Silicon Valley

Khane_sl said:

What? He just told them to delete the entire goddamn thing? Did you miss that part of the episode?

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Before being forced to hand it over to Gavin-fucking-Belson and retain 0 interest in it. You are kind of dense I think.

wormie_sl said:

I understand that the platform is not finished. What you seem to not understand is that Richard is not the only person who can finish it. The algorithm is the valuable property, not the code that executes it.

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Hooli, one of the world's largest companies with nearly unlimited resources in this show, couldn't even do that. Raviga knows this. The head of Raviga has been written as some monotone binary thinker who is completely risk averse and she knows that. The writing that's led up to this doesn't dictate that kind of rash decision making.

And wormie, the algorithm is not the valuable property. You do not understand software at all, you think this is some kind of patent that is done and finished. One person who doesn't understand his code could make a seemingly innocuous change and completely fuck the performance of the entire platform, and then not understand how to fix it. In fact they had an episode revolve around just that. Remember the "hacker" kid? Firing the world's leading expert on this particular kind of software in favor of hoping to find someone who might be able to maintain it and hopefully make it scalable is something that you just wouldn't do unless you were short sighted and had no interest building it up.

That would make sense if her move was to immediately sell the company, but she stated to Monica, in this very episode, she thought Richard was being short sighted and they could find many more applications for the software, yet she's being shortsighted by ousting the expert before it's even done.

The Ancient_sl said:

Before being forced to hand it over to Gavin-fucking-Belson and retain 0 interest in it. You are kind of dense I think.

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Oh but he'll be just fine with being fired in a power play. You really think it was just because of Gavin? He'll roll over for Raviga just cuz? Who's the dense one?

TJT_sl said:

I wasn't getting the vibe that they want a brain to replace Richard. Lori outright says that she wants to ensure the company is managed. This tells me they're going to hire a CEO who is like Jared. More into business and getting them to target the right markets for compression.

Or something.

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Right, but why literally fire Richard... and do it over the phone? Why not approach it as a shift of duties? Richard is CIO and they hire a new CEO? Or keep him as the CEO but hire an acting President?

All I'm saying is they have built the characters involved in this latest "shitstorm" a certain way and this power play kind of betrays the writing so far for said characters. The last two end of episode fuck overs have been lazy and feel shoehorned. Like the writers just don't want to change the formula and are running out of ideas. First the delete button and now this. Doesn't seem to fit everything else that's led up to this.

Khane_sl said:

There are people who would and people who wouldn't. Richard's character strikes me as the kind of person who doesn't care about the money as much as he cares about creating and being part of the creation of something monumental. So yes, I think he would leave the company. Everything he's done up until this point, every decision he's made and how he's acted tells me that. Are you and I watching different shows? Richard, just this very episode, showed us he'd rather delete the entire fucking platform than give it up.

All I am saying is that is doesn't really make sense to me that this supposedly ridiculous woman who makes decisions with unyielding logic and resolve and has said she plays the numbers and avoids undue risk would just pull a power play and fire him when so much risk revolves around that move. Doesn't seem to fit the portrait that's been painted for us. There are people who would absolutely do that kind of thing, she doesn't seem like one of those people to me.

The writing is getting disjointed.

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So, he's going to sell his stake in the company, then start a new company doing the exact same thing, go through all the same initial startup issues that will be even more amplified due to everything that has happened, and then do what with that new company? Get sued if his new algorithm is anything close to the old one? Or start making mobile games?

It doesn't make sense that the aspy CEO who has no emotional capacity and thinks everything in the world is wrong if she thinks it's wrong, isn't going to put her own CEO or herself in charge of what from the beginning hasn't been a company she has been enthusiastic about because their keep bumbling shit from a business perspective?

The second Russ sold out to that aspy robot I was like oh shit she's going to take charge of things and be even worse than Russ.

And now, they didn't fire him, he got a call from his friend and supporter telling him what was going on and his reaction was that he got fired. That doesn't mean he's excluded from any and all activities, can't be on the board, can't still have a development position, etc. Just that the overbearing aspy head of a the company that just bought your ass thinks she or her own person can do a better job running the business side of things.


And WE may know it's a smart move, because we're watching the fucking show and know it's a show. Well, we're watching a show, not sure what you're watching.

