Indiana...Religious Freedom eh? *sigh*

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tad10

Elisha Dushku
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Definitionally defined terms are not tautological fallacies.
Theism is A. A-theism is Not A. And that right there is your tautology.
By definition, a lack of belief is not a belief. Therefore atheism cannot be a religion. This is definitional.
And that's another tautology. You can describe your belief that there is no God as a lack of belief in God, but it's still a belief.

Belief: N. Confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof.

You are confident in the truth that there is no God. God's existence or non-existence is not subject to rigorous proof. Anyway, last post on this subject in this thread. Keep spinning your wheels on this subject if you want, but deep down you know you're wrong or you wouldn't try so hard to bullshit me. I don't usually bother with the atheism thread because its mostly a circle-jerk of folks like you.

It actually is how our Constitutional law works: Supreme Court hears a case, makes a decision, and that decision is final.
Edit: Decided that's an unfair appeal to authority considering I'm attacking hodj for his idiotic appeal to authority. So I'll leave it at - USSC decision are not set in stone the way you seem to think.

Using one genetic fallacy to defend another genetic fallacy when the article cited points out that every single peer reviewed look at Wikipedia's articles demonstrate their validity isn't a rebuttal. Its a cop out. A pathetic, shitty one at that.
Wikipedia is riddled with inaccuracies and bias something the GamerGate folks were forced to find out the hard way. But keep on believin'


Clearly whether you consciously want Jim Crow back, the policy you support is how Jim Crow came to be in the first place, so arguing for your position is, in fact, stating you would like to take us back to Jim Crow
Again you prove that you think everyone is a racist and federal power must be used to coerce people to behave properly.

I on the other hand, think we live in a country where everyone is not a racist, however I think everyone, including racists such as yourself, have the right to speak and behave as they see fit as long as they aren't acting or behaving criminally.
 

hodj

Vox Populi Jihadi
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Theism is A. A-theism is Not A. And that right there is your tautology.
tau?tol?o?gy
t?'t?l?je/Submit
noun

LOGIC
a statement that is true by necessity or by virtue of its logical form.
Would you like to try again. In logical forms, a tautology based on definitions is not a fallacy, which is what you're attempting to claim here, that this is a tautological fallacy. Incorrect. A tautology based on definitional forms is necessarily true by virtue of its logical form. A = A and A does not equal Not A. A-theism is a lack of theism. It is Not A. This is not fallacious. This is factual, definitionally defined, and true by necessity.

Try again dipshit.

And that's another tautology.
Tad you seem to be having trouble understanding that tautologies which are definitional are not fallacies of logic.

You can describe your belief that there is no God as a lack of belief in God, but it's still a belief.
A cannot equal Not A. You're wrong by definition.

Belief: N. Confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof.
That's nice. Too bad atheism is a lack of this, and therefore can't be it.

By definition.

You are confident in the truth that there is no God.
No, I'm confident in the belief that your particular flavor of a god does not exist. I don't know that no gods exist absolutely.

God's existence or non-existence is not subject to rigorous proof.
Things which exist are demonstrable. Until such time as you can demonstrate something exists, lack of belief in that positive claim is the default position. So in that way, yes, actually, your magical sky fairy man is either non existent, or subject to rigorous proof.

Anyway, last post on this subject in this thread.
Because you don't have a rebuttal to the factual statement that A = A and does not equal Not A in the same way that 2 and 2 equate to 4 DEFINITIONALLY.

Keep spinning your wheels on this subject if you want, but deep down you know you're wrong or you wouldn't try so hard to bullshit me.
No, I know for a fact you're wrong, which is why I'm pointing it out over and over again until you get it through that thick fucking skull of yours that you are wrong.

I don't usually bother with the atheism thread because its mostly a circle-jerk of folks like you.
You don't bother with it, because your argument is shit as I've demonstrated here. Its a waste of time trying to argue a losing position, which is why you're going to run away from this now.

As the only person in this thread with an A+ in Constitutional Law from a well-known top 14 Law School
Appeal to authority fallacy.

let me end this discussion on this topic by simply saying: please shut the fuck up about something you know nothing about.
He says while asserting that 2 and 2 equating to 4 is a tautological fallacy.

Clearly I know more than you do about it, since you're here arguing that sometime in the future, the Supremes will return us to Jim Crow style laws, which is never going to happen.


Wikipedia is riddled with inaccuracies and bias
Incorrect. All peer reviewed research to date contradicts this claim. It has as many errors as Encyclopedia Britannica. Trying to defend your appeal to genetic fallacy by making unsubstantiated accusations isn't an argument or rebuttal either.

something the GamerGate folks were forced to find out the hard way. But keep on believin'
I'll tell you what. Find us one peer review source that states that Wikipedia has more errors with its articles than a regular encyclopedia and I'll cede your argument wikipedia is an invalid reference source.

It doesn't exist so good luck!

