The Elder Scrolls Online

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Xaxius

Xaxius

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signati_sl said:
"Those other MMOs that weren't WoW went F2P," doesn't mean anything. ESO is not any one of those games. If that's the best evidence that can be provided to support that prediction, then it's beyond silly at this point.
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Riiiiiight.... because previous history is never a leading indicator of future performance. Never.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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signati_sl said:
You're trying to compare a department store to a convenience store. The fact that they're both retail means nothing.
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Well youre banking on the whole TES crowd jumping in and eating this shit up like Fillet Mignon. Well I think some will, but many of them will be like "WTF is this shit? This is nothing like TES!" I cant even steal shit!"

And to tell you the truth, Star Wars is way fucking bigger than TES will ever be. That shit is BILLIONS of people strong. And yet a shitty game is still a shitty game, no name or badge will save it.
 
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signati_sl

shitlord
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mkopec_sl said:
And to tell you the truth, Star Wars is way fucking bigger than TES will ever be. That shit is BILLIONS of people strong. And yet a shitty game is still a shitty game, no name or badge will save it.
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You are absolutely right, and that's what makes the Star Wars MMO failures such a monstrous disappointment. Potential means squat if it's never realized.

SWG almost found its groove, but too bad they went through years of false advertising and screwing over their playerbase before getting there, otherwise they wouldn't have ended up outdated with a disillusioned fan base. A Star Wars MMO *can* make it. The problem is, developers see the Star Wars name and figure that gives them more freedom to screw up and people will love it anyway because it's Star Wars. ZMO does not operate that way, I can say with the utmost confidence. ZeniMax handled the Fallout franchise with reverence, and from what I've seen they're giving the Elder Scrolls IP the same treatment.

A decent Star Wars MMO will come along when it's developed in secret under the strictest of standards, announced, and then worked on another couple of years. Nothing short of a cathedral even in MMO terms will live up to that name, and meanwhile we've gotten Sims in Space simulator and a plastic playground. It's not that the franchise name means nothing. It's that developers had too much hubris about what it can mean. WoW is a better comparison anyway, since both ESO and WoW build on popular, successful video game franchises. Maybe something about those conditions produce a mentality that makes it less likely the IP will be painted up like a corner harlot and pimped out.

Those who go in expecting Elder Scrolls with MMO features will be disappointed. That too is true. But at this point, considering how immense the fanbase is and how broad the base of people participating in discussion, anybody who goes in expecting that hasn't been a part of the community. There will be plenty of nice people playing who say "Lookie here," and show them what's fun.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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The problem is that this game is not really that good either. At least from what I saw of it. Its mediocre at best. IMO SWTOR was better than this.
 
Xaxius

Xaxius

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mkopec_sl said:
The problem is that this game is not really that good either. At least from what I saw of it. Its mediocre at best. IMO SWTOR was better than this.
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I agree it is a pretty mediocre game. That being said, it's better than SWTOR.
 
Tuco

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signati_sl said:
Maybe something about those conditions produce a mentality that makes it less likely the IP will be painted up like a corner harlot and pimped out.
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If Bethesda and Todd Howard were making TESO this would be true. But the TES franchise is definitely being pimped out in this game and it was apparent from the first bits of information that came out about this game that showed they were keeping TES in name and lore only.
 
mkopec

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Well thats just my opinion. But thats purely based on playing it 1-12 and not even trying the PvP, last weekend beta. So thats all I have to go on.
 
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signati_sl

shitlord
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mkopec_sl said:
The problem is that this game is not really that good either. At least from what I saw of it. Its mediocre at best. IMO SWTOR was better than this.
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You're entitled to your opinion, brother, but that is the vaguest possible subjective statement that you could make. Maybe if you listed the kind of playstyle or content you prefer, then I or somebody else could point out how that approach to MMOs is represented in ESO. If that's not needed then /shrug. It can't please everybody, and we wouldn't want it to! Hell, I'm hoping that Wildstar and EQN both succeed alongside ESO, and then I'm hoping that Blizzard has something brewing up that will take the best of it all and come out of the corner swinging hard.

But thing is, the game doesn't have to please absolutely everybody to remain on a subscription model. 2.5M testers last session. I remember when EQ released sub figures around 200k.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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True, its my opinion. But the sites I go to pretty much say the same thing as this one, mediocre at best, brother. I guess we shall see...
 
Derpa

Derpa

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signati_sl said:
People threw a temper tantrum about everything in the preorders, and then ordered anyway. If you didn't see that then you weren't paying attention at all.
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No I saw them all, but the horse and everything else was only a few people. Try again.

SWTOR went F2P because it's a half ass single player game with MMO tacked on like an afterthought, it was rushed out the door, and their customers were treated like crap. Every concern people had about the game got them banned from the forums and customer support was incompetent. If it wasn't always meant to go F2P then it was simply incompetently designed and managed.

