provide more information so people can better understand my circumstance. Because if I said that she wants to quit her job and follow me wherever I go (she didn"t say that) and gives me blowjobs while we"re walking down the street, people would find some way to skew that into me trying to delude myself further. So it"s a waste of time. All I can do is what I advised Eomer to do before: stop arguing with people and just give em a giant ascii middle finger when they"re wrong and I get to call them dumbfuck virgins.

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To the dude wanting to confess his love for his friend. My philosophy is just do it. You"re gonna think about it every day any way and it"s just gonna eat at your brain. In my mind the friendship is already over because friends are 2 people who can rely on each other and enjoy each other"s company and one isn"t constantly wanting to fuck the other one. That"s my definition of friendship. Desire unbalances a friendship, and friendship relies on balance. So, become a man and make your move (ie send her the Package in the mail, or a severed head, or something). I can be friends with women I want to sleep with, but if I want to date them, I can"t be friends with them. It"s impossible. So it"s over anyway.

So if you know about the Mexican family, the two black dudes and the Korean boyfriend then why are you still with her?

chu said:

Lol you"re so delusional and naive.

Her "private area"? LOL? You"re blind. Wednesdays used to be my private days also; aka weekly playdates with Chris and John.

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Not all girls are sluts that get DPed every week.

Ok, well we"ll have to see what comes out of it if you do happen to go over "any time you want". From what I recall, you were meant to go there on the 31st and nothing came off it. For all we know, she could have just said it to get you off her back and will steer clear of it next time.

Eomer is correct; you don"t have as much objectivity since you"re in the situation yourself.

Dabamf said:

Not all girls are sluts that get DPed every week.

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I wouldn"t know. I"m a guy and I generally do all the penetrating. Carry on.

Chu said:

Eomer is correct; you don"t have as much objectivity since you"re in the situation yourself.

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Minor point, but that"s not what I meant to say and I don"t think I really did. Lots of other guys did for sure though, and I agree to some extent. I was just kind of saying "hah, welcome to my world!" basically. And I agree with what Dabamf just recently said as well, there is most definitely a bias towards "OMG DISASTER GET THE FUCK OUT NOW" type advice in this thread, but I think most of the guys doing the asking know which responses are valid and which aren"t, at least to some extent.

Dabamf said:

Not all girls are sluts that get DPed every week.

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Guys usually view them as such when they aren"t dating one, lol. But you are, so you don"t.

Have the two of you even had sex yet?

Bias towards the fantastic aside, the rationalization of the situation is more damning than the situation itself. And honestly is what gives the most insight into whats "really" going on. Maybe her dishonesty isn"t about something serious (or MORE serious), but your tap dancing to rationalize it lets us know where you stand.

Yeah, my GF of 3 months wont let me come over and every time i mention it she shuts down and refuses to even discuss it. She also lies about a future date, with no explanation given. I dont push the issue cuz im not 12 and the adult thing is to be shady and dishonest. Its ok tho because I also lie to her to play video games.

Your meat world friends should already be slapping the shit out of you.

I"m laughing as I"m typing this because this whole thing has just turned preposterous. *I* mentioned the apartment thingon here onlymonths ago because it was confusing to me but it has NEVER arisen as an issue between me and her until this mini mini argument we had on Saturday. Oct. 31 was given as a "I"ll be ok with it then" not as "Oct31 is the date we go see it." And it was resolved, she said I can go any time now. If she"s lying, she"s got the IQ of a brick because it"s a lie that I can verify the next time I decide I wanna go to her god damn apartment.

Situation summary: we"ve been dating for 3 months, she is not comfortable with me seeing her apartment, and we got in a (read: ONE) mini mini argument about it on Saturday, and she as agreed to let me go any time I want in the future.You guys are seriously totally fucking insane. If you"re just trolling, then well done, because your responses make less sense than that fucking pancake rabbit.

YOUdon"t think it"s a big issue but most everyone here is saying that it IS an issue. If she"s getting fisted by her fucking brother, you may be cool with it but everyone else with open eyes isn"t.

Way to get your panties in a bunch when people don"t agree with you. You posted your relationship out in the open to be criticized so deal with it.

You do understand the issue has nothing to do with your "arguement" right? Whether it was micro or wittle or teenie weenie. Its that your GF of three months wont let you enter or see her home. And the issue isn"t resolved even when you see where she lives and she explains what the fucking problem was to begin with. The issue is she does not trust you, and does not feel the need to be open with you. Even when it looks really bad, and im sure hurts your feelings.


Guys, guys its ok, the arguement was TINY and now she said I can come over anytime! I haven"t actually been over tho, because I know its not acceptable, but one day! Whew problem solved! I weep for when someone cut/pastes some earlier conversations on the topic in here.