Again you prove that you think everyone is a racist and federal power must be used to coerce people to behave properly.
This is just a strawman attempting to avoid the actual issue: This nation has a historical record of discriminatory policies by private businesses which directly impacted the lives and rights of minority populations, and this led to the Supreme Court putting an end to that activity. Whether you like it or not, this is a fact.

I on the other hand, think we live in a country where everyone is not a racist, however I think everyone, including racists such as yourself, have the right to speak and behave as they see fit as long as they aren't acting or behaving criminally.
This is just soapboxing your strawdog.

Does this country have a history of social discrimination against minorities, yes or no? Was that discrimination protected by law, yes or no? Did that discrimination lead to segregation and civil unrest, yes or no?

Did the Supreme Court find that these policies were Unconstitutional and that the Federal Government has a right to regulate this activity based on its impact on interstate commerce, yes or no?

Since all of these questions must be answered with yes, your entire line of reasoning is one big fat strawman devoid of historical context, and your attempts to slander others as racists because these facts are inconvenient to your position is just an example of how pathetically weak your argument is, that you have to try and paint others as racist....as a means of justifying your position that discrimination in private industry is a Constitutionally protected right, which is a conclusion contrary to all evidence, Supreme Court rulings of the past half century and more and unjustified based on even an extremely broad reading of the right to free association, which covers organizing for political and cultural and religious ends, but does not include a right to discriminate against others in your business dealings.

What you need to do is put up or shut up. Show us a case, that hasn't been overturned in the past 100 years, where the Supremes determined that the 1st amendment right to free association gives a business person a right to discriminate based on sexual orientation, race, color, religion, creed, etc.

It doesn't exist, so again, GOOD LUCK DUMB FUCK.
 

Asshat wormie

2023 Asshat Award Winner
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You do realize you are arguing logic with a dumb ass, right?
 

hodj

Vox Populi Jihadi
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A noble cause but this particular fight you will lose.
Lol.

If we can't break him of his delusions, we can at least cause him to have a complete mental breakdown like Moon bat, Bakunin and Lumie.

That's always entertaining for everyone involved, imo.
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
599
I'm confident in thebelief
Clearly I know more than you do about it, since you're here arguing that sometime in the future,the Supremes will return us to Jim Crow style laws, which is never going to happen.
Please provide a link to where I said this - since you can't, let me ask you do you usually try to win arguments by falsely attributing statements to the folks you're arguing with?


I'll tell you what. Find us one peer review source that states that Wikipedia has more errors with its articles than a regular encyclopedia and I'll cede your argument wikipedia is an invalid reference source.
Try citing Wikipedia in a law journal in you'll get laughed at.

This is just a strawman attempting to avoid the actual issue: This nation has a historical record of discriminatory policies by private businesses which directly impacted the lives and rights of minority populations, and this led to the Supreme Court putting an end to that activity. Whether you like it or not, this is a fact.
This is just a deflection attempt to avoid the fact that you have made multiple blanket racist statements in this debate. You think a majority of this country wants segregation and Jim Crow to return.

ProTip: You are flat out insane.

Did the Supreme Court find that these policies were Unconstitutional and that the Federal Government has a right to regulate this activity based on its impact on interstate commerce, yes or no?
Pretty sure I asked the relevant question first: Please explain how Ollie's Barbeque had an impact on interstate commerce.

What you need to do is put up or shut up. Show us a case, that hasn't been overturned in the past 100 years, where the Supremes determined that the 1st amendment right to free association gives a business person a right to discriminate based on sexual orientation, race, color, religion, creed, etc.

It doesn't exist, so again, GOOD LUCK DUMB FUCK.
All CAPS? You are super serial buddy. Right of Association trumped in Boy Scouts case and should trump in the intra-state no-gay cake case. As noted, the CRA of 1964 relies on the Commerce Clause Power which does not apply to purely intra-state Commerce.

You get an F in ConLaw.
 

hodj

Vox Populi Jihadi
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Please provide a link to where I said this
When you argued that businesses have a right to discriminate based on the 1st amendment right to free association.

Whether you like it or not, that is what you're arguing for. Whether you agree with it or not is irrelevant. The fact is that arguing that businesses can restrict access to their services based on the characteristics of their customers is, in fact, arguing for taking us back to the days when blacks couldn't eat at the same tables and counters with whites.

since you can't
Except I just did.

let me ask you do you usually try to win arguments by falsely attributing statements to the folks you're arguing with?
Nope, and I didn't do that here. Stay mad that your argument is, in fact, an attempt to return us to Jim Crow.

Try citing Wikipedia in a law journal in you'll get laughed at.
We're not publishing in a peer reviewed journal here, and this is both a non sequitor, and a really stupid attempt to continue to try and defend a position that you can't actually back up with any peer reviewed evidence. Again: Wikipedia is not used academically because its fucking lazy. You know what you can do, in a law journal, though? Use citations drawn from the source material that wikipedia uses to construct its articles.

