Justice for Zimmerman

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Gavinmad

Gavinmad

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Arbitrary_sl said:
I don't necessarily agree. With all the white people out there committing crimes and given how greatly they out number blacks I would think that the numbers shouldn't be so stark in contrast. We've got 433,934 crimes against whites and only 55,685 crimes by whites committed against blacks. On a nominal level whites should be beating out everyone in terms of victimization due to their over representation.
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Ignoring class and neighborhoods and what not, if 85% of the population is white and 15% is non-white, 85% of the crimes that non-whites commit should have white victims. 15% of the crimes that whites commit should have non-white victims.

The 433,934 vs 55,685 numbers are meaningless without at least the context of what larger numbers those numbers were pulled from.
 
Abefroman

Abefroman

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Numbers_sl said:
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Borzak

Borzak

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Lithose_sl said:
I don't think anyone is just mad at her for being dumb. I think most people here will openly say that's a failure on our part, our education system. What people are angry at is she is PROUD of it. And the adults who are educated and should KNOW better, support that pride. (And I know some will stretch this into a systemic problem in black culture, where they idolize bad habits, I won't comment on that, because frankly I can't make a call beyond anecdotal observations. I'm just speaking about THIS case. The amount of pride swirling around Jeantel's "boldness" is deeply disturbing. I'd be, frankly, pissed if I heard a normal Italian praising Snooky for her "boldness" and what a "proud" Italian woman she was.)
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I bet there are lots of other students who went to the same exact schools she has gone to that speak english very well and don't speak ebonics. I'm also going to say that probably most of the white students that she went to school with don't speak like her.

I have people who went to the same school I did who work for me in the shop that can't sign their own name and have a wife/girlfriend pick up their check and sign for it.
 
Arbitrary

Arbitrary

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Gavinrad_sl said:
Ignoring class and neighborhoods and what not, if 85% of the population is white and 15% is non-white, 85% of the crimes that non-whites commit should have white victims. 15% of the crimes that whites commit should have non-white victims.

The 433,934 vs 55,685 numbers are meaningless without at least the context of what larger numbers those numbers were pulled from.
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You didn't say those numbers were meaningless. You said those numbers make sense from a statistical point of view. I say that nominally in terms of numbers of crimes committed that there should be more crimes by whites against blacks than the reverse given the massive difference in populations. Even if I accept that 85% of the crimes that black commit are against whites due to characteristics of the population (I don't) and 15% of the crimes committed by whites will be against non-whites for the same reason, we've still got an eightfold difference nominally.
 
hodj

hodj

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Tanoomba_sl said:
Here's the situation:
I studied language acquisition. It's important to what I do. I'm not an authority by any means, but when I tell you something about the nature of language, it's because that's a conclusion generations of people studying languages and language acquisition have come to. You respond with out-of-your-ass bullshit that is objectively wrong, after once again missing the point I've made, and then congratulate yourself on winning the argument you made up in your head. You constantly, constantly demand "proof" of arguments being made against you, but you have clearly shown that you are more than willing to ignore proof altogether if it doesn't suit your needs. This board is your personal masturbation chamber, and you're just here to spooge on our faces. If that's how you get your jollies that's totally fine (more power to you), but don't pretend you're actually engaging in some kind of debate.
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Here's the real situation:

Every time you try to call hillbilly or ebonics a language, what you do is take a giant crap on the languages which have spent hundreds, to thousands of years, being systematized, formalized, and passed on generation to generation. Every person who has spent decades of their lives learning to master languages like Mandarin and English, and people who have spent tens of millions of man hours conducting research to reassemble lost languages like the Mayan and Assyrian languages, has that effort diminished by just that little bit more every time some academic comes along and tries to define down the standards for what constitutes a "language" versus a dialect.
 
Blackyce

Blackyce

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Numbers_sl said:
Simply raging teenage hormones and wrestling with the emotional pain of a split up family coming through in his emails. We don't know for sure that Martin went back looking for a fight. You're just blinded by your racial hatred.
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I don't understand why you're making all these huge assumptions for TM, who did in fact use racist language, but not for GZ. Especially when the facts pretty much show the opposite of what you're saying.

So explain to me then: It is a fact, per Jeantel/DeeDee's testimony that TM made it back to his father's house. There is no evidence of TM being chased by GZ back to the spot of the incident about two blocks away. Explain then, if GZ was still following TM, how did they end up back in the eventual spot of the incident two blocks from TM's father's house?

Why are you so blatantly just dismissing GZ's testimony?
 
Tuco

Tuco

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I feel like the people who try to say that certain ways-people-talk are not dialects or languages have too much respect for the standards that are required for a language and dialect.

Frankly it seems too nebulous of definitions to care too much about. The bottom line is that if you live in a society that speaks a certain language and dialect you are only hurting yourself if you can not partake. And if your dialect happens to be spoken by outcasts of the society then you only have yourself to blame if you choose to stay in that dialect.
 
Borzak

Borzak

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Obama on TV in a press conference stirring it up. Talking about how black men suffer from more violent crime than any other group. Too bad he didn't mention who is comitting those crimes.

DOJ needs to get involved to help the local/state police to get "trust" back into the system.
Have to examine Stand Your Ground laws and get rid of them, they "may" lead to more violence, even tho he stated it wasn't used in a defense it leads to armed citizens using them for defense which isn't "peaceful".
 
Tanoomba

Tanoomba

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Tuco_sl said:
I feel like the people who try to say that certain ways-people-talk are not dialects or languages have too much respect for the standards that are required for a language and dialect.

Frankly it seems too nebulous of definitions to care too much about. The bottom line is that if you live in a society that speaks a certain language and dialect you are only hurting yourself if you can not partake. And if your dialect happens to be spoken by outcasts of the society then you only have yourself to blame if you choose to stay in that dialect.
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Agreed.
 
hodj

hodj

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Right. These guys always call for a big national discussion.

What does that accomplish again?

Have we not been having a big national conversation? Did we not have a month long, completely televised national show trial, in which the Prosecution failed to make its case in blatant and spectacular fashion? What purpose would a "national conversation" in which one party refuses to accept that Zimmerman isn't a white nationalist who hunted down Martin in the streets have? What could it accomplish?

Are we not having a big national conversation already? How much bigger does it need to be?

The phrase "We need to have a national conversation" roughly translates to "We need you to sit there and listen to us lecture you on how racist you are."

No thanks.
 
Cad

Cad

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Numbers_sl said:
What portion would you say is a failure? And define failure please.
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New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly confirms Mac Donald's facts. Blacks and Hispanics commit 96 percent of all crimes in the city

Etc
 
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