And yeah, he was going to delete it all, because Hooli was going to own the IP, not just buy out the company. He still owns the IP right now, he just got ousted from being CEO of the business. That's what businesses often do when they have to buy another business, in part because that other business is fucking shit up from a business perspective.

Yeah, Richard is the genius behind the software, which is why firing him from being CEO doesn't mean he isn't still able to be a part of the project.

No, he won't be fine getting fired, that's what the apsy doesn't understand, and that's why it will make for compelling TV...........dotfuckingdot.

popsicledeath_sl said:

And now, they didn't fire him, he got a call from his friend and supporter telling him what was going on and his reaction was that he got fired. That doesn't mean he's excluded from any and all activities, can't be on the board, can't still have a development position, etc. Just that the overbearing aspy head of a the company that just bought your ass thinks she or her own person can do a better job running the business side of things.

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This could be true I just didn't take it that way. Not saying she doesn't think the business isn't being run properly, she stated as much. I'm saying a bold move like that seems far riskier than she would be willing to commit to based on how they've written her so far. And she should know how risky it is.

If it was just Monica saying "Hey just want to let you know we had a secret vote and you're no longer CEO, but you'll still be around" that's more believable than her having him actually get fired, over the phone, standing in a room next to the computers that have all the code and no assurances he won't flip out and nuke it all. But I didn't get the feeling that's what happened, I think she was actually saying "you're going to be fired".

By the way, can you even have a super secret board vote without 2 of the voting members present? Sure it would be majority rules either way but don't they still have to at least be given the chance to cast their ballot?

Bold move? She's not a person. She's an apsy robot that sees a company that needs to be run better. In her mind, the logical and only solution is to put someone in charge that will do that. It was anything but bold. It was inevitable and something many viewers probably realized almost instantly. The aspy sees something not being run properly, in her mind, so she's going to fix it, and now has the power to.

The feeling you got is what happened was Monica called Richard and fired him? And you also point out they couldn't have had a secret board meeting. Practically acknowledging Monica called informally to let Richard know what was going on. Is this making sense yet?

Khane_sl said:

Yes, yes I do. I even said so in the very first post:



I acknowledge they will probably attempt to keep him on the team, but that's risky since he doesn't want to just be a cog, he wants to have control of his company based on his brainchild. Or are all of you convinced he'd just roll over and take it and that Raviga isn't going a little too cart in front of the horse?

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In all of your posts you don't seem to get that he's still majority owner. That's enough incentive to "keep him on the team." Him no longer being the CEO is pretty meaningless. The CEO is there to act on behalf of the owners to make the business decisions to make the company profitable. That has literally almost nothing to do with Richard. I want to say even by his own admission on the show that he sucks shit at the business side of it.

Now he's free to make Pied Piper a better product.

Really the only way he's off Pied Piper is if he sells his stake in the company. Which will never happen (for the sake of the show).

popsicledeath_sl said:

Bold move? She's not a person. She's an apsy robot that sees a company that needs to be run better. In her mind, the logical and only solution is to put someone in charge that will do that. It was anything but bold. It was inevitable and something many viewers probably realized almost instantly. The aspy sees something not being run properly, in her mind, so she's going to fix it, and now has the power to.

The feeling you got is what happened was Monica called Richard and fired him? And you also point out they couldn't have had a secret board meeting. Practically acknowledging Monica called informally to let Richard know what was going on. Is this making sense yet?

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Monica called and told him that they already did have the secret board meeting. Go back and rewatch that bit. Do you understand that all I am saying is that it feels like disjointed writing for the sake of shock value? She's an "aspie robot" who bases all her decisions on logic and reason with no emotional bearing. She also has a lot of experience with investing in software. She should know you don't fire an expert and creator before the software is even out of its infancy and that a company with FAR more resources than Raviga failed abysmally at taking the code and turning it into a usable product without him.

Elurin_sl said:

In all of your posts you don't seem to get that he's still majority owner. That's enough incentive to "keep him on the team." Him no longer being the CEO is pretty meaningless. The CEO is there to act on behalf of the owners to make the business decisions to make the company profitable. That has literally almost nothing to do with Richard. I want to say even by his own admission on the show that he sucks shit at the business side of it.

Now he's free to make Pied Piper a better product.

Really the only way he's off Pied Piper is if he sells his stake in the company. Which will never happen (for the sake of the show).

