Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Muligan_sl said:

I can't believe i'm saying this because i'm not a huge Jacobs fan but I wish I would have support Camelot Unchained. They seemed to have their act together or at least fooled me to thinking so based on their KS.

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I feel the same way about Shroud of the Avatar. Whether you like the game or not, they put together a great Kickstarter for a niche game.

Big Flex_sl said:

no, the saddest thing is that if this doesn't get funded, especially by a large margin, it will send a message to 'industry' professionals and indie devs alike that there is no demand for a title like this.

despite the fact that if pantheon fails to achieve its goals it was due to everything but.

and ppl like Smed will recline smugly in their office chairs, knowing that they were right.

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Shroud of the Avatar and Camelot Unchained strongly disagree with your assessment.

This isn't getting funded due to lack of demand, it's not being funded because of lack of trust coupled with a terrible Kickstarter.

I don't think the name is the issue (although again, for something that's been worked on since September, it's like they thought of this last night). The issue is the 2 paragraphs that constitutes as 'lore'. Nothing about mechanics, nothing at all about how that kind of class would play (don't even have to go into real specifics), no concept screenshots. As for some of those comments on the KS page, Brad could probably post a picture of the shit he took last night and there would be praise for that.

It's too bad really, because I don't think it would take much to get a whole lot more backers if there was any substance to what they are putting out there. The Kickstarter is actually going backwards today.

Jimbolini_sl said:

Well, I did raise my pledge to $600 (Almost sold out)...just in case

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I'm not moving mine either, I'm at $600 as well. Honestly there's absolutely no real surprise here for me so far other than I did expect the KS to be handled better. In for the ride good or ill. Best of luck VR, things are looking a bit... dark.

I think the nothing has changed is the problem.

They stumbled out of the gate with a shitty kickstater presentation , screwed up by having to be told to get out on the interwebz and push this thing , made a terrible decision to release an update of a dungeon that looks like it was whipped up in 5 mins.

Now Batman happens.

Nothing has changed it seems, it's Vanguard 2.0 , not in game terms but development wise , sigh.

Vandyn_sl said:

The Kickstarter is actually going backwards today.

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In honesty, it should. You're asking people to part with their money in the hopes of getting enough funding tomaybeget more funding tomaybeget a game theymightlike. If you're expecting people to do that for you, you need to provide a hell of a lot more clarity and detail than what's already been provided.

Wystler_sl said:

I'm not moving mine either, I'm at $600 as well. Honestly there's absolutely no real surprise here for me so far other than I did expect the KS to be handled better. In for the ride good or ill. Best of luck VR, things are looking a bit... dark.

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why so serious?

mkopec_sl said:

It seems like they thought that this idea or "vision" would sell itself.

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I'm genuinely starting to believe that also.

Money dropping below $180k

Quineloe_sl said:

The name isn't the only problem, it just overshadows it. We still have no idea what the classes will actually be like.



That's how I'd like to see the classes being introduced. No more fucking lore fluff. It can't be delivered? Doesn't look like you're far enough to do a KS then.

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to be fair thats like a post velious rewrite. I remember the OG strategy guide and lore book back from 1999 and the class descriptions were shit. the difference was I had never heard of a ogre shadowknight before. I'm very aware of what an antipaladin consists of in an MMO environment now.

Damn, when I looked at it 30 minutes age it was still around +3k for today.

Keep in mind also that we (EQ vets, fanboys, backers, etc) are not the only ones they should be trying to impress. You can be sure that publisher execs keep an eye out on this. They see what we see they see the criticism then they are probably asking themselves, why would we want to fund that?

Soonami_sl said:

I'm almost 40 years old. Don't complain that some old man is on here because there are a lot of you about that age. Here is how it went when I started EQ in 1999.

Worked swing shift (3-11)
got home - Played EQ until 6am.
Sleep until time for work.
(repeat)for 3 years.

Here is how it works now.

get up
kids
Work - real job
kids
dinner
kids
say hi to the wife..
maybe game time for a few hours
off to bed
(repeat)

I really don't have 8-12 hours a day to commit to a game. I do want a challenge, but I don't want to be left in the rear with the gear because of that.
There are a lot of people in this age group. Maybe I shouldn't even specify AGE. We grew up with the Commodore 64, Atari, Intellivision (Tron Deadly Disks was my favorite), Nintendo, Playstation, MMORPG's. I might even die with a PS8 controller in my hand. Now we are the ones with the money, who are buying and backing games.
What I am getting at is I still want to play but is there room for someone like me that cannot dedicate a third of the day to being connected.

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My take on this is that you just have to change your interest/goals/expectations/whatever. As someone who has less play time every year as well it's hard for me to let go. At first things that make quality of life better with limited play time seem like great ideas. LFG systems, Dungeon finders, Raid finders, quick teleports to groups, instant travel, flying mounts, etc etc etc. After a very short while though it all just makes it feel like more of an annoying grinding treadmill than EQ ever did. And I find myself back playing on P1999 or giving up MMOs altogether and just playing candy crush or something for a bit.

If your expectation is to always be able to be competitive with people who can afford to play 18 hours a day you are probably going to be disappointed. I'm sure there are a few people out there who envy your 2-3 hours of play time and want to be competitive with their 1 hour a day. Where do you draw the line? My thought is that you just have to accept that you made different choices than the folks who can play nonstop and as such aren't going to have as easy a time staying on top. There are also games that cater to this more so already.

I would say what would be a better question than CAN I COMPETE WITH THE GUYS WHO PLAY 17 HOURS OR MORE A DAY would be CAN I HAVE FUN IN THE TIME I DO HAVE TO PLAY? Maybe that's just me.

As I said on the Kickstarter comments, whatever class/race updates they have lined up they need to just release now. Sod this one little item of boring-was-obiously-in-the-game stuff. Do they think the world is hanging on their every word?"Oooooh a Cleric class, I can't wait to find out what class reveal is next". Hell no, anyone interested before the Kickstarter assumed all the classes and everyone else doesn't give a shitthey just want information.

Updates should be about new information, stuff that's happened since you first learned of the Kickstarter. All 1,514 backers knew the moment they read it there was going to be a Shadow Knight class, telling thema week lateris a waste of time. Not to mention all the people who might have been convinced initially if there was some class information, those people aren't coming back to read the new update they've already made up their mind.

You know your project is in trouble when 38 Studios had a better MMO business plan and marketing scheme.

Big Flex_sl said:

to be fair thats like a post velious rewrite. I remember the OG strategy guide and lore book back from 1999 and the class descriptions were shit. the difference was I had never heard of a ogre shadowknight before. I'm very aware of what an antipaladin consists of in an MMO environment now.

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I described the late EQ Shadowknight, just to make the case. clear descriptions of what they can do are in order, not lore fluff.