The Girls Who Broke Your Heart Thread

Void · Jun 13, 2013

Kirun_sl said:
Yeah, you're making 0 sense. You're essentially saying that he's getting excited over the redhead not showing interest, that her saying "Nah, not interested!", is a turn-on. That shit is for chicks, man.

Others have already tried to clarify, but no, that's not what I'm saying at all. You're misreading for whatever reason. You're equating outright rejection with mystery, and that's not the same thing at all, nor is it what I was talking about in the least. The Ancient used terms that are perfect. "Hard to attain" is a far cry from "just shot your ass down," but that's what you are equating in your reply.

Most of us will move on after getting shot down, but the girl you aren't quite sure about yet, that's the one that typically excites you a bit more than the one that just throw herself into your lap.

The Ancient_sl · Jun 13, 2013

Vvoid_sl said:
ost of us will move on after getting shot down, but the girl you aren't quite sure about yet, that's the one that typically excites you a bit more than theone that just throw herself into your lap.

Quite literally.

Void · Jun 13, 2013

Eomer posted while I was posting, so in response to that, I'd say that's almost always the true test of a relationship that is otherwise doing great. Money is, I believe (internet statistician here), the single largest factor that couples fight about.

I don't know that I can actually tell you what to do, as I've obviously failed at it myself (I'm single myself, never married), but from my experience and the experience I've garnered from watching others all these (many) years, is that it often hinges on two things. First, on how each person views money and finances itself, such as, "This is my money and I'm going to do whatever I want with it no matter how much we share everything else," or "We're a couple, we should share everything" and every position in between. That's something you'll hopefully be able to determine on your own and factor into your decision. If she's the type that never wants to share, there's really not a lot you can do, but moving on I have to assume that she's at least somewhat open to one day mingling your finances.

The other thing is that many people (girls in particular, but men sometimes too) equate the blending of finances with the level of the relationship. In other words, if you start paying for everything, that is a particular level, and to actually start paying off her bills, well that's practically marriage level to some people. So when you consider bringing this up, remember that it might equate to taking the relationship to another level than what it is currently at in her eyes. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, or that she isn't ready for it, but just consider it in the decision-making process. Seven months might be plenty of time for her, but from the way you describe her I'd guess that it is probably a bit soon to be bringing up paying off her bills (marriage level). Even if that doesn't freak her out, it often makes women feel like now you have something to hold over them, even if that wasn't your intention at all.

Of course, if you do sort of feel like you want to take it to the next step (which doesn't have to be marriage obviously, but might just be paying more than half), and you think she's ready for that, that would be the easiest way to approach it. Either way though, since you say she's pretty level-headed, just tell her a female-sanitized version of what you told us. Tell her that you know she's got her own life going on and she's handling it, but you like/love/whatever her and you are willing to be a part of that if she'll let you. Tell her it isn't a demand or something with an expiration date, but if she ever wants to let you into that part of her life, you would be overjoyed. Don't couch it in terms of paying, money, etc. And don't make it sound like you can't do all the fun stuff you want to because she won't let you pay. Just tell her that you think that's the next place you see the relationship going, and you're ready for it whenever she is. Keeping it in terms of the relationship, and NOT finances, seems to work most often I've found. It is a lot harder for a (non-gold-digging-whore) to say yes to you making her car payment for her than it is for her to say yes to "taking the relationship to the next level"...and then you making her car payment for her just the same.

All of this presupposes the idea that you are ready for that next step, but it sounds like you are because I don't think you'd be asking this question otherwise. Assuming that you think she is too, that is how I would approach it at least. I might be completely wrong of course, but that's what I'd do.

Seananigans · Jun 13, 2013

I must be weird then, because when the occasional girl comes strong onto ME, it really gets me going. I definitely enjoy the chance to not do all that work for a change.

Kirun · Jun 13, 2013

Eomer_sl said:
Stuff

Vvoid has a good approach. Just be careful, because women like topretendthat they don't want you paying their way/taking care of them, but they are full of shit, most of the time. All women want is security, once they feel that they've found their "mate". Finances play a large part in that sense of security. If you're willing to take it to the next level, that's fine. However, be wary that she may be getting complacent and is looking to hitch her wagon to your obviously large bank account.

Phazael · Jun 13, 2013

Until you are at the "lets move in" point, footing the bill for dates and entertainment is fine and all you should be paying for. You can write that off as being an old fashioned guy and no one's ego gets bruised. Don't lend out money at any point, unless you are headed down the engagement path. Even if you are not holding it over her head, she will feel that way and you will at times feel like you are paying for companionship. Basically, money fucks things up so don't let it enter the picture until you are looking to get a lot more serious.