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No, I understand that completely. But you guys are willfully ignoring the way they have written and portrayed his character up until this point of the show if you think he's going to go for that. That's the point I have been making that seems to be glossed over by all of you. Richard will never go for that. And he doesn't suck shit at the business side.

I want one of you guys who keeps making that claim to show me examples of him sucking shit at the business side. He has Jared for all of that and Jared is pretty goddamn spectacular at those things.

I mean he says "I just got fired from my own company". Of course popsicle and others could be right that he just perceived the information that way, but that's kind of lame too to leave the show hanging like that and then having the first episode of season be all "Well I guess I wasn't technically fired. I mean I can still work on it, I was wrong". Plus they haven't ever done anything like that yet. All the shit that's been happening at the end of each episode was legit. No backsies.

He's not just going to accept being fired as CEO. He's going to get emotional about it, as he already has. It's going to be an issue. It'll turn into plot points. That's the point. That's the kind of tension and emotion that makes good television.

How terrible would it be if they had a meeting, all came to the conclusion the best thing for the product would be if the larger, more experience company that just bought the smaller less experienced one handled the business side of things, and Richard stepped down as CEO to focus on the creative/development side of things, glad he didn't have that additional responsibility and could now focus on what he loves, and they successfully and smoothly launched a product.

Not exactly riveting television right there.

And no, I don't think they called a formal board meeting. They didn't have to. I don't remember if Monica said 'secret board meeting' or not, but she didn't have to. She talked to the aspybot, realized the plan, and let Richard know because they're friends and are really on the same side of things but Monica keeps being put in a tough position where what she wants and what she gets are different, which is how good story telling works, which is why eventually there's should hopefully be more tension between Monica and the Aspybot in future episodes, that will create good drama that allows for comic relief.

At least I don't think the show is a documentary.

popsicledeath_sl said:

He's not just going to accept being fired as CEO. He's going to get emotional about it, as he already has. It's going to be an issue. It'll turn into plot points. That's the point. That's the kind of tension and emotion that makes good television.

How terrible would it be if they had a meeting, all came to the conclusion the best thing for the product would be if the larger, more experience company that just bought the smaller less experienced one handled the business side of things, and Richard stepped down as CEO to focus on the creative/development side of things, glad he didn't have that additional responsibility and could now focus on what he loves, and they successfully and smoothly launched a product.

Not exactly riveting television right there.

And no, I don't think they called a formal board meeting. They didn't have to. I don't remember if Monica said 'secret board meeting' or not, but she didn't have to. She talked to the aspybot, realized the plan, and let Richard know because they're friends and are really on the same side of things but Monica keeps being put in a tough position where what she wants and what she gets are different, which is how good story telling works, which is why eventually there's should hopefully be more tension between Monica and the Aspybot in future episodes, that will create good drama that allows for comic relief.

At least I don't think the show is a documentary.

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We are just arguing how severe the reaction will be. I'm saying I don't think this final season ending cliffhanger fits well with how the show was being written. I think it feels disjointed and shoehorned for the sake of shock value. I really just don't think that head of Raviga character was written as someone who would make that kind of move up until this point. I think they really fired him (or at least Monica let him know that he is going to be fired) and not that they are just planning on asking him to shift duties.

Just leave the season with their victory and then create new drama next season right from episode 1. Plenty of other shows do this kind of thing and are successful at it. Let the damn season arc end and start a new one next season.

Khane_sl said:

I want one of you guys who keeps making that claim to show me examples of him sucking shit at the business side. He has Jared for all of that and Jared is pretty goddamn spectacular at those things.

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A complain by almost everyone here is that every episode something terrible happens on the company/business side of things to set them back.

He was CEO when they deleted a ton of files and lost that competition. He was CEO when he told Erlich to fuck off and got fucked over by double A. He was CEO when he practically gave a competitor his entire algorithm. He was CEO when he asked for a meeting with a former employee of that competitor who got fired because of something PP did and told that guy TWICE things that had the potential for fucking over the company.

And, in a huge plot point, they had an entire fucking arbitration hearing about whether he'd lose the ownership of his IP because, while he was in charge of his own company and project, he used another company's computer to work on it.

