Justice for Zimmerman

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hodj

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To be fair, if the attack happened in England, it would have taken the police upwards of 20 minutes to respond while Martin continued to behead Zimmerman in the street.



Eomer_sl said:
I'm not saying that the UK doesn't have crime. However the "statistics" in that image Hodj posted are bullshit. As Hodj himself said, criminologists have great difficulty in comparing violent crime from one country to another, because there's huge differences in what the definition of "violent" crime even is between countries. There's no way in hell that Sweden is 3 times as violent/dangerous as the US.

But please, please don't lump me in with Ossoi otherwise!
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The issue is that the UK counts all these crimes under one category while they're counted under two or three in the US.

I'd just like to see Ossoi offer up ANY violent crime statistic that is lower per capita in England than the US, and then I'd love him to explain how that's directly affected by their gun laws.
 
BoldW

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Ossoi_sl said:
So its ok for GZ to assume that whilst his head is striking the pavement that he might be killed (even though the injuries dont support that). But it's not ok for TM to assume that GZ had nefarious intent.
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It's quite alright for TM to think GZ had nefarious intent. Once he reach his fathers house, he should have notified someone about it instead of going back to attack GZ. This argument gets old. Martin was AT his fathers house. HE then Stalked and attacked GZ. Does one in fear for his life really leave the safety of his home to go confront the person he's afraid of? Please.
 
Adebisi

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Stop derailing the Justice for Zimzimmyzim thread.

Gun control can go elsewhere. This thread is about a 17 year old drug addict criminal who attempted to murder a Hispanic man.
 
Eomer

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hodj_sl said:
I'd just like to see Ossoi offer up ANY violent crime statistic that is lower per capita in England than the US, and then I'd love him to explain how that's directly affected by their gun laws.
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Well, as far as your first request goes, we can start with murder being approximately four times higher in the US. Rape also appears to be higher, but there's not a big gap. Robbery is about the same, but the positions are reversed. Assaults are pretty much impossible to compare given the hugely different definitions.

As far as the second part of your request goes, I'm not touching that one.
 
hodj

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Eomer_sl said:
Well, as far as your first request goes, we can start with murder being approximately four times higher in the US. Rape also appears to be higher, but there's not a big gap. Robbery is about the same, but the positions are reversed. Assaults are pretty much impossible to compare given the hugely different definitions.

As far as the second part of your request goes, I'm not touching that one.
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Do you have a citation on that and are the values per capita?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimm...ew?id=19735432

George Zimmerman, who has been in hiding since he was acquitted of murder in the death of Trayvon Martin, emerged to help rescue someone who was trapped in an overturned truck, police said today.

Sanford Police Department Capt. Jim McAuliffe told ABC News that Zimmerman "pulled an individual from a truck that had rolled over" at the intersection of a Florida highway last week. Florida Highway Patrol is now handling the case, McAuliffe said.

The crash occurred at the intersection of I-4 and route 417, police said. The crash site is less than a mile from where he shot Martin.

It's the first known sighting of Zimmerman since he left the courtroom following his acquittal last week on murder charges for the death of Martin. Zimmerman, 29, shot and killed Martin, 17, in Sanford, Fla., on Feb. 26, 2012. The jury determined that Zimmerman shot Martin in self-defense.
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BoldW

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Eomer_sl said:
Well, as far as your first request goes, we can start with murder being approximately four times higher in the US. Rape also appears to be higher, but there's not a big gap. Robbery is about the same, but the positions are reversed. Assaults are pretty much impossible to compare given the hugely different definitions.

As far as the second part of your request goes, I'm not touching that one.
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There are several states that have lower murder rates than England. Even more than have lower murder rates than Scotland. Those tend to be states with low gun-control laws.

Edit: We really are getting out of the zimzam case and into the GC territory, but hey, it is related.

