Justice for Zimmerman

porkchop sandwiches · Jul 14, 2013

Kreugen · Jul 14, 2013

Cad_sl said:
You go try it, and tell us how it works out for you.

The trick is to be sure there are no witnesses. That's why Zimmerman set up the ultimate show down right out on the sidewalk in front of multiple apartments.

Siddar · Jul 14, 2013

Mist_sl said:
So let's say a man is stalking a woman at dusk with intent to rape. He goes to grab her, she turns and pulls a knife. He then shoots her. Should he not be charged with a crime?

If you can prove he was going to rape her then no it was murder. I do not think you can claim self defense while in commission of a crime. You cant claim self defense in a bank robbery when you kill a security guard because he had a gun and was trying to stop you by potentially lethal means. If someone is walking down street and a women suddenly attacks them with a knife yes there allowed to defend themselves. To claim self defense in your scenario he will have to explain why he grabbed the women in a convincing enough manner for it not to be seen as the potential start of a criminal act. There is a difference between a punch and a grab someone maybe grabbing you to stop you from being hit by a bus. While punching a random stranger on the street is 100% a case of assault.

The key is who makes the first move. All evidence so far supports the claim that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman first as a result Trayvon was committing a criminal act against Zimmerman. Because of that Zimmerman shooting Trayvon was a act of self defense. If prosecution had proved Zimmerman had thrown the first punch then Zimmerman would have been guilty of murder. Someone following you down a street is not grounds for you assaulting them. Public streets and sidewalks are public property and others have just as much right to use them as you. That right to use includes the right to walk around looking for potential criminals and reporting them to the police.

It all comes down to the old axiom most boys learned from there fathers. That being you never throw the first punch but after that its completely fine to throw the last punch.

Arbitrary · Jul 14, 2013

Vaclav_sl said:
And of course the silliness of SYG is a bit more apparent now

STAND YOUR GROUND IS NOT PART OF THIS MOTHERFUCKING CASE YOU MOTHERFUCKING IDIOT.

Abefroman · Jul 14, 2013

Vaclav_sl said:
I guess all you people understand Shock Trauma better than people that did it for 14 years at one of the best Shock Trauma facilities on the planet. And yes, my sister in law did comment on Facebook, but I know her credentials which are amongst the highest tier on the planet. (Although she's been out of service there for 2 years since having children and working U of M Shock Trauma isn't a good combo) [And note, she wasn't posting it in defense of TM, just like I'm not - just trying to defray the meme] Plus again my own personal history in that case - that "curb stomping" was by a 16 year old about Trayvon's size roughly and was done in THREE 'smashings' FYI. (And as stated, was horrendously worse - pictures looked like the dude from Mask almost - but incredibly bloody)

And "6 blows to the head" isn't only "smashes into the ground" it can be any host of damaging injuries of appropriate force. That broken nose, clearly from a punch? That's a fucking blow to the head. If you're referencing "6 blows to the back of the head" with the minor severity of them it's pretty goddam clear that it was from punching the dude ON concrete and the force applying at the back of the head some, not a direct smashing. Unless he's got a skull that's a good bit thicker than the normal human that is.

You do understand that "science" came from the defense right, specifically caged to make him look best - but nevermind your retarded meme circle jerk - continue believing things that weren't evidenced as evidenced. (Not that it matters in the outcome of things - which was appropriate)

[And note, I've watched about 5-6 hrs of coverage on it - so yes, I don't know that specific comment perfectly - why I caged it for either variant]

Confirmed you didn't watch the trial. Let me educate you. That defense witness that you bring up framing things in the best light for the defense. He is so well respected that the prosecution didn't even refute his findings AT ALL. In fact the prosecution conceded that the ME of the state was INCOMPETENT.

Mist · Jul 14, 2013

Arbitrary_sl said:
STAND YOUR GROUND IS NOT PART OF THIS MOTHERFUCKING CASE YOU MOTHERFUCKING IDIOT.

He didn't say it was, he was talking about another case, quote the rest of the sentence.

spronk · Jul 14, 2013

whats the protocol now for interacting with black people? hippie white girl at whole foods is no problem, when she shakes her smelly hair and says she is moving to canada I can just kinda nod and not say anything, but what if the store clerk at my home depot is black and he starts talking about how there is no justice in america, I'm not sure what to do - I need to watch some kevin hart or something, doesn't seem like chris rock material is gonna work well here.

Also it goes without saying I will not be eating out for at least 3 weeks, since I have no idea if a black person will be in the chain of custody of my food and/or if there will be any black food vigilantism going on.

Abefroman · Jul 14, 2013

Arbitrary_sl said:
STAND YOUR GROUND IS NOT PART OF THIS MOTHERFUCKING CASE YOU MOTHERFUCKING IDIOT.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

hodj · Jul 14, 2013

Vaclav_sl said:
I think Mist is talking about all the UNEVIDENCED things that Zimmerman might have done to intimidate Trayvon into starting the fight

Speculation based on personal bias has no place in this discussion. That's the point. Mist needs to either put up some evidence, and you do as well, or you both need to shut up and stop regurgitating nonsense. I can speculate Martin came up and tried to rape Zimmerman, provoking him to shoot him, the same amount of evidence exists for that theory as does Mist's and your versions of events (read: None.)

