Science!! Fucking magnets, how do they work?

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pharmakos

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at first when you said that my thought was "they probably mean alcohol in the general organic chemistry sense, rather than specifically the type of alcohol humans get drunk on."

but then i RTFA, and it was actually ethyl alcohol on that comet. intredasting.
 

Chanur

Shit Posting Professional
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sometimes i wonder if some comets and asteroids are just the result of an alien mothership emptying out their latrines.

what if life on earth only started because a giant ball of frozen alien shit crashed on our planet and the bacteria contained within started evolving.
It would make a classic episode of Intergalactic Jerry Springer!
 

pharmakos

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"and the DNA test shows.... that yes, Klaxnar, DNA from your poop is indeed the source of all life on Earth."

fuck yeah we're gonna get some spacecash child support money! we're rich!
 

Dandai

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Some napkin math has linked our solar system's orbit through the Milky Way and mass extinctions:

Earth is in grave danger of being hit by a catastrophic comet shower triggered by the sun, warn scientists | Daily Mail Online

After reading it, I'm not sure if I was click baited or if this could actually be a thing... especially since they were like "if you're paying attention you'll note that we're not due for a mass extinction for another 10 million years, but it COULD happen any day now!!!1!1"

Please advise.
 

hodj

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Well its a Daily Mail article, so its probably click bait just by that fact alone.
 

iannis

Musty Nester
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Some napkin math has linked our solar system's orbit through the Milky Way and mass extinctions:

Earth is in grave danger of being hit by a catastrophic comet shower triggered by the sun, warn scientists | Daily Mail Online

After reading it, I'm not sure if I was click baited or if this could actually be a thing... especially since they were like "if you're paying attention you'll note that we're not due for a mass extinction for another 10 million years, but it COULD happen any day now!!!1!1"

Please advise.
Can't comment right now. Too busy stocking up on corn, ammo, and and fat little fifteen year olds.
 

Tuco

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Based on the PPS-Flex, a 1.5 kilowatts class thruster designed by the GREM3 Team at LAPLACE Laboratory, France and capable of modifying the magnetic field topology over a broad range of configurations, the team has validated their optimization strategies by modifying several parts and parameters of the thruster. The measurement of some operation parameters such as the thrust level, anode efficiency and far-field ion properties displayed a satisfactory performance level. However, Vaudolon said, some further optimization is still needed for the thruster's efficient operation at high power.

Read more at:Scientists experimentally optimize operation of first wall-less Hall thruster prototype
Did they say anywhere what kind of force these things generate?



If you want to read about some of the cool,possibleadvances in space thrust technology, here's some of that emdrive bullshit:
Some retired physicist (or something) set up a gofundme and is showing off their progress on their emdrive build:
Secured Mics Photo by shells2bells2002 | Photobucket
 

Troll_sl

shitlord
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Until they can explain how it violates momentum conservation, it's bullshit. They have the burden of proof and have yet to provide it.

The best thing about a thruster like the Hall is that it doesn't take a lot of continuous thrust to get a craft up to ludicrous speed. Having millions of times the fuel capacity means you can burn that thrust so much longer. Even if it's at a fraction of the power, the end result is a faster trip.
 

khalid

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I'm waiting for Furry to weigh in on the science on these thrusters before I let the scientists pull the wool over my eyes.
 

Cad

scientia potentia est
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Until they can explain how it violates momentum conservation, it's bullshit. They have the burden of proof and have yet to provide it.

The best thing about a thruster like the Hall is that it doesn't take a lot of continuous thrust to get a craft up to ludicrous speed. Having millions of times the fuel capacity means you can burn that thrust so much longer. Even if it's at a fraction of the power, the end result is a faster trip.
I think showing it works is far more important than explaining how it violates momentum conservation. There may well be a reason it works that we don't understand yet.

However, I haven't seen definitive proof it works.
 

Troll_sl

shitlord
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No, actually, if something breaks momentum conservation, that will be the biggest story in physics. Ever. Period. Much bigger than some measely little thruster.

It's a definitional property.

Even furry can't argue against momentum conservation.
 

Tuco

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Not that I'm some kind of true EMDrive believer, but their argument isn't that "This violates conservation of momentum and here is why we think it does.", it's "This does NOT violate conservation of momentum and here is how.".

Meanwhile, a lot of reputable physicists look at their explanation of how it doesn't violate CoM and reject that explanation.


As for burden of proof, the few groups who are working on this feel that weight and readily accept it. Nobody is suggesting a theory exists that is tenable or proven and they are working to change that.
 

Running Dog_sl

shitlord
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Did they say anywhere what kind of force these things generate?



If you want to read about some of the cool,possibleadvances in space thrust technology, here's some of that emdrive bullshit:
Some retired physicist (or something) set up a gofundme and is showing off their progress on their emdrive build:
Secured Mics Photo by shells2bells2002 | Photobucket
The paper is here:

http://scitation.aip.org/content/aip...1063/1.4932196

There are some graphs buried in there; assuming I'm looking at the right set of points the thrust varied from about 15 to 30 mN, compared to 30 to 50 mN for the same drive operating in a "conventional" mode - although the theory is that the wallless drive would have a longer lifetime. The next step would be to create a drive designed to operate in wall-less mode, based upon what they have learned, to see if they can improve the thrust and efficiency.

The headline from the last emdrive tests was that they measured 20 micro N of thrust, however the largest measurement for the emdrive came from the control experiment, where the drive was supposed to generate zero thrust. In other words, their apparatus was unable to distinguish between actual thrust and heating effects, and to their credit they said just that:

"Our test campaign cannot confirm or refute the claims of the EMDrive.... such a set-up does not seem to be able to adequately measure precise thrusts."

Obviously that didn't stop the newspapers running away with the story.
 

Furry

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EMDrive exists because of an experiment a long time ago where light was shown to have mass. This completely disagrees with mainstream physics, so theories were changed to make it so light could exhibit the features of having mass when it was convenient for science, but doesn't ACTUALLY have mass. To me, its an example of where science places more value in its codified religious texts than actually attempting to understand how nature works.

The simplest explanation of EMDrive would be the fact that light actually does have mass, thus can be used to generate thrust. There may be alternative explanations, but they would be very very hard to work into current models of physics. This shits on a lot of core (quantum) areas of science, and also shits on the law of speed of light, and would generally toss over the table of physics in many regards, so as simple an explanation as it is, science REALLY hates it. And that's why they tried to make the experiment disappear originally until someone had the bright idea of expanding upon it in this method.

I find it interesting, and I also find it interesting that it continues to hold up as more and more reputable places work on it, and the experimental basis for this machine also happens to be well verified. I really don't understand people like troll that insist their book understanding of physics should trump observable reality.