Justice for Zimmerman

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fanaskin

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This is a symptom of Federal expansion of power

"Possible Federal Prosecution of George Zimmerman, and the "Dual Sovereignty" Exception to the Double Jeopardy Clause"

http://www.volokh.com/2013/07/18/pos...opardy-clause/

The constitutional and practical underpinnings of the doctrine have eroded. The Double Jeopardy Clause, like many other fundamental criminal procedure rights, is now applicable to the states. And the exposure of criminal defendants to serial state and federal prosecutions has grown dramatically with the expansion of federal criminal jurisdiction.
 

fanaskin

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1:55

Muliculturism is used to perpetuate a caste system.

"for example, if the multiculutralists tell the schools that the schools shouldn't teach black students standard english learning standard english has a huge effect on a persons ability to get a job and their social mobility."
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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OCD much? (That's not really a question, please don't answer.)
ftfy



ftfy as well
rrr_img_37090.jpg
 

W4RH34D_sl

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1:55

Muliculturism is used to perpetuate a caste system.

"for example, if the multiculutralists tell the schools that the schools shouldn't teach black students standard english learning standard english has a huge effect on a persons ability to get a job and their social mobility."
NAh just let em learn ebonics, their language. Its a perfectly cromulent language and should embiggen their power to succeed on a global scale.
 

Vaclav

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This is a symptom of Federal expansion of power

"Possible Federal Prosecution of George Zimmerman, and the "Dual Sovereignty" Exception to the Double Jeopardy Clause"

http://www.volokh.com/2013/07/18/pos...opardy-clause/

The constitutional and practical underpinnings of the doctrine have eroded. The Double Jeopardy Clause, like many other fundamental criminal procedure rights, is now applicable to the states. And the exposure of criminal defendants to serial state and federal prosecutions has grown dramatically with the expansion of federal criminal jurisdiction.
Actually it might not be - since they opted against lesser included in the prosecution against Florida norms - that could actually explain why. Will be interesting to see if the DoJ brings him up on manslaughter since he never technically was charged with it from what has been seen and discussed in the thread. (They should lose it as well IMO Zimmerman is guilty of recklessness at worst, and I don't even think he meets the bar for criminal recklessness personally [although I'm far from an expert, 100% gut on saying that] - but "Double Jeopardy" only applies to the SAME CRIME - a second crime that occurs during the same event doesn't invoke double jeopardy, although most places have "lesser included" which would prevent this type of nonsense, but it would explain the oddity of them requesting it.)
 

Vaclav

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Ah the judge did allow it? I thought the judge disallowed their request to add manslaughter back on? I clearly misread the thread back when they requested it. Change my curiosity to criminal recklessness then I guess. (Although as stated I don't think that will get a guilty verdict either)

Main point was that Double Jeopardy is applied very narrowly - in that loose variant almost every single drug crime would be considered "Double Jeopardy" due to dual jurisdiction on how the laws are applied. (i.e. "Your gun crimes are going to the Fed, drug to the Fed, murder to the state, blah to the blah" happen very frequently with a single actual crime with many subcrimes)
 

hodj

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Nah it was the 3rd degree murder with child abuse charge that the prosecution tried to jam in at the very end that the Judge denied because she realized that was so far out of line with reality she couldn't get away with it.

What the DOJ has been asked to do is file some sort of hate crime charge, because the Federal crime wouldn't violate double jeopardy technically, but there's just no evidence to support it or the FBI would have filed that charge over a year ago when they conducted an investigation.
 

Gavinmad

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The judge said no the the lesser included charge of 'third degree murder based on child abuse' or however the prosecution phrased it. It was fucking ridiculous.
 

iannis

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Not to mention it's fundamentally charging him with the same crime twice.

You don't charge a man with armed robbery at the state level, find him not guilty, then go ahead and charge him with stealing stuff with a gun at the federal level.

I'm really serious about if the DoJ does that Congress needs to start impeachment. Presidents only get to shit on 1 amendment in the bill of rights per term. Not 3 at once. That's how it works.
 

Arbitrary

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Being charged in two different jurisdictions for the same crime is not new and is not double jeopardy. It just tends to hardly ever happen because there is not a ton of overlap between state and federal. There is no federal murder statute, for example, so unless you went and stabbed someone in a post office you'll never have federal charges raised against you.

I remember discussing hate crime legislation years ago and I took the position that I didn't think it was necessary. I said that if someone goes out and decides to kill someone because of their race that sounds like premeditation and that is going to be 1st or 2nd degree murder. I never thought to oppose the law on the grounds that it could be used as a way to put people on trial again for the same crime.
 

iannis

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If the administration's goal is to give the #occupy crowd a coherent message and give them common ground with the nutters in the tea party, that would seem to be a pretty good way to do it.

The Office of the President is granted the power of pardon, it is not granted the power of condemnation. Fucker thinks he's a king, and because Bill Clinton wanted to score massive points off that boy getting left to die tied to that fencepost, fucker has legal recourse to pretend like he is.
 

khalid

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It's absurd to say that Obama thinks he is a king. However, I really think it diminishes him as a president to be mucking around in cases like this. It was the same way with the Henry Louis Gates controversy. ESPECIALLY when every single piece of evidence points towards Zimmerman's innocence.

I mean, it really needs to be said over and over. There is NO controversy to this case, or at least there shouldn't be. You could hardly come up with a more textbook case of self-defense. Yet the president himself has helped to keep the controversy going. It is disgraceful.
 

fanaskin

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Being charged in two different jurisdictions for the same crime is not new and is not double jeopardy.
The founders of the constitution said the exact opposite thing, just because it eventually evolved as an encroaching practice does not mean it's just.
 