I mean he says "I just got fired from my own company". Of course popsicle and others could be right that he just perceived the information that way, but that's kind of lame too to leave the show hanging like that and then having the first episode of season be all "Well I guess I wasn't technically fired. I mean I can still work on it, I was wrong". Plus they haven't ever done anything like that yet. All the shit that's been happening at the end of each episode was legit. No backsies.

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I dunno, seems to be working to keep you in suspense?

Khane_sl said:

I'm saying I don't think this final season ending cliffhanger fits well with how the show was being written....

...Let the damn season arc end and start a new one next season.

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I don't disagree about Cliffhangers. I saw it coming, though, and it was fairly predictable so I'm not sure why anyone would be surprised. It's what TV does, though.

I think they did fine to close the arc, though, and set up a new arc, setting and new tensions next season. They've fought about all the small startup battles they can without us getting sick of the setbacks like 5 episodes ago. Now they've made the bigtime, in a sense, with all the support and infrastructure and offices and all kinds of the shit they, in theory, wanted, but we're going to learn the good ol days struggling in a flop house with servers in the garage wasn't so bad after all.

Will the show go in a better direction or not, I don't know. But none of what happened seemed at all surprising or shocking, or for that benefit alone. At least not to me. It all seemed inevitable. They couldn't let PP simply win over Hoolie and go back to business as usual for a finale. So, they had to have some big change coming, and this was the one the show was writing toward for two seasons. It really shouldn't be a surprise, as it was there all along.

popsicledeath_sl said:

A complain by almost everyone here is that every episode something terrible happens on the company/business side of things to set them back.

He was CEO when they deleted a ton of files and lost that competition. He was CEO when he told Erlich to fuck off and got fucked over by double A. He was CEO when he practically gave a competitor his entire algorithm. He was CEO when he asked for a meeting with a former employee of that competitor who got fired because of something PP did and told that guy TWICE things that had the potential for fucking over the company.

And, in a huge plot point, they had an entire fucking arbitration hearing about whether he'd lose the ownership of his IP because, while he was in charge of his own company and project, he used another company's computer to work on it.



I dunno, seems to be working to keep you in suspense?

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I guess an argument could be made that if he didn't take money from tres comas he never would have been there to accidentally put a bottle of tequila on a delete button, but then again none of them probably would have been there because they had no money.

Erlich set up the entire double A thing and Jared, a very business savvy person, was completely on board with it. It was a good idea, double A was just a shithead. Erlich was also praising the dude up until he felt like a jilted lover. But you are right, there is a much better chance they would have gotten their logo added and been able to stream the event instead of getting "fired" over it with someone else in charge dealing with him.

Giving the competitor the algorithm probably would not have happened with someone else in charge, that one I'll concede.

The IP thing happened before pied piper was a company. Long before.

I'm not really arguing he shouldn't be CEO, I'm arguing he doesn't deserve to be ousted in such a fashion that has the potential for huge fallout and I think Raviga lady would understand that better.

It's not keeping me in suspense, it has me rolling my eyes. It's starting to become annoying.

Khane_sl said:

Erlich set up the entire double A thing and Jared, a very business savvy person, was completely on board with it. It was a good idea, double A was just a shithead. Erlich was also praising the dude up until he felt like a jilted lover. But you are right, there is a much better chance they would have gotten their logo added and been able to stream the event instead of getting "fired" over it with someone else in charge dealing with him.

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Sometimes what makes good TV is the blatant tension, but also the underlying tension we don't fully understand until everything comes to light.

If you remember the events of the episode, or re-watch it, the whole time Erlich knew what was going on. He may or may not have been able to stop Double-A from being a double asshole, but he was there trying to help mitigate shit in what was a pretty shitty situation. Instead, what happened was Richard took charge, pushed Erlich aside, assumed Erlich was the asshole as he usually is, and it backfired.

That's how TV works. They made us think one thing, side with one character, and is it turned out we were slightly duped, and have to wonder if things would have turned out better if he hadn't chosen the wrong side.

The IP thing happened before pied piper was a company. Long before.

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It was still his baby, his idea, his work, his potential startup. He was still in charge of it, and at the time without even Jared to advise him. And he fucked up. Why? Because he has little to no business sense!

I think Raviga lady would understand that better.

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Really? The emotionless android bitch who doesn't even consider the thoughts, feelings or ideas of Monica?

It's not keeping me in suspense, it has me rolling my eyes. It's starting to become annoying.

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Must be a problem with the show!