As the graph shows, there are four US states with a lower murder rate than England & Wales, namely Hawaii, Vermont, New Hampshire and Rhode Island, and an additional six which are lower than Scotland, those being Minnesota, Iowa, Utah, Maine, Oregan and Idaho, with Wisconsin, Washington and South Dakota not far behind.
So, it is certainly the case that the UK, taken as a whole, is less dangerous murder-wise, than the US, taken as a whole, but then this was always the case, including back in the days when guns were freely available and unrestricted (and, I might add, punishments for actual crimes, committed with or without a firearm were considerably more stringent than today). It is also noteworthy that some of the least dangerous US states are those with the least amount of gun control - but then y'all knew that, right?
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Tanoomba

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Furry_sl said:
An innocent person could of died. This is a situation I will never accept, and you are an idiot if you believe that is a good outcome. I'm okay with criminals dying, so while not ideal, its a better scenario.
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Wow.
A) I never said an innocent person dying is a good outcome.
B) I never said Zimmerman wasn't justified in his actions.
C) You can't put an infinite value on human life. Just ask Fanaskin, he'll tell you all about it.

I'm just talking probability here.
 
Adebisi

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Pulling people out of crashes? Zimmerman is a fucking HERO.

Amod...Please change the name of this thread to George Zimmerman: American Hero
 
hodj

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Zimmerman just found his new job: Rolling around the nation in a superhero costume righting wrongs.

rrr_img_37251.jpg
 
ZyyzYzzy

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A mod should change the thread title to The Shitposting Thread. The same people have turned a thread about an event into something totally different just like the Boston Marathon Bombing/Ball shaving/public school thread.
 
Ossoi

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Furry_sl said:
You're just flat out wrong. UK has provisions that a victim must display an intent to avoid conflict before they can claim self defense. Trayvon initiated the conflict and did not flee during a good opportunity to do so, especially with no evidence that GZ was following him. The assertion that TM could claim self defense in the UK if he assault GZ is wildly unfounded.
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nope, England football captain Steven Gerrard pre-emptively punched someone because he thought he was going to be struck and was found not guilty.

And yes TM could rely on same self defence law if all the incident amounted to was a punch.... "he was following me, I punched him...cops arrived and found he was armed" = self defence wins
 
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so is this guy gonna go to jail because obama keeps speaking out about how this is unjust and it could have been his unborn son, isnt he supposed to keep this kinda shit to himself? it is law and order not trials of emotions.
 
ZyyzYzzy

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Ossoi_sl said:
nope, England football captain Steven Gerrard pre-emptively punched someone because he thought he was going to be struck and was found not guilty.

And yes TM could rely on same self defence law if all the incident amounted to was a punch.... "he was following me, I punched him...cops arrived and found he was armed" = self defence wins
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That would not be self defense and TM would be convicted as assault.

In this country where we don't suck off a royal family.
 
hodj

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Well the incident didn't just include a punch, and in the US you don't have the right to punch someone just because they followed you 30 yards behind. Have you followed the trial at all? Have you read the Original Post with included timeline supported by the evidence in the trial?

Zimmerman never came within 30 yards of Martin except when Martin approached him, at his truck, and then later, after Martin moved to his father's house, and then returned to assault Zimmerman.

So no, Trayvon Martin could not have, in the US or England, claimed "Self defense" for attacking Zimmerman.

We've been over and over and over every detail of this case in this thread. If you'd read, you'd see that every single point you think you have to make we've already considered and shot down ages ago.

Zimmerman was NOT following Martin. The only time he "followed" Martin was for about 20 or 30 yards, when Martin went around the townhomes, and Zimmerman was far enough away from him at the time that by the time he got around the building, he completely lost sight of Martin, who then moved to his father's house, then returned, and assaulted Zimmerman. You simply do not, as so often has been the case in this thread, have the facts of the situation correct.

Please. Go read the first post in this thread. Read that graphic. Come back if you have questions. It completely eradicates this suggestion you have that Martin was justified in attacking Zimmerman. It didn't happen the way you think it did.
 
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