This is just a deflection attempt
Tad back to "I'm rubber you're glue" defense again.

Your argument: Being against businesses discriminating against patrons based on the Supreme Court decisions of the 60s isracist.

the fact that you have made multiple blanket racist statements in this debate.
Citation required

ProTip: You are flat out insane.
That's nice. Notice how you've run out of argument to make? Its because you're wrong.



You think a majority of this country wants segregation and Jim Crow to return.
Citation required on me claiming the majority of this countrywantsto return to Jim Crow, citation on the idea that the majority of the country agrees with you that businesses should be able to discriminate against customers based on their sexual orientation as well.

All CAPS?
Nitpicking and crying isn't a rebuttal either.

Right of Association trumped in Boy Scouts case and should trump in the intra-state no-gay cake case
Incorrect. Boy Scouts is a non profit, private, religious organization, which is exactly what the right to free assocation was written to protect.

Private businesses are not.

You want your business to discriminate against customers, then make it a non profit private religious organization. But then you couldn't make any money. Too bad so sad.

As noted, the CRA of 1964 relies on the Commerce Clause Power which does not apply to purely intra-state Commerce.
There is no such thing as purely intra-state Commerce, but even if there were, the Feds would still have authority to regulate discriminatory business practices because they impact interstate trade.

You get an F in ConLaw.
rrr_img_93778.jpg
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
599
Whether you like it or not, that is what you're arguing for
Yeah. No. That's not how reality works.

Wikipedia is not used academically because its fucking lazy.
No. Because its inaccurate.



Citation required on me claiming the majority of this countrywantsto return to Jim Crow
Citation provided.

And the social consequences of this viewpoint you are expressing is that you'd tear our civilization apart at the seams. Blacks only serving blacks. Whites only serving whites. Gays only serving gays. Christians only interacting with Christians. Muslims only interacting with Muslims.
There is no such thing as purely intra-state Commerce
There absolutely is.


I get that you only argue by ignoring reality and pretending that something is as you need it to be to make a point but that just shows that you're too retarded to come up with actual, you know, arguments.
 

hodj

Vox Populi Jihadi
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Yeah. No. That's not how reality works.
Actually, that's exactly how reality works.

No. Because its inaccurate.
Peer reviewed citation required.



Citation provided.
K. There's literally nothing racist in that statement. And everyone reading this but you recognizes that fact.

There absolutely is.
No, there's not.

I get that you only argue by ignoring reality
Says the guy who thinks magic space wizards are real, despite all evidence to the contrary, and that discrimination by businesses against people based on their fundamental characteristics is a Constitutionally protected activity, despite all evidence to the contrary, and thinks wikipedia is full of errors, despite all evidence to the contrary.

I get that you have a problem grasping basic facts, reasoning and logic, because you are not a smart man. That's what I get.

and pretending that something is as you need it to be to make a point but that just shows that you're too retarded to come up with actual, you know, arguments.
All I'm seeing here is Tad flailing wildly trying to make a point.

Also seems like he's running out of steam.

Let us know when you come up with...any of the citations and peer reviewed evidence requested that you have thus far failed to provide, Tard10.
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
599
K. There's literally nothing racist in that statement. And everyone reading this but you recognizes that fact. .
K. You're insane. Not only is it racist, but your statement is also homophobic, Christophobic and Islamophobic.

/thread
 

khalid

Unelected Mod
14,071
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I take it then, that you agree with hodj that we're all secret racists who want to bring back Jim Crow?
I don't know about wormie, but I think you are quite obviously a bigot and would be quite happy to return us to an era where people could discriminate against others at will.
 

hodj

Vox Populi Jihadi
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And tad admits defeat resoundingly with almost no effort on my part required.

Here's what I want from you, tard10.

I want you to explain,in detailhow you have reached a conclusion that statement is racist.

Because I want everyone else to laugh at how fucking stupid you are when you try to defend this claim with your wildly absurdist presumptions.
 

Rhuma_sl

shitlord
762
0
K. You're insane. Not only is it racist, but your statement is also homophobic, Christophobic and Islamophobic.

/thread
That's probably the worst debate I've ever seen on this forum and in any other media.

You're bad and you should feel bad.

There's no god, until you prove to the contrary, you're not allowed to discriminate against people because God. You got a problem with it? Tough shit.
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
599
I want you to explain,in detailhow you have reached a conclusion that statement is racist.

.
Your racist statement speaks for itself and the fact that you are trying so hard to walk it back shows that you know it's racist

I don't know about wormie, but I think you are quite obviously a bigot and would be quite happy to return us to an era where people could discriminate against others at will.
Apparently you are quite happy with thought police.
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,533
599
There's no god, until you prove to the contrary, you're not allowed to discriminate against people because God. You got a problem with it? Tough shit.
The Free Exercise Clause says otherwise. You got a problem with it? Move to another country.