EQ2 went F2P because people expected it to be a prettier EQ and it wasn't, and that only includes the sliver of the EQ playerbase who went to it. EQ itself was still active. You can't have a sequel MMO live while the predecessor is still successful. EQN will do much better, even though it's designed to be F2P. (edit: I have big hopes and dreams for Pantheon, but sadly, not the best faith.)

ESO is not GW2, it's not AO, and it's not DAoC. You'll find commonalities between it and other titles, sure, because every MMO borrows from the legacy of the past. WoW did. Like WoW, ESO builds on that past legacy with its own innovations and style; unlike all of those F2P games listed here.

ESO is designed to be a subscription game building on one of the most successful franchises in the electronic entertainment industry (like WoW). It has an immense following (like WoW), and a body of lore that will ensure that new content storylines can only be messed up if the developers work hard to screw the pooch (like Blizzard didn't do). In PvP only, it does have some DAoC flavor but only if people actually play it that way. They don't have to. Cyrodiil can be played like GW2, DAoC, etc, but it can also be played like ESO.

It's not a MMO flavored Elder Scrolls. It's an Elder Scrolls flavored MMO.

Ultimately, it will go F2P if it's not successful with a subscription model, and judging by the immense number of fansites, guilds, and discussion, the ungodly massive amount of content it has (seriously, there are quests everywhere -- look under that rock. Hey, a quest!), and the variety of playstyles it caters to well, it *will* succeed. The F2P hate is how haters are grasping at straws after the "WoW clone" slander written before anybody even knew anything about the (then pre-alpha) game proved silly. One could write a thesis on the dysfunctional social psychology driving the F2P claims.

"Those other MMOs that weren't WoW went F2P," doesn't mean anything. ESO is not any one of those games. If that's the best evidence that can be provided to support that prediction, then it's beyond silly at this point.
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And now you move into the realm of fanboi
 
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signati_sl

shitlord
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Tuco_sl said:
If Bethesda and Todd Howard were making TESO this would be true. But the TES franchise is definitely being pimped out in this game and it was apparent from the first bits of information that came out about this game that showed they were keeping TES in name and lore only.
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I love Todd Howard's work, but if he ever oversaw a MMO's development then I'd probably predict F2P too. ESO has implemented the Elder Scrolls tradition as best it can be done in a MMO. SWG had better class customization, but people got turned off of that model by SoE's gross mismanagement of it. Short of "pick any skill from any class," this is the best customization I've seen so far in a MMO, and unlike SWG, players have to discover and work for some of the skill lines.

I mentioned stealth in a past post, but I'll say again that the crouchy sneaking is right in line with TES. The storyline is as well. The art departs a little bit, but it naturally will in a MMO (different technical standards). The big factors in this are the things they're playing close to the chest: how to unlock vampires and werewolves, the main story progression, adventure zones, the Dark Brotherhood, and the Thieves Guild. Those will be the things that ultimately determine whether this crossover has worked.

Derpa_sl said:
And now you move into the realm of fanboi
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Derpa derp'd.
 
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Gecko_sl

shitlord
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Tuco_sl said:
If Bethesda and Todd Howard were making TESO this would be true. But the TES franchise is definitely being pimped out in this game and it was apparent from the first bits of information that came out about this game that showed they were keeping TES in name and lore only.
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Red Herring. There are plenty of portions of previous Elder Scrolls game here. It just is designed as an MMO, and not as a single player powerhouse game.

Give me their older lockpicking of chests in TESO over the crap of Skyrim. Many of the NPC interactions are in the same vein. The guild setups are similar. Likewise, the landmarks and feel is very Elder Scrolls.

The game isn't a copy, though, but there are plenty of roots from previous products it is using. I think the problem is there are a lot of rote MMO features. It does feel like an Elder Scrolls game.
 
Cinge

Cinge

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I will say this, this thread brought quite a few new posters that love to just post here and usually only in a positive/pr light.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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YEah I thought it felt Elder Scrolls ish. And i thought the combat system was way better done than any unmodded ES game as well. Only thing that realy botheed me is the entire solo quest thing. It is an mmo after all.
 
Tuco

Tuco

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signati_sl said:
I love Todd Howard's work, but if he ever oversaw a MMO's development then I'd probably predict F2P too. ESO has implemented the Elder Scrolls tradition as best it can be done in a MMO.
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As best as can be done in an MMO trying to copy WoW and SWToR as much as possible with few talented developers or management. A persistent Skyrim multiplayer server with ~1000 people in it would still be an MMO but would be much more fun and long lived.

The saving grace of TESO is the PVP. All the rest is boring and rough.
 
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Gecko_sl

shitlord
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mkopec_sl said:
YEah I thought it felt Elder Scrolls ish. And i thought the combat system was way better done than any unmodded ES game as well.
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There's the biggest failure of this game. The absolute best part of any Elder Scrolls single player game are the mods. However, since 80% or so of Skyrim sales are from consoles, I think they might be going the right direction in marketing this towards that crowd. The trick to me would be allowing some sort of mod setup from the PS4/Xbone crowd....
 
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