PosterOfStuff_sl

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I don't know what Obama has said before but after the court case Obama provided a response, where he said it could of been him at that age.

I took away from that he was talking about being an African American and having to put up with people locking cars when he approached them, being followed in stores and so on. I can remember Basketball players talking about being pulled up by cops all the time, only because they are Black and in a nice car. And sometimes it is just too much and you explode.

But then again as an African American Professor stated (which they showed on the TV after Obama) "if black youth would stop going down the path of crime then we would find a lot less racial profiling taking place"

I think Zimmerman racial profiled Trayvon and Trayvon just handled it wrong at the end of the day.
 

fanaskin

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I think zimmerman profiled trayvon non-racially he is biased against certain clothing and looking out of place.


What Do Zimmerman's Calls to Police Show About His View of Black Men?

http://www.thefacultylounge.org/2013...lack-men-.html

Zimmerman called about everything, this isn't the first thing he's called about and there's no real racist pattern to his calling.


8/12/04: Reports male driving pick-up without car seat
9/20/04: Neighbor's garage door open
8/20/04: Reportswhite malewalking in the road carrying a paper bag, presumably drinking
3/17/05: Pothole
4/27/05: Neighbor's garage door open
9/21/05: Stray dog
9/23/05: Couldn't reach his sister by phone
11/4/06: Reports pick-up driving around apartment complex for last five minutes "driving real slow looking at all the vehicles in the complex and blasting music"
6/24/07:Two Hispanic malesandone white maleloitering near pool; officer spoke to them and determined were locked out of their vehicle
10/14/07: Possible intentional damage to his car tire; thinks he knows who did it
11/25/07: Reports disturbance involving his ex-roommate, a white male
1/5/09: Fire alarm going off
3/12/09: Requests patrol outside his home for a week while he's away
5/4/09: Reports blue Audi; unclear why
6/10/09: Fire alarm going off
6/16/09: People jumping over the fenceand going into the pool area, playing basketball, trashing the bathroom; reports make and model of car
8/21/09: Disturbance involving landlord over rent and foreclosure
8/26/09: Male driving without headlights
9/7/09: Pothole
9/22/09: Speed bike doing wheelies, speeding and weaving in and out of traffic
10/23/09: Pitbull
11/21/09: Referring to unclear past event, GZ says subject is in front of his residence
11/3/09:White male driverin county vehicle cutting people off
1/1/10:White malehaving loud verbal dispute with female in back of pick-up
1/12/10: Neighbor's garage door open, "very unlike his neighbor"
2/27/10: Reports residence in complex where multiple vehicles are constantly coming to the residence; unknown subjects run out to the vehicles and run back inside; the subjects are always outside with the garage open and hang out all night, an ongoing problem; unknown who lives at that address; GZ advises there are constantly different people
4/28/10: Vehicle obstructing road
6/12/10: At least50 subjects GZ doesn't think live at complex are in the clubhouse & pool areas having a party, causing road obstructions
6/26/10: Approximately50 subjects are having a loud party and blocking the street
10/2/10:Female driver yelling at elderly passengers, unknown if altercation is physical, vehicle was rocking back and forth
11/8/10: Trash in roadway, appears to contain glass
11/26/10: Motion alarm tripped while GZ is out of town
3/18/11: Pitbull in his garage
4/22/11:Black male 7-9 years old walking alone unsupervised on busy street; GZ "concerned for well being"
5/27/11: GZ's alarm tripped while he's at work
8/3/11:Black maleon foot at back entrance of neighborhood last seen wearing white tank top and black shorts; GZ believes he's involved in recent burglaries in neighborhood;GZ says he matches the description that was given to police
8/6/11:Two black male teensnear back gate of neighborhood, one wearing black tank top and black shorts, 2nd wearing black t-shirt and jeans; GZ says they're the ones who have been burglarizing the area and predicts subjects will run into the subdivision next to his complex
9/23/11: Open garage door; GZ notes he's part of neighborhood watch and is concerned about recent burglaries in area; had aneighborhood watch meeting previous night with Sgt. Herx who advised him to report anything suspicious
10/1/11:Two black malesapprox 20-30 years old appear to be loitering in their car at gate of community at 1 am; GZ doesn't recognize subjects or vehicle and is concerned due to recent burglaries in the area
12/10/11:White malewith shaved head at club house in black Mercedes was hired by GZ to serve food at an event but then GZ replaced him and subject seemed upset and wants to be paid; GZ has never met him in person; GZ's wife will meet with police when they arrive
1/29/12:Five or six kids, ages 4-11 years, running and playing in the streetand running out in front of cars
2/2/12:Black male wearing black leather jacket, black hat, andprinted PJpants keeps going to the residence of a white male; unclear what he's doing; subject was gone when police arrived
2/26/12 [TRAYVON MARTIN]:Black male, late teens, dark gray hoodie, jeans or sweatpants, walking around area; GZ concerned about recent burglaries
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Of the twelve incidents in which race was given, six, including the incident reporting TM, involved black males (#34, 36, 37, 39, 42, 43), 5 involved white males (#3, 11, 23, 24, 40), and one involved two Hispanic males and one white male (#9).We could just count eyeballs (or skin color) and draw conclusions about whether GZ is a racial profiler on that basis. But as in most things, context matters. Which way does the context cut in this case? Probably in both directions.
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If he really did profile habitually all his life like you insinuate then there would be ALOT clearer of a pattern, why isn't it possible zimmerman was just very protective of his community like a watchdog?
 
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