Cad · Jul 14, 2013

Abefroman_sl said:
Confirmed you didn't watch the trial. Let me educate you. That defense witness that you bring up framing things in the best light for the defense. He is so well respected that the prosecution didn't even refute his findings AT ALL. In fact the prosecution conceded that the ME of the state was INCOMPETENT.

The prosecutions entire case was "THIS WAS A CHILD WHO BOUGHT SKITTLES. ZIMMERMAN SAID HE DIDNT KNOW THE NAME OF THE STREET BUT HE DID! AND THOSE PARENTS NEED JUSTICE. MURDER 2 PLZ KTHX"

Abefroman · Jul 14, 2013

Mist_sl said:
He didn't say it was, he was talking about another case, quote the rest of the sentence.

"And of course the silliness of SYG is a bit more apparent now"

The rest doesn't matter because you are trying to use this case to prove the SYG is silly.

Gavinmad · Jul 14, 2013

Stand Your Ground was a huge part of the media circus around this case, which is what Vaclav was talking about. I too found out about several completely ridiculous cases where SYG was applied, and I never would have found out about them if it weren't for the hullabaloo surrounding this one.

You guys need to improve your reading comprehension.

Mist · Jul 14, 2013

Abefroman_sl said:
Confirmed you didn't watch the trial. Let me educate you. That defense witness that you bring up framing things in the best light for the defense. He is so well respected that the prosecution didn't even refute his findings AT ALL. In fact the prosecution conceded that the ME of the state was INCOMPETENT.

I agree, and I'm glad Zimmerman got off due to the incompetence of the state and because of how the legal system is setup. But I think people have every right to be mad at how incompetent the state was with regards to this case. The state of Florida should have been on trial all along, not Zimmerman.

Arbitrary · Jul 14, 2013

Mist_sl said:
He didn't say it was, he was talking about another case, quote the rest of the sentence.

He said that without the Trayvon Martin case he never would have known about the silliness of Stand Your Ground.

So I'll say it again. This motherfucking case doesn't have a single motherfucking thing to do with motherfucking stand your ground and he's a motherfucking idiot for bringing it up.

Mist · Jul 14, 2013

Abefroman_sl said:
"And of course the silliness of SYG is a bit more apparent now"

The rest doesn't matter because you are trying to use this case to prove the SYG is silly.

No, he was talking about another case.

hodj · Jul 14, 2013

Why doesn't it occur to you that the State was incompetent in the case because there was no basis for their case in the first place, hence why the Sanford PD didn't charge Zimmerman in the first place, hence why a special prosecutor was called in when the race baiters showed up and demanded a show trial and hanging of Zimmerman to appease their bloodlust?

It wasn't incompetence. It was the fact that they had no case to begin with. Because Zimmerman DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG.

Gavinmad · Jul 14, 2013

Arbitrary_sl said:
He said that without the Trayvon Martin case he never would have known about the silliness of Stand Your Ground.

So I'll say it again. This motherfucking case doesn't have a single motherfucking thing to do with motherfucking stand your ground and he's a motherfucking idiot for bringing it up.

As I already said, there was a lot more to do with this case than just the things that were part of the trial.

Kaines · Jul 14, 2013

spronk_sl said:
whats the protocol now for interacting with black people? hippie white girl at whole foods is no problem, when she shakes her smelly hair and says she is moving to canada I can just kinda nod and not say anything, but what if the store clerk at my home depot is black and he starts talking about how there is no justice in america, I'm not sure what to do - I need to watch some kevin hart or something, doesn't seem like chris rock material is gonna work well here.

Also it goes without saying I will not be eating out for at least 3 weeks, since I have no idea if a black person will be in the chain of custody of my food and/or if there will be any black food vigilantism going on.

If you believe the prosecution's line of events (which you don't, but just saying), you should not speak to, approach, or in any way draw the attention of young black men. By doing so you are provoking a violent confrontation.

Mist · Jul 14, 2013

Arbitrary_sl said:
He said that without the Trayvon Martin case he never would have known about the silliness of Stand Your Ground.

So I'll say it again. This motherfucking case doesn't have a single motherfucking thing to do with motherfucking stand your ground and he's a motherfucking idiot for bringing it up.

Just because SYG wasn't used in his defense once it went to court doesn't mean it has nothing to do with the case. The reason he wasn't initially charged immediately after the incident WAS because of SYG.

hodj · Jul 14, 2013

Mist_sl said:
Just because SYG wasn't used in his defense once it went to court doesn't mean it has nothing to do with the case. The reason he wasn't initially charged immediately after the incident WAS because of SYG.

Wrong again.

SYG is a hearing that applies before a trial. You literally are talking directly out of your ass now.

The reason he wasn't initially charged was because it was a basic classic self defense case with no evidence of anything but.

Here's the FORMER SANFORD POLICE DEPARTMENT CHIEF who was in charge when Sanford PD declined to charge Zimmerman with a crime after the shooting.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/justic...ive/index.html

The George Zimmerman investigation was hijacked "in a number of ways" by outside forces, said the former police chief of Sanford, Florida.

Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice.

"It was (relayed) to me that they just wanted an arrest. They didn't care if it got dismissed later," he said. "You don't do that."

When Sanford police arrived on the scene on February 26, 2012, after Zimmerman fatally shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, they conducted a "sound" investigation, and the evidence provided no probable cause to arrest Zimmerman at the scene, he said.

It had nothing to do with Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, he said; from an investigative standpoint, it was purely a matter of self-defense.

Justice for Zimmerman

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