Eomer · Jun 13, 2013

Thanks Vvoid, that was a great post. Others as well. Yeah, that's about what I figured. The only real issue with this relationship is that there's never been much talk about what we're doing or where it's going. Which is about 95% a good thing, in my opinion, it's always felt quite natural. Even when we'd been dating for a few weeks there was never any discussion if we were a couple or whatever else, we just were. But there's that 5% of ambiguity. I'm not really sure what she's looking for long term, and quite honestly I'm not sure if I know what I'm after either. So perhaps it's time to have a bit of that conversation. The "L-word" has not come out of either of our mouths yet, if that means anything.

As far as what my opinion is on finances in married couples, personally I think it's fucked when couples keep their finances completely separate to the point of each having to pay for vacations out of their own pockets and one "lending" the other money to go (I knew a couple that actually had this kind of arrangement). If you're married you should be sharing everything, unless one person is a complete fucking basketcase who can't manage their spending habits. In which case, don't marry that person in the first place. Prior to marriage yeah, shit's separate, but moving towards shared finances.

Kirun_sl said:
Vvoid has a good approach. Just be careful, because women like to pretend that they don't want you paying their way/taking care of them, but they are full of shit, most of the time. All women want is security, once they feel that they've found their "mate". Finances play a large part in that sense of security. If you're willing to take it to the next level, that's fine. However, be wary that she may be getting complacent and is looking to hitch her wagon to your obviously large bank account.

Yeah, I don't really get that feeling with this chick. She just wants to be a psychology research geek, that's all she's after and I can't provide that for her.

taebin · Jun 13, 2013

You never asked if she'd be down to watch some lesbian porn?

Void · Jun 13, 2013

Eomer_sl said:
Thanks Vvoid, that was a great post. Others as well. Yeah, that's about what I figured. The only real issue with this relationship is that there's never been much talk about what we're doing or where it's going. Which is about 95% a good thing, in my opinion, it's always felt quite natural. Even when we'd been dating for a few weeks there was never any discussion if we were a couple or whatever else, we just were. But there's that 5% of ambiguity. I'm not really sure what she's looking for long term, and quite honestly I'm not sure if I know what I'm after either. So perhaps it's time to have a bit of that conversation. The "L-word" has not come out of either of our mouths yet, if that means anything.

Yeah, probably WAY too early to be talking much about finances if the L word hasn't come up. I think a conversation about where you're headed is probably warranted like you said, but again that's something only you can gauge.

As far as what my opinion is on finances in married couples, personally I think it's fucked when couples keep their finances completely separate to the point of each having to pay for vacations out of their own pockets and one "lending" the other money to go (I knew a couple that actually had this kind of arrangement). If you're married you should be sharing everything, unless one person is a complete fucking basketcase who can't manage their spending habits. In which case, don't marry that person in the first place. Prior to marriage yeah, shit's separate, but moving towards shared finances.

I am 100% with you on that opinion, but far too many of the people I know (friends and coworkers) seem to feel differently. That just seems like a recipe for disaster to me if you can't eventually blend your finances, because who knows what else you can't blend then?

Kirun · Jun 13, 2013

Eomer_sl said:
She just wants to be a psychology research geek, that's all she's after and I can't provide that for her.

Huh? I'm confused by this statement. She just wants to sit around and take psyche courses? A career student is fine, if you're willing to put up with a constant cost that has no end-game.

Phazael · Jun 13, 2013

Depends on how traditionalist you are and if you are a one and done kind of person. My upbringing has programmed me to assume my first marriage will be my last and that unfettered trust is the foundation of all long term relationships, so aside from keeping separate bank accounts for personal bullshit, my wife and I pool resources. People who are on their second marriage or are otherwise around a lot of transient relationships are less likely to trust (or marry for frivolous reasons) and it makes more sense for them to treat their spouse like a roommate, with regards to finances.

Eomer · Jun 13, 2013

Kirun_sl said:
Huh? I'm confused by this statement. She just wants to sit around and take psyche courses? A career student is fine, if you're willing to put up with a constant cost that has no end-game.

No, she had wanted to do clinical psychology, specifically research. So while it's probably not a high paying field, it was a career. She didn't get in to the programs she applied for, which is for the best because that would have meant she'd be leaving town (none were local). She's been trying to decide what she wants to do next as a masters since then, and hasn't made any final decisions. The application process doesn't start till the fall as far as I understand it.

I was merely saying that she has little or not interest in money or material possessions. She has other goals that don't necessarily only have price tags on them.

Dabamf_sl · Jun 14, 2013

It sounds to me like everything is going as it should. You want to pay for more stuff because you can and want to help her out, she resists because she's a good person and doesn't like to be a mooch. That's how it should be and there shouldn't be some pooling of resources until you get more serious.

It's kind of weird to me you guys haven't dropped the L bomb yet in 7 months. Maybe that's not unusual, but it seems so to me. This is more a personal curiosity, but do you sense that she is actively stopping you guys from progressing into deeper commitment, or have things just gone naturally to this point? If it were me, I'd be reluctant to commit too much to a relationship until that future is more certain. Not saying that's the case here, just curious.

Ronaan · Jun 14, 2013

Eomer,

I think it's time you find out if your future timelines align. Find out what she wants from life (and while you're at it, find out what you want from life, too). Kids, pets, house with a white fence around the garden, travel destinations, hiking holidays, all that.
Seven months sounds serious enough, might as well see if she's the one.

Palum · Jun 14, 2013

Seananigans_sl said:
I must be weird then, because when the occasional girl comes strong onto ME, it really gets me going. I definitely enjoy the chance to not do all that work for a change.

Yea, but there's a huge difference between a chick with a complex personality who knows what she wants (great) and the one who says "I love you, let's have dinner at my parents house tomorrow." on the first date (ffffffffff).

Brad2770 · Jun 14, 2013

Dabamf_sl said:
's kind of weird to me you guys haven't dropped the L bomb yet in 7 months. Maybe that's not unusual, but it seems so to me.

That is a perfect siruation and one I hope to find. God I hate using that word.

Ronaan_sl said:
Eomer,

I think it's time you find out if your future timelines align. Find out what she wants from life (and while you're at it, find out what you want from life, too). Kids, pets, house with a white fence around the garden, travel destinations, hiking holidays, all that.
Seven months sounds serious enough, might as well see if she's the one.

7 months? Are you nuts? You need much longer than that. Eomer, youre doing fine and youre in a wonderful situation.

Antarius · Jun 14, 2013

Brad2770_sl said:
That is a perfect siruation and one I hope to find. God I hate using that word.

7 months? Are you nuts? You need much longer than that. Eomer, youre doing fine and youre in a wonderful situation.

Definitely disagree, should start finding out stuff like that early on, see if you're going to be compatible long-term, before you get too invested...my relationship is going well, but I told her I loved her after only about 3 months, which is probably quicker than most.

For me: I've got a ps3 at her place, a drawer of clothes, and a few bathroom things, I'm at her place 3 days a week. Things are going pretty good. She's was initially not very adventurous in bed, but over time has started to do more with me. My only major concern is that it feels like she doesn't have a really strong personality of her own, 90% of the time we do what I want to do, and she is loathe to express opinions unless I really prod her.

taebin · Jun 14, 2013

Antarius_sl said:
feels like she doesn't have a really strong personality of her own, 90% of the time we do what I want to do, and she is loathe to express opinions unless I really prod her.

I think that's the majority of women. Or the other side of that is polar opposite and they have an opinion on every single little thing and if you don't agree with it they are going to try and convince you why they are right and you are wrong. Being gay would be great except the whole dick thing.

Wrathcaster · Jun 14, 2013

Eomer_sl said:
Gents, this thread has been awfully quiet the past while, I'm sure due in no small part to my absence. While I am not making a triumphant return to singledom, I am looking for a bit of advice with the lady friend. Everything's pretty awesome with this girl overall. She's hot, smart, completely sane, and seems to think I'm pretty great as well. She even seems to genuinely laugh at my awful jokes, and actually gets that I'm being sarcastic most of the time (a lot of girls don't know how to take me and get offended). I can honestly say that in the 7 months we've been dating we have not had a single fight, and barely even had a disagreement. No passive aggressive, "everything's fine" when it's not fine bullshit. It's really quite refreshing to be in a relationship that honestly requires almost no effort on either of our parts to make work.

What I'm looking for advice on is on financial issues. I do okay for myself and don't really sweat the small stuff in terms of going out to eat, buying clothes or recreational equipment, and so on. She on the other hand is between careers at the moment, with a BA in psychology, intending on going back to get a master's of some sort in a year. When I first met her she was waitressing full time and doing a bit of research work at the University. Both of us were getting a bit sick of not seeing each other much, so after she got word that she didn't get in to the master's program she'd wanted to she started applying for jobs in her field, but with only a BA it's been tough for her to get much. Right now she's taking on shifts as an aide for kids with autism. As far as I understand it, she goes to people's houses and works on various skills and exercises with the kids. But she's only doing that 10-15 hours a week, it hardly pays ($15-17 an hour I think?), and it prevents her from working at her restaurant most week nights. So she's only working 15-20 hours a week at restaurant, mostly Fri-Sun. On top of that we're trying to get out on the weekends to do a lot of camping and hiking etc in preparation for hiking the West Coast Trail in August (that will be the true test of the relationship!). She probably makes the majority of her money Fri-Sun, so that's hurting her too.

So while I've never really discussed money with her, I'm pretty sure she's near flat broke. She's got student loans, not sure if she has CC debt. Owns a beat up car, but it seems reliable and decent on gas. Her parents have done okay, but are small town middle class types, so I'm not sure if she gets any help from them. When we go out for eats or whatever I pay as often as she'll let me. Initially she insisted on paying probably near half the time. More recently she's being less insistent on paying, which is fine by me, because she can't afford to. I've told her so long as she picks up some groceries and cooks a good meal once or twice a week, I consider us even if we go out for dinner or brunch a couple times a week, and she seems happy with that because she likes cooking.

So at what point does a money conversation happen? I mean, she's not going to accept me giving her money to pay off CC debt or something if she a lot of it. But even just a conversation that "hey, I want to do stuff like go out to eat or go away for a couple days, and I don't mind paying your way" without offending her? The couple times I've paid for shit for her (a $200 camping sleeping mat that weighs nothing yet is incredibly warm, and a flight to Seattle for some psychology conference) she's actively resisted me doing so. So do we just keep doing what we're doing? Or at some point do we need to talk about it? I honestly don't think she has the slightest idea on how much or little money I have/make; she really doesn't give a shit about that kind of thing insofar as you need some of it to do things. When I mentioned how many cars my brother keeps at our office (5, at last count), she was outright disgusted by it for example.

tldr: me rich, girl poor but not a gold digger in the slightest, at what point do we talk about me helping her out a bit?

Just let her know you just like helping out, that you know she's not trying to use you for money, and that you know she doesn't rely on you for cash she doesn't have. Let her know that you really respect her for doing what she can to deal with her current plight and that it's truly admirable that she is doing it on her own, and that you're tremendously impressed that she doesn't even want help. Try not to make it seem like you're patronizing, but that you're just empathizing with someone you care for and respect.

You don't need to have a conversation with her that goes "Hey, I'll pay for your stuff, don't worry about it. You don't need to worry about that, I'm going to do it anyway." I'm sure you know it but that will just make her feel shitty and like a child that is being supported by someone just because she's dating him.

I was in this situation before I was crippled by student loans of my own and I had a decent amount of funds to put into my relationship. I did what you did, paid for nice dinner, bought drinks etc, bought her small gifts from time to time or would just get her a shirt or skirt or whatever as long as it wasn't ridiculously expensive. Main way I got mine to quit fighting me on the dinner issue is going somewhere semi-expensive, ordering something semi-expensive for myself and ordering a semi-expensive appetizer, as well as getting a drink. When they tried to get me to let them pay all the time, I'd just tell them that it was my insistence on going to this place and ordering a bunch of great food, so they shouldn't have to pay for my giant steak and beers and whatever they got. Did that a few times over a period of weeks, maybe once or twice on weekends, and eventually it just becomes common practice.

Start small, work your way up, and whatever you want to help them on, do it in a way that doesn't immediately seem like you're just throwing money at them. I know it sounds manipulative, and I guess it is, but if you really just want to help someone out rather than buy them off, I feel like the strategy is decent enough.

If she gets in a really tight spot that she genuinely needs help on (car breaks down, huge medical bill, lay-off, etc) then you just have to insist and give her the money, and tell her that you're not going to accept it back. If she tells you she'll pay you back, just tell her it's okay and if she wants to, she can on her own terms because you know how hard it is for her. Remember, the central theme is that you're just trying to help someone you care about because you understand the situation, and you also understand the mindset of not wanting to rely on others or compromise a good relationship because of financial matters.

It can be difficult but possible, and she sounds like a nice enough person that in the end she'll not duke it out with you tooth and nail once she gets that you're not buying her, but helping her.

Hoss · Jun 14, 2013

Tell her being a sugar daddy makes you hard and ask her to start calling you papi or poppy

The Girls Who Broke Your